Clutch Issue Help

[the cueball]

I'm about to take apart the clutch and start all over again, so thought it would be a good idea to ask the collective to see what I'm missing..

I've got a wee (boxeye) Fazer that I've had for years and done a lot of work on.

Another one popped up local to me with a 'clutch' issue and was a non starter, so was going cheap.. I thought I'll have a go and sort/flip it.

Got the bike home, pulled the clutch cover and the basket and pressure plate were cracked.. the springs in there was the wrong ones - too long.

Thought I had won a watch.. got new springs, 2nd hand basket and plate. Job done.

Now when I start the bike and go to change into first.. it cuts off with a lurch..a proper bang.

There is zero biting point - lever is right at the bars.

I have adjusted (to correct spec as per workshop manual) the clutch cable at both ends - bars and engine.

If I try to start the bike in 1st already.. it lurches forward as it's trying to start, lever right at the bar.

I've checked the side stand switch and that is fine.. not sure that would cause the biting point and lurching anyway... but double checked.

The schematic diagram has been printed out showing every part, and I have the service manual to double, double check specs so I am going to take the whole assemble apart and check/start again.....

Anyone got any idea of what could be the cause?


TLDR: Cheap bike is cheap for a reason..

[airsafari87]

It’s sounds daft, and you probably already have but …

Has it got the correct oil in it?

I had a similar issue with my old SV. Nothing more than an oil change to a different grade that was already in there cured it.

[Onelastattempt]

The second hand clutch plates, are you sure they are all flat and assembled in the correct order ? Have you lubricated it ?
Also the clutch actuating rod on some Fazers is in 2 pieces, with a small ball bearing in between, is the ball bearing there ?

[FSEngineer]

Daft question, but has it got too many plates in it? Are the plates stuck together? Are the new parts definitely the right ones? Is there an extra spacer somewhere? Sounds to me like the clutch just isn't disengaging at all...

[the cueball]

Correct oil, changed over as part of a service by me.

Haven’t looked at the clutch plates, just stuck the ones that were there back in..

I know, I know…. As I say, saw the cracked bits and decided that was everything wrong!

Got new clutch plates on order.

Noticed the ball bearing on the print out so will check that.

Cheers…

[the cueball]

Sooo… took the clutch back out as below.

Everything is there and in spec according to the manual.

I noticed that the friction plates may have been out of sequence, so double double checked that going back together.

Took my other Fazer apart to double check things too.

All good, all went back ok with no parts left over…

Now I can select 1st and let the clutch out completely and nothing happens! No drive at all… doesn’t seem to actually be shifting into any gear anymore…

So I can have the engine running, clutch in and select ‘1st gear’ and let the clutch out complete and still free wheel the bike… so gear selected/drive.

Edited by the cueball on Saturday 21st October 16:43

[Onelastattempt]

If you put it in first gear without the engine running, clutch fully out at handlebars, can you still rotate the back wheel freely ?
If the clutch is all assembled correctly, can you see if the actuator rod is actually moving the plates when you pull the lever ?
I know it would be a pain in the arse but could you put the clutch from your working Fazer into the non working one, and vice versa, then see if the problem is replicated.

[the cueball]

Onelastattempt said:

If you put it in first gear without the engine running, clutch fully out at handlebars, can you still rotate the back wheel freely ?
If the clutch is all assembled correctly, can you see if the actuator rod is actually moving the plates when you pull the lever ?
I know it would be a pain in the arse but could you put the clutch from your working Fazer into the non working one, and vice versa, then see if the problem is replicated.

Yeah, engine on in first gear and clutch out and the wheel just turns like it’s still in neutral.

When I was checking everything out, I could pull the clutch lever in and see the clutch pressure plate move slightly.

I checked the rod was ok, same length and same position as the working bike.

I can see me swapping all the clutch over as you’ve said.. no idea what is going on.

The only thing I’m clinging on to is that I rode the bike home from the mot, so I know the gearbox etc works fine…

[Krikkit]

So odd!

[OutInTheShed]

If there is no drive, either the plates are not pushed together, or possible the clutch centre is spinning on the gearbox shaft.
Does the clutch centre go around with the outer basket when the lever is released, and unlock from it when the lever is pulled in?

In the manual, there should be a figure for how much the pressure plate is supposed to move when the lever is pulled in, I'd expect about 2mm, but I'm more used to Ducati dry clutches.

Be sure you understand the basics of how it works.
The springs force the plates together.
Pulling the lever in pushes the pressure plate against the springs, unloading the plates.

On a wet clutch, the plates can 'gum' together with oil and the clutch won't release. Happens with bike not used. Nothing physically wrong, just need to break the 'suction' between the plates.
If the clutch is not gripping, then either it's spinning on the shaft or something is jammed so the spring force doesn't push plates together.
If it won't release, either the lever isn't moving the pressure plate, or something is jammed, or the plates are too warped.

A knackered gearbox bearing might mean the whole shaft moves instead of just the pressure plate.

I hate trying to guess what's going on over the interweb! Sometimes!