BMW F900 XR TE / Tiger 660 Sport / Other?
Discussion
Hi all,
Have been looking for a good while to replace my commuting workhorse, a TDM 900. I go through the same process every few years as I rack up plenty of miles on my 100 mile round trip commute (daily).
I've struggled to find anything that's as capable, cheap, reliable and economical as the TDM, but as I'm doing far fewer days in the office these days, something a bit mor fun appeals.
So I find myself drawn to the BMW. I think it looks great, is a parallel twin which I love as I spend about half the commute time filtering in very dense traffic, but looks to be more capable/fun for A/B roads.
Tank range is a big issue for me as I can't stand having to fill up more than every other day (TDM does 200+ miles easily). The amount of tech puts me off somewhat as inevitably it goes wrong and historically I've serviced/maintained all my own bikes - but with this sort of thing I expect dealer servicing will be required, at least until warranty is up.
Anyone owned one, have experience or can proffer alternatives?
I've looked at the Tracer several times, but desite being a big Yam fan, struggling to feel the love for it. I had a Tiger 1050 when they were first launched, so had another look at them, but the styling appears to have become horribly bloated compared to the original. The 1200/900 Tiger has zero appeal, the Sport 660 looks far closer to the original, but may be a bit 'wheezy' for me - torque is especially important in town and the 660 only has 64NM (TDM 81 for a fiar difference) 17L tank vs the TDM's 20L too- so range may be an issue despite smaller capacity?
Thanks for input
Have been looking for a good while to replace my commuting workhorse, a TDM 900. I go through the same process every few years as I rack up plenty of miles on my 100 mile round trip commute (daily).
I've struggled to find anything that's as capable, cheap, reliable and economical as the TDM, but as I'm doing far fewer days in the office these days, something a bit mor fun appeals.
So I find myself drawn to the BMW. I think it looks great, is a parallel twin which I love as I spend about half the commute time filtering in very dense traffic, but looks to be more capable/fun for A/B roads.
Tank range is a big issue for me as I can't stand having to fill up more than every other day (TDM does 200+ miles easily). The amount of tech puts me off somewhat as inevitably it goes wrong and historically I've serviced/maintained all my own bikes - but with this sort of thing I expect dealer servicing will be required, at least until warranty is up.
Anyone owned one, have experience or can proffer alternatives?
I've looked at the Tracer several times, but desite being a big Yam fan, struggling to feel the love for it. I had a Tiger 1050 when they were first launched, so had another look at them, but the styling appears to have become horribly bloated compared to the original. The 1200/900 Tiger has zero appeal, the Sport 660 looks far closer to the original, but may be a bit 'wheezy' for me - torque is especially important in town and the 660 only has 64NM (TDM 81 for a fiar difference) 17L tank vs the TDM's 20L too- so range may be an issue despite smaller capacity?
Thanks for input
I’ve written about my F900XR on here before I think. I had a 2020 and kept it about 6 months.
Good -
Not a bad engine (for a parallel twin). Decent noise, not slow, not too buzzy.
Seat is firm but comfortable, riding position is excellent for commuting or touring.
Hands down the best TFT currently available.
Excellent handling. It isn’t light but it certainly doesn’t feel heavy.
Slim for easy commuting.
Excellent build quality and loads of safety tech.
Great headlights, will easily rival most cars.
Bad -
The filthiest bike I’ve ever owned. I’ve never known a bike that throws dirt, standing water and scum all over itself so badly. Was filthy after every ride.
Not the easiest to service, has a slightly odd dual sump system that invites trouble.
Checking oil level isn’t easy (see above). Run the engine for exactly 7 minutes, on a Friday but only if there’s a full moon and a black cat crossed your path 4 days ago. As you remove the dipstick recite the alphabet backwards and if you’re lucky it might tell you the correct reading.
Very difficult to clean (might not be an issue for you), lots of nooks and crannies that fill full of dirt.
Needs a bashguard as front wheel throws stones onto front of engine.
‘Dynamic’ throttle response is essential. The standard ‘road’ is broken. How BMW got that through testing I’m not sure, but it’s basically nothing for 80% of the throttle then the full whack in the last 20%. Totally unrideable. Coupled with a slightly odd clutch bite point I was stalling regularly like a kid on his CBT. ‘Dynamic’ solves this but you’ll need the ‘Rider Modes Pro’.
Suspension is ok. Not great but ok. Compression overly firm and not supple enough for U.K. roads.
Overall takeaway would be that for me it was good but not great. Try the F850GS (I had mine for three years). Overall a considerably better and well thought out bike.
Good -
Not a bad engine (for a parallel twin). Decent noise, not slow, not too buzzy.
Seat is firm but comfortable, riding position is excellent for commuting or touring.
Hands down the best TFT currently available.
Excellent handling. It isn’t light but it certainly doesn’t feel heavy.
Slim for easy commuting.
Excellent build quality and loads of safety tech.
Great headlights, will easily rival most cars.
Bad -
The filthiest bike I’ve ever owned. I’ve never known a bike that throws dirt, standing water and scum all over itself so badly. Was filthy after every ride.
Not the easiest to service, has a slightly odd dual sump system that invites trouble.
Checking oil level isn’t easy (see above). Run the engine for exactly 7 minutes, on a Friday but only if there’s a full moon and a black cat crossed your path 4 days ago. As you remove the dipstick recite the alphabet backwards and if you’re lucky it might tell you the correct reading.
Very difficult to clean (might not be an issue for you), lots of nooks and crannies that fill full of dirt.
Needs a bashguard as front wheel throws stones onto front of engine.
‘Dynamic’ throttle response is essential. The standard ‘road’ is broken. How BMW got that through testing I’m not sure, but it’s basically nothing for 80% of the throttle then the full whack in the last 20%. Totally unrideable. Coupled with a slightly odd clutch bite point I was stalling regularly like a kid on his CBT. ‘Dynamic’ solves this but you’ll need the ‘Rider Modes Pro’.
Suspension is ok. Not great but ok. Compression overly firm and not supple enough for U.K. roads.
Overall takeaway would be that for me it was good but not great. Try the F850GS (I had mine for three years). Overall a considerably better and well thought out bike.
TT1138 said:
I’ve written about my F900XR on here before I think. I had a 2020 and kept it about 6 months.
Good -
Not a bad engine (for a parallel twin). Decent noise, not slow, not too buzzy.
Seat is firm but comfortable, riding position is excellent for commuting or touring.
Hands down the best TFT currently available.
Excellent handling. It isn’t light but it certainly doesn’t feel heavy.
Slim for easy commuting.
Excellent build quality and loads of safety tech.
Great headlights, will easily rival most cars.
Bad -
The filthiest bike I’ve ever owned. I’ve never known a bike that throws dirt, standing water and scum all over itself so badly. Was filthy after every ride.
Not the easiest to service, has a slightly odd dual sump system that invites trouble.
Checking oil level isn’t easy (see above). Run the engine for exactly 7 minutes, on a Friday but only if there’s a full moon and a black cat crossed your path 4 days ago. As you remove the dipstick recite the alphabet backwards and if you’re lucky it might tell you the correct reading.
Very difficult to clean (might not be an issue for you), lots of nooks and crannies that fill full of dirt.
Needs a bashguard as front wheel throws stones onto front of engine.
‘Dynamic’ throttle response is essential. The standard ‘road’ is broken. How BMW got that through testing I’m not sure, but it’s basically nothing for 80% of the throttle then the full whack in the last 20%. Totally unrideable. Coupled with a slightly odd clutch bite point I was stalling regularly like a kid on his CBT. ‘Dynamic’ solves this but you’ll need the ‘Rider Modes Pro’.
Suspension is ok. Not great but ok. Compression overly firm and not supple enough for U.K. roads.
Overall takeaway would be that for me it was good but not great. Try the F850GS (I had mine for three years). Overall a considerably better and well thought out bike.
Thanks TT - all useful stuff.Good -
Not a bad engine (for a parallel twin). Decent noise, not slow, not too buzzy.
Seat is firm but comfortable, riding position is excellent for commuting or touring.
Hands down the best TFT currently available.
Excellent handling. It isn’t light but it certainly doesn’t feel heavy.
Slim for easy commuting.
Excellent build quality and loads of safety tech.
Great headlights, will easily rival most cars.
Bad -
The filthiest bike I’ve ever owned. I’ve never known a bike that throws dirt, standing water and scum all over itself so badly. Was filthy after every ride.
Not the easiest to service, has a slightly odd dual sump system that invites trouble.
Checking oil level isn’t easy (see above). Run the engine for exactly 7 minutes, on a Friday but only if there’s a full moon and a black cat crossed your path 4 days ago. As you remove the dipstick recite the alphabet backwards and if you’re lucky it might tell you the correct reading.
Very difficult to clean (might not be an issue for you), lots of nooks and crannies that fill full of dirt.
Needs a bashguard as front wheel throws stones onto front of engine.
‘Dynamic’ throttle response is essential. The standard ‘road’ is broken. How BMW got that through testing I’m not sure, but it’s basically nothing for 80% of the throttle then the full whack in the last 20%. Totally unrideable. Coupled with a slightly odd clutch bite point I was stalling regularly like a kid on his CBT. ‘Dynamic’ solves this but you’ll need the ‘Rider Modes Pro’.
Suspension is ok. Not great but ok. Compression overly firm and not supple enough for U.K. roads.
Overall takeaway would be that for me it was good but not great. Try the F850GS (I had mine for three years). Overall a considerably better and well thought out bike.
As it will do a lot of commuting duty (in all weathers), keeping it looking tidy will be a challenge then!
Not mad keen on the F850GS looks wise and only has a 15L tank from the look of it?
This is th problem I keep finding, whilst the TDM had a very lukewarm reception from journos etc. for what it does, it's pretty unbeatable. Just a shame they don't make them anymore (10 years ago in fact!).
Any other recommends welcomed
Don’t let me put you off! Only that of the two I think the GS is much better but that comes with the caveat that it’s a tall bike. Both bikes got about 200 miles to a tank so not an issue. BMW are great with test rides so shouldn’t be an issue to try both.
If I was looking for a pure commuter brand new (thankfully don’t have to ride all year round now) I’d go for the Tiger Sport 660. Relatively cheap, an understressed engine and Michael Neeves rated it very highly.
If I was looking for a pure commuter brand new (thankfully don’t have to ride all year round now) I’d go for the Tiger Sport 660. Relatively cheap, an understressed engine and Michael Neeves rated it very highly.
After testing a few bikes last autumn, including the 1250GS and the Tiger 1200, my nearest BMW dealer persuaded me to take out a F900XR TE.
I enjoyed a couple of hours in the wet on B roads and headed back on motorways.
I had made up my mind to order the bike on my return only to find that BMW don't make it in TE flavour anymore thus no Dynamic mode.
I was offered some secondhand but priced at more than a new TE would have cost.
I'm a person of impulse but I walked away deflated, hoping that BMW would start making the TE again, but they haven't.
BTW, the seat feels hard but it wasn't uncomfortable.
I enjoyed a couple of hours in the wet on B roads and headed back on motorways.
I had made up my mind to order the bike on my return only to find that BMW don't make it in TE flavour anymore thus no Dynamic mode.
I was offered some secondhand but priced at more than a new TE would have cost.
I'm a person of impulse but I walked away deflated, hoping that BMW would start making the TE again, but they haven't.
BTW, the seat feels hard but it wasn't uncomfortable.
croyde said:
After testing a few bikes last autumn, including the 1250GS and the Tiger 1200, my nearest BMW dealer persuaded me to take out a F900XR TE.
I enjoyed a couple of hours in the wet on B roads and headed back on motorways.
I had made up my mind to order the bike on my return only to find that BMW don't make it in TE flavour anymore thus no Dynamic mode.
I was offered some secondhand but priced at more than a new TE would have cost.
I'm a person of impulse but I walked away deflated, hoping that BMW would start making the TE again, but they haven't.
BTW, the seat feels hard but it wasn't uncomfortable.
Thanks - to be honest, I wasn't sure what the TE included, I though it was effectively a 'Touring' edition?I enjoyed a couple of hours in the wet on B roads and headed back on motorways.
I had made up my mind to order the bike on my return only to find that BMW don't make it in TE flavour anymore thus no Dynamic mode.
I was offered some secondhand but priced at more than a new TE would have cost.
I'm a person of impulse but I walked away deflated, hoping that BMW would start making the TE again, but they haven't.
BTW, the seat feels hard but it wasn't uncomfortable.
There are a couple of used ones out there (just missed a well priced one at Motorrad Park Lane).
To TT's earlier point re. getting dirty, the exhaust headers and engine casings looked pretty rough even on a bke with only 670 miles on it! Need a fender extender or something to stop the worst of th cru from the front wheel I guess, but even so?
Need to sort some proper test rides I guess...
From memory the TE had the extra mode, handguards and heated grips. I'm sure I may have missed some other extras.
It had a quickshifter fitted which might have been standard on a TE, but unless a bike is fully automatic (ie my current Vespa 300 ) I personally don't see the point unless you are on a racetrack or a dragstrip
The heated grips were good. The salesman had set them to max and I only had my summer gloves on. Set off and very quickly they were too hot to hold.
Unlike my crappy heated winter gloves.
It had a quickshifter fitted which might have been standard on a TE, but unless a bike is fully automatic (ie my current Vespa 300
) I personally don't see the point unless you are on a racetrack or a dragstrip The heated grips were good. The salesman had set them to max and I only had my summer gloves on. Set off and very quickly they were too hot to hold.
Unlike my crappy heated winter gloves.
The Tiger 660 is a good all round package and a nice bike but the engine is a bit weedy compared to the others on your list, I'd say. I've ridden one and it's nowhere near as fast as the BMW or Tracer.
What don't you like about the Tracer? Have you ridden one or just checked reviews etc? I've got the older MT-09 Tracer and it's a great bike, the engine is the star of the show and the newer ones feature more mod cons than my seven year old unit.
I personally found the BMW to be boring, it's quick enough but the engine didn't stand out in any meaningful way and it had no real character or charm. The rest of the bike was good, though. Very easy to live with, or whatever the reviewers say.
What don't you like about the Tracer? Have you ridden one or just checked reviews etc? I've got the older MT-09 Tracer and it's a great bike, the engine is the star of the show and the newer ones feature more mod cons than my seven year old unit.
I personally found the BMW to be boring, it's quick enough but the engine didn't stand out in any meaningful way and it had no real character or charm. The rest of the bike was good, though. Very easy to live with, or whatever the reviewers say.
2ndclasscitizen said:
Versys 1000? Not a skinny as you might want for filtering but would hit your other criteria.
Came here to say this but you shouldnt have an issue filtering it. People seem to be keener to get out the way! There was a dude on bikechatforums who ran one for over 100k with not much more than general servicing.i commuted into London daily on the tiger 660, is a funny one, it likes to be revved and i use to get better MPG when shifting higher the rev range but one thing made me hate that thing.........getting it into Neutral.... what a nightmare!!!! made me hate that bike.
disclaimer- i could have had a bad one and not saying they are all like that but worth checking.
disclaimer- i could have had a bad one and not saying they are all like that but worth checking.
Daniel T said:
i commuted into London daily on the tiger 660, is a funny one, it likes to be revved and i use to get better MPG when shifting higher the rev range but one thing made me hate that thing.........getting it into Neutral.... what a nightmare!!!! made me hate that bike.
disclaimer- i could have had a bad one and not saying they are all like that but worth checking.
Must be a Triumph thing, I tried out a brand new out then Trident when I was shopping for a new commuter the other year. Nice bike but do you think I could find Neutral? not a chance, it was actually worse than my MG V7 which is agricultural at best. Ended up with yet another SV650,disclaimer- i could have had a bad one and not saying they are all like that but worth checking.
Tenere 700 ?
Lovely torquey engine, and fairly frugal. I reckon on getting between 200 and 220 miles between fill ups (Although the reserve starts flashing when you've got at least a 1/3 of a tank still left)
I also like the high seating position in town (Seat height only a problem if your shorter than 5'10" I would say)
In my opinion it's at it's best on A roads, but is also perfectly capable on dual carriage way / motorway for short periods.
Lovely torquey engine, and fairly frugal. I reckon on getting between 200 and 220 miles between fill ups (Although the reserve starts flashing when you've got at least a 1/3 of a tank still left)
I also like the high seating position in town (Seat height only a problem if your shorter than 5'10" I would say)
In my opinion it's at it's best on A roads, but is also perfectly capable on dual carriage way / motorway for short periods.
Axionknight said:
The Tiger 660 is a good all round package and a nice bike but the engine is a bit weedy compared to the others on your list, I'd say. I've ridden one and it's nowhere near as fast as the BMW or Tracer.
What don't you like about the Tracer? Have you ridden one or just checked reviews etc? I've got the older MT-09 Tracer and it's a great bike, the engine is the star of the show and the newer ones feature more mod cons than my seven year old unit.
I personally found the BMW to be boring, it's quick enough but the engine didn't stand out in any meaningful way and it had no real character or charm. The rest of the bike was good, though. Very easy to live with, or whatever the reviewers say.
Thanks all for some great replies What don't you like about the Tracer? Have you ridden one or just checked reviews etc? I've got the older MT-09 Tracer and it's a great bike, the engine is the star of the show and the newer ones feature more mod cons than my seven year old unit.
I personally found the BMW to be boring, it's quick enough but the engine didn't stand out in any meaningful way and it had no real character or charm. The rest of the bike was good, though. Very easy to live with, or whatever the reviewers say.
Lots to consider...Re. the Triumpg, the engine is a concern, though I think the styling is great. Anything that doesn't feel as torquey/strong as my 900 will inevitably disappoint. Commute is a mix of about 30% A roads, 50% duel carriageway/motorway, 20% filtering (that's distance, not time!).
No, not ridden the Tracer and it is (I believe) the narutal replacement for the TDM. However, I do love my parallel twins, especially narrow ones as I spend a lot of time filtering. Need to do some reading and research in this respect, though I know quite a few owners on the Carpe TDM forum switched to them, with many then switching back?
Edited by Stig on Wednesday 22 March 10:17
2ndclasscitizen said:
Versys 1000? Not a skinny as you might want for filtering but would hit your other criteria.
I think it's a capable bike, but couldn't live with the styling (bike tart!) 
Same goes for the Vstrom.Prefer a parallel twin to an inline 4. Would consider a triple if narrow enough (I note the Tracer 9 is - specs look good on that)
Edited by Stig on Wednesday 22 March 10:32
crofty1984 said:
Honda NC750x? Designed from scratch as a commuter tool.
Yes, have considered this in the past, but seems completely blandsville (like the Deauville, which is a great commuter).Whilst it's a commuting tool, I still love to ride, to would rather replace with something that I find engaging too.
Daniel T said:
i commuted into London daily on the tiger 660, is a funny one, it likes to be revved and i use to get better MPG when shifting higher the rev range but one thing made me hate that thing.........getting it into Neutral.... what a nightmare!!!! made me hate that bike.
disclaimer- i could have had a bad one and not saying they are all like that but worth checking.
Ah, it seems that this still plagues Triumph then! I had a Daytona T595 and a Tiger 1050, both of which had fairly mediocre gearboxes (the T595 failed completely in fact). I do recall the 1050 being reluctant to go into neutral too, but has been a while since I had it.disclaimer- i could have had a bad one and not saying they are all like that but worth checking.
I guess I use neutral a few times per journey, so would quickly become annoying, especially if it's worse when bike is hot (filtering guarantees this).
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