Ducati 1098/1198 or Aprilia RSV4
Discussion
Afternoon all, I am interested to hear any owner's views/opinions on either a Ducati 1098/1198 or Aprilia RSV4. The Aprilia from what I have read has a small cockpit ( I am 6'1") but the bike is really only going to be used for nice day runs out, so not needing to do big touring miles. I got very close to buying a friend's 1098R a few years ago but I was still racing and needed the funds for the season ahead. He sadly didn't use it so couldn't comment on the riding experience.
So, if anyone can shed light on these bikes, that would be great.
So, if anyone can shed light on these bikes, that would be great.
robinh73 said:
I have to say that the 1098/1198 is just sublime to look at. The 1199 is also tempting but slightly above the budget unless I sell my 1997 Fireblade.
With the fuel tanks and expansion, is this easy to identify? Can it be rectified or is it a new tank?
If the tank is very close to, or touching the steering damper mounting, it's knackered. Best option is an alloy tank. With the fuel tanks and expansion, is this easy to identify? Can it be rectified or is it a new tank?
RSV4 is quicker in the right hands - it is certainly easier to handle/manage when deploying the hp, and probably the finest modern handling bike out there with a sublime chassis and steering (for now). You think it, and you're 'there'. BUT it is a utility. And there will be 'better' versions of it every year. The 1098R, however, is an event to ride and own. It isn't the fastest thing out there anymore, but I don't know if you (or any of us here on PH) could outride what it is capable of doing, or... if it even matters really on either today's roads or at a trackday.
I have a 1098R and done over 15k miles on it over the years all over the UK and Europe - it is just 160kg with 194rwhp and 106lbsft torque - torque that modern superbikes still can't match. The 1098R is violent, noisy, uncompromising, and demands rider skill to ride one fast and well because it is analogue with none of the 6-axis IMUs or anti-fun electronics that modern bikes have. I replaced the original plastic tank with the larger (and lighter) ally tank from the 1198SP/R - you can't tell it is ally until you tap on it. Get it set up and looked after by a Ducati expert (JHP / RPM / MotoRapido) and you have a depreciation-proof full size superbike that is a memorable event every time you ride it.
I have a 1098R and done over 15k miles on it over the years all over the UK and Europe - it is just 160kg with 194rwhp and 106lbsft torque - torque that modern superbikes still can't match. The 1098R is violent, noisy, uncompromising, and demands rider skill to ride one fast and well because it is analogue with none of the 6-axis IMUs or anti-fun electronics that modern bikes have. I replaced the original plastic tank with the larger (and lighter) ally tank from the 1198SP/R - you can't tell it is ally until you tap on it. Get it set up and looked after by a Ducati expert (JHP / RPM / MotoRapido) and you have a depreciation-proof full size superbike that is a memorable event every time you ride it.
spareparts said:
I have a 1098R and done over 15k miles on it over the years all over the UK and Europe - it is just 160kg with 194rwhp and 106lbsft torque - torque that modern superbikes still can't match. The 1098R is violent, noisy, uncompromising, and demands rider skill to ride one fast and well because it is analogue with none of the 6-axis IMUs or anti-fun electronics that modern bikes have. I replaced the original plastic tank with the larger (and lighter) ally tank from the 1198SP/R - you can't tell it is ally until you tap on it. Get it set up and looked after by a Ducati expert (JHP / RPM / MotoRapido) and you have a depreciation-proof full size superbike that is a memorable event every time you ride it.
Nice, but I'd probably have a Panigale R for similar money. blade7 said:
spareparts said:
I have a 1098R and done over 15k miles on it over the years all over the UK and Europe - it is just 160kg with 194rwhp and 106lbsft torque - torque that modern superbikes still can't match. The 1098R is violent, noisy, uncompromising, and demands rider skill to ride one fast and well because it is analogue with none of the 6-axis IMUs or anti-fun electronics that modern bikes have. I replaced the original plastic tank with the larger (and lighter) ally tank from the 1198SP/R - you can't tell it is ally until you tap on it. Get it set up and looked after by a Ducati expert (JHP / RPM / MotoRapido) and you have a depreciation-proof full size superbike that is a memorable event every time you ride it.
Nice, but I'd probably have a Panigale R for similar money. spareparts said:
Pani R (gen 2) was a good bike that never won anything, and I don’t think a Pani was what the OP was asking about.
I don't know if a Panigale V4 has won anything either, but one would probably murder a 1098R. I didn't say the OP should consider a Panigale either, just what I'd buy. blade7 said:
spareparts said:
Pani R (gen 2) was a good bike that never won anything, and I don’t think a Pani was what the OP was asking about.
I don't know if a Panigale V4 has won anything either, but one would probably murder a 1098R. I didn't say the OP should consider a Panigale either, just what I'd buy. rodericb said:
Murder? I can't remember seeing any test to compare the two but I understand they're reasonably different in how they achieve their respective ends. I haven't ridden a Panigale R. I have ridden a 1098R and, engine wise, it made my 999R feel like a pussycat. That said, if I was doovering around in the base model land of 1098/1198 or RSV4 I'd be looking seriously at the RSV4 as they sound like a MotoGP bike and I believe have very quick steering and twitchy handling. Lap times be damned, I'm after fun!
The ergos are also very different between the newer bikes (including RSV4) vs a 1098R. The 1098R is narrower across the bars, and was from an era when high cornerspeed adjustability was a priority. Midbend, cranked over, the 1098R is just fantastic in terms of chassis feel, adjustability, etc. Don’t forget - the 1098R was from when 6-axis electronics simply didn’t exist to keep the bike stable or shiny-side up… that was all down to the rider. In comparison, the RSV4/Pani is all about agility and maximising rider leverage on corner entry, and ensuring stability when laying down the power on exit. The multi-axis ECU/ABS/TC/WC sorts out the stability midbend and modulates power deployment for you to ensure it is metered out and never overwhelms the chassis keeping you shiny side up. Wide handlebars, weight/rider over the front wheel axle increases rider control for late braking heroics and maximising left-right-left agility - the bike is inherently less stable and electronics resolve that.
I prefer to think of the bikes design ethos as the difference between JL99 riding style vs MM93.
blade7 said:
spareparts said:
Pani R (gen 2) was a good bike that never won anything, and I don’t think a Pani was what the OP was asking about.
I don't know if a Panigale V4 has won anything either, but one would probably murder a 1098R. I didn't say the OP should consider a Panigale either, just what I'd buy. Personally, I'd go with the Ducati for the overall package but mainly for the torque.
Many thanks for the replies and useful insights. I have to say that for me, the 1098/1198 is the complete package in terms of looks and power. I would love a 1098R but the budget isn't quite there sadly. I don't plan on tracking the bike as I have done many years of racing (mainly Irish road racing and the TT) and have ticked the boxes there, so really want something that I get as much pleasure from riding on a sunny day as I do in opening the garage doors and seeing it there.
Having tested both when I was considering parting with my MV (bank balance and heart meant I kept the MV), the 10/1198 won it for me, but they are very different machines, especially 1098 / 1098R / 1198. not even considering the RSV-4 APRC.
For me if I could have had any I would have gone with the 1098R, but the bank of wife really didn't like that option. As the R really was a cut above the standard and S models.
The RSV-4 is a much more modern feeling bike and the chassis is fantastic, couple it with the electronics and it is great.
Now, a good few years later and I'd still love to have the 1098 shape in the garage, but space and funds are now at a premium.
For me if I could have had any I would have gone with the 1098R, but the bank of wife really didn't like that option. As the R really was a cut above the standard and S models.
The RSV-4 is a much more modern feeling bike and the chassis is fantastic, couple it with the electronics and it is great.
Now, a good few years later and I'd still love to have the 1098 shape in the garage, but space and funds are now at a premium.
robinh73 said:
Many thanks for the replies and useful insights. I have to say that for me, the 1098/1198 is the complete package in terms of looks and power. I would love a 1098R but the budget isn't quite there sadly. I don't plan on tracking the bike as I have done many years of racing (mainly Irish road racing and the TT) and have ticked the boxes there, so really want something that I get as much pleasure from riding on a sunny day as I do in opening the garage doors and seeing it there.
For regular road riding, and comparing a standard 1098 vs 1198, I would probably pick a red 1098 tbh and upgrade the fork internals. Less power, yes. Less violent, yes. But the smaller motor delivers plenty that you can take advantage of as an ex-racer, and is perhaps the bike with a bigger sweet spot for road riding. If going for an 1198, I would pick a black 1198SP - it has the ally tank as a starter, and is just sublime in black. The latest Panigale V4 SP2 continues the ‘SP’ tradition in black too…spareparts said:
For regular road riding, and comparing a standard 1098 vs 1198, I would probably pick a red 1098 tbh and upgrade the fork internals. Less power, yes. Less violent, yes. But the smaller motor delivers plenty that you can take advantage of as an ex-racer, and is perhaps the bike with a bigger sweet spot for road riding. If going for an 1198, I would pick a black 1198SP - it has the ally tank as a starter, and is just sublime in black. The latest Panigale V4 SP2 continues the ‘SP’ tradition in black too…
Yeah that is sort of the conclusion I am coming to, a well sorted 1098 would be ideal. Yes a 1098R would be the dream bike (as would a Desmosedici!) bur for road stuff I think the base model with suspension tweaks would make sense. It still produces decent power and torque making it fun and useable. I remember back in 2015 I had brand new R1 to race and was running it in on the road. It was if anything too quick really for the road but as a race bike it was superb. So I think that having oodles of power is sometimes not always needed. I also have a 1997 Fireblade which is about 120hp but for the road is just great fun. So smooth and pretty tractable too. spareparts said:
Don’t forget - the 1098R was from when 6-axis electronics simply didn’t exist to keep the bike stable or shiny-side up… that was all down to the rider.
In comparison, the RSV4/Pani is all about agility and maximising rider leverage on corner entry, and ensuring stability when laying down the power on exit. The multi-axis ECU/ABS/TC/WC sorts out the stability midbend and modulates power deployment for you to ensure it is metered out and never overwhelms the chassis keeping you shiny side up. Wide handlebars, weight/rider over the front wheel axle increases rider control for late braking heroics and maximising left-right-left agility - the bike is inherently less stable and electronics resolve that.
With respect, whenever I read posts about electronics doing it all for you, the inference being that somehow a good rider/bike doesn't need them, I have to smile. There's an element of snobbery to it, just like there is on Ducati forums from R model owners. In the 40 years that I've been riding 900/1000cc sports bikes, electronics and tyres have been the 2 biggest advances IMO. I also think the 1*99 Panigale has a better, more reliable engine and gearbox than the 1*98 too.In comparison, the RSV4/Pani is all about agility and maximising rider leverage on corner entry, and ensuring stability when laying down the power on exit. The multi-axis ECU/ABS/TC/WC sorts out the stability midbend and modulates power deployment for you to ensure it is metered out and never overwhelms the chassis keeping you shiny side up. Wide handlebars, weight/rider over the front wheel axle increases rider control for late braking heroics and maximising left-right-left agility - the bike is inherently less stable and electronics resolve that.
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