Triumph Speed Triple Issues - The Prequel
Discussion
Following on from Toxics post , im now in a position , having had my deposit refunded just today, to pass on the experience I had with my 1200 RS , with Triumph Wellingborough and Triumph GB.
On the 1st Sept 2021 I collected my new Speed Triple from Triumph Wellingborough.
3rd Sept 2021- notice what I would call for a new bike considerable rust/corrosion to brake disc rotors from new, dealer thought they could change these under warranty but Triumph rejected the claim, dealer was also unsuccessful in claiming under the goodwill angle either. It appears some bikes come with rusty discs as new, some do not. Eitherway, Triumph wouldnt replace them for cosmetic reasons.
4th Sept 2021- A ride out to the Cotswolds and the first incidence of the engine cutting out , causing the rear wheel to lock up and the bike to kick sideways along with me being thrown over towards the bars at the same time rears its head, this happens twice on this ride out, when changing down between 3rd to 2nd. I put it down to the engine being new and needing bedding in.
8th of September 2021 - approx 400 miles in. I decide to take a trip to Hunstanton to get some more running miles in, as soon as I start the bike at home, the EML is illuminated and "Transmission Fault" is display on the dash, I ride to Triumph Wellingborough and find the bike is also in limp mode and the quickshifter does not work.
Triumph Wellingborough fix the fault in 40mins or so , servo cables require adjustment.
Dealer advises the Malyasian built bikes (Vs the "old" UK models) do take longer to PDI and set up now.
I continue my journey to Hunstanton (approx 220 miles round trip) , during the journey the keyless ignition takes some time to work after filling up , with the bike refusing to "see" the key for perhaps 5 minutes, the engine also cut out entering a junction , again locking the back wheel up and throwing me over the handlebars.
On the way home from Hunstanton, I again visited the dealer to express my unhappiness that the bike on occasion was still cutting out and the issue with the key.
13th Sept 2021- I visit to the Ace Cafe via Aylesbury, Amersham, Chesham etc see's the bike cutting out twice more with it leaving me in a dangerous position entering a roundabout.
I email the dealer again to advise the running in miles had been completed, ask them to complete the first service and apply any map updates as I was close to rejecting the bike as I considered it to be dangerous, I also noted others on the FB page had been experiencing the same issues. Approx 700 miles covered now.
23rd Sept - dealer calls me to confirm bike is ready for collection with updates in place and bike services.
24th September - collect bike from dealer, 60 miles later on a 4 lane roundabout in St Albans near M25 junction, the bike cuts out in the front of the traffic, engine management light is displayed, then it refuses to start, attempt re-start again and it sounds/feels like it only runs on 2 cylinders. I have to push the bike across the face of 4 lanes of heavy traffic to a crossing to await recovery, which takes approximately 4 hours in total.
Dealer later concludes I "over pressurised the fuel rail, panic starting it"..
The dealer collects the bike, drops me home , I realise ive bought a pup and state I wont nothing more to do with the bike and wish to have a refund. As I had owned the bike less than a month and only used it a handful of times, I believed I would be honoured a refund without question.
25th Sept I confirm by email to the dealer I wish for my monies to be returned.
26th September, my brothers brand new Rocket 3 breaks down (a simple electrical issue which was an simple fix but 2 brand new bikes in 2 days breaking down)
27th/28th Sept I was offered a replacement for the bike of a band new model but I again reject this, having lost confidence in this particular model and the brand.
30th Sept the dealer calls to confirm they are "unpicking" the deal and will return my money.
1st October 2021 - dealer calls back to say they have changed their mind, their owners Cambrian Autos have become involved and they are to investigate the faults, which they and BlackHorse finance, conclude on the 3rd of November, there are no longer any faults with the bike, so it must be returned to me.
the dealer tests the bike by riding it down the A14 for a couple of hours, which when I point out doesnt recreate my use going up and down gears blatting around the Cotswolds or into London, informs me he did get off at a couple of roundabouts.
The investigator for BlackHorse does less than 30 miles on the bike.
As in Toxics thread thread, I quote consumer law but Triumph are adamant, my only recourse is to go through the Financial Services Ombudsmen.
With no guarantee this will be successful, I decide to cut my losses, put the bike up for sale at Triumph Wellingborough, for which they wish to charge me £500.
Fast forward to the NEC bike show in December and on the Triumph stand , I ask for the most senior person there and by good co-incidence, it was a gentleman called Carl Copestake, the national aftersales manager.
I speak with Carl the following week, mid December 2021, he again offers me a replacement bike , states I am the only person globally having issues with the bike and underlines the fact triumph cannot offer me a refund.
That day I visit Triumph Wellingborough to see how they where getting on selling the bike, it was covered in all the filth and grime it had picked up from roadtests since end of September, number plate was held on with a ziptie..in short, it wasnt in the pre-prepped A1 sales condition the dealer said it would be prepared to, he'd concluded it wasnt his problem anymore so he had washed his hands of it.
By good fortune, I meet someone over the Xmas break who gives me Nick Bloor, the CEO details.
End of December 2021, I gather information from FB and through owners such as Toxicnerve and Birky here here about the issues they are having with their bikes email Carl and Nick , outlining my experience with the bike, how I consider my bike to be dangerous and the fact it was morally wrong to offer me a refund one day and withdraw it the next.
From what I gather between those on Pistonheads who have had a ST, 4 out of 4 have had issues, one minor, 3 have electrical issues which have led to sale/refund/replacement of the bike.
I pass on Carl Copestakes details to TN which seems to help the process.
Early January, Triumph confirm they are collecting my bike from the dealer and refunding my money, I ask for my repayments back as I had only covered 800miles on the bike and used it maybe 6 times for the first few weeks of September.
That was initially a sticking point but im pleased to say, my repayments are all being paid back as well.
Im realistic, I know anyone can have an issue with a new bike, especially a new model , I was hoping having a later built bike in September I would be on the "Mk2" version! but it wasnt to be.
If you go looking for negative feedback on anything, from a rubber band to a motorbike, you will find it, I was also looking at a KTM Superduke, plenty of people have had bad experiences with those, what particularly stuck out with KTM was the dealernetwork and so it goes on.
However, one issue that is reported time and time over with the new speed triple are electrical issues, power loss, motors cutting out, particular inbetween gears when you are travelling, for some reason, many owners like me have had issues with the motor cutting out downshifting between 3rd and 2nd, which locks the wheel up, if this happened in the wet , especially on a camber, you would be off the bike .
Many have experienced total electrical failure while riding their bikes, for it only to come back on again, engine management lights seem to come on randomly, transmission faults(it would seem related to the quickshifter are frequently mentioned)
many owners are suggesting you carry around a socket so you can disconnect the battery yourself as this unfreezes the ECU so the bike can "see" the ignition key again..
many owners report their dealers are not sure what the fix is, some blame Euro 5 regs.
In my mind, they electrical gremlins are a common to these bikes, you either seem to get a good one or a bad one but Triumph's dealer customer service is not good from my experience.
You may find it easy to get a replacement bike but its taken me from the 25th of September to today for a refund to happen.
On the 1st Sept 2021 I collected my new Speed Triple from Triumph Wellingborough.
3rd Sept 2021- notice what I would call for a new bike considerable rust/corrosion to brake disc rotors from new, dealer thought they could change these under warranty but Triumph rejected the claim, dealer was also unsuccessful in claiming under the goodwill angle either. It appears some bikes come with rusty discs as new, some do not. Eitherway, Triumph wouldnt replace them for cosmetic reasons.
4th Sept 2021- A ride out to the Cotswolds and the first incidence of the engine cutting out , causing the rear wheel to lock up and the bike to kick sideways along with me being thrown over towards the bars at the same time rears its head, this happens twice on this ride out, when changing down between 3rd to 2nd. I put it down to the engine being new and needing bedding in.
8th of September 2021 - approx 400 miles in. I decide to take a trip to Hunstanton to get some more running miles in, as soon as I start the bike at home, the EML is illuminated and "Transmission Fault" is display on the dash, I ride to Triumph Wellingborough and find the bike is also in limp mode and the quickshifter does not work.
Triumph Wellingborough fix the fault in 40mins or so , servo cables require adjustment.
Dealer advises the Malyasian built bikes (Vs the "old" UK models) do take longer to PDI and set up now.
I continue my journey to Hunstanton (approx 220 miles round trip) , during the journey the keyless ignition takes some time to work after filling up , with the bike refusing to "see" the key for perhaps 5 minutes, the engine also cut out entering a junction , again locking the back wheel up and throwing me over the handlebars.
On the way home from Hunstanton, I again visited the dealer to express my unhappiness that the bike on occasion was still cutting out and the issue with the key.
13th Sept 2021- I visit to the Ace Cafe via Aylesbury, Amersham, Chesham etc see's the bike cutting out twice more with it leaving me in a dangerous position entering a roundabout.
I email the dealer again to advise the running in miles had been completed, ask them to complete the first service and apply any map updates as I was close to rejecting the bike as I considered it to be dangerous, I also noted others on the FB page had been experiencing the same issues. Approx 700 miles covered now.
23rd Sept - dealer calls me to confirm bike is ready for collection with updates in place and bike services.
24th September - collect bike from dealer, 60 miles later on a 4 lane roundabout in St Albans near M25 junction, the bike cuts out in the front of the traffic, engine management light is displayed, then it refuses to start, attempt re-start again and it sounds/feels like it only runs on 2 cylinders. I have to push the bike across the face of 4 lanes of heavy traffic to a crossing to await recovery, which takes approximately 4 hours in total.
Dealer later concludes I "over pressurised the fuel rail, panic starting it"..
The dealer collects the bike, drops me home , I realise ive bought a pup and state I wont nothing more to do with the bike and wish to have a refund. As I had owned the bike less than a month and only used it a handful of times, I believed I would be honoured a refund without question.
25th Sept I confirm by email to the dealer I wish for my monies to be returned.
26th September, my brothers brand new Rocket 3 breaks down (a simple electrical issue which was an simple fix but 2 brand new bikes in 2 days breaking down)
27th/28th Sept I was offered a replacement for the bike of a band new model but I again reject this, having lost confidence in this particular model and the brand.
30th Sept the dealer calls to confirm they are "unpicking" the deal and will return my money.
1st October 2021 - dealer calls back to say they have changed their mind, their owners Cambrian Autos have become involved and they are to investigate the faults, which they and BlackHorse finance, conclude on the 3rd of November, there are no longer any faults with the bike, so it must be returned to me.
the dealer tests the bike by riding it down the A14 for a couple of hours, which when I point out doesnt recreate my use going up and down gears blatting around the Cotswolds or into London, informs me he did get off at a couple of roundabouts.
The investigator for BlackHorse does less than 30 miles on the bike.
As in Toxics thread thread, I quote consumer law but Triumph are adamant, my only recourse is to go through the Financial Services Ombudsmen.
With no guarantee this will be successful, I decide to cut my losses, put the bike up for sale at Triumph Wellingborough, for which they wish to charge me £500.
Fast forward to the NEC bike show in December and on the Triumph stand , I ask for the most senior person there and by good co-incidence, it was a gentleman called Carl Copestake, the national aftersales manager.
I speak with Carl the following week, mid December 2021, he again offers me a replacement bike , states I am the only person globally having issues with the bike and underlines the fact triumph cannot offer me a refund.
That day I visit Triumph Wellingborough to see how they where getting on selling the bike, it was covered in all the filth and grime it had picked up from roadtests since end of September, number plate was held on with a ziptie..in short, it wasnt in the pre-prepped A1 sales condition the dealer said it would be prepared to, he'd concluded it wasnt his problem anymore so he had washed his hands of it.
By good fortune, I meet someone over the Xmas break who gives me Nick Bloor, the CEO details.
End of December 2021, I gather information from FB and through owners such as Toxicnerve and Birky here here about the issues they are having with their bikes email Carl and Nick , outlining my experience with the bike, how I consider my bike to be dangerous and the fact it was morally wrong to offer me a refund one day and withdraw it the next.
From what I gather between those on Pistonheads who have had a ST, 4 out of 4 have had issues, one minor, 3 have electrical issues which have led to sale/refund/replacement of the bike.
I pass on Carl Copestakes details to TN which seems to help the process.
Early January, Triumph confirm they are collecting my bike from the dealer and refunding my money, I ask for my repayments back as I had only covered 800miles on the bike and used it maybe 6 times for the first few weeks of September.
That was initially a sticking point but im pleased to say, my repayments are all being paid back as well.
Im realistic, I know anyone can have an issue with a new bike, especially a new model , I was hoping having a later built bike in September I would be on the "Mk2" version! but it wasnt to be.
If you go looking for negative feedback on anything, from a rubber band to a motorbike, you will find it, I was also looking at a KTM Superduke, plenty of people have had bad experiences with those, what particularly stuck out with KTM was the dealernetwork and so it goes on.
However, one issue that is reported time and time over with the new speed triple are electrical issues, power loss, motors cutting out, particular inbetween gears when you are travelling, for some reason, many owners like me have had issues with the motor cutting out downshifting between 3rd and 2nd, which locks the wheel up, if this happened in the wet , especially on a camber, you would be off the bike .
Many have experienced total electrical failure while riding their bikes, for it only to come back on again, engine management lights seem to come on randomly, transmission faults(it would seem related to the quickshifter are frequently mentioned)
many owners are suggesting you carry around a socket so you can disconnect the battery yourself as this unfreezes the ECU so the bike can "see" the ignition key again..
many owners report their dealers are not sure what the fix is, some blame Euro 5 regs.
In my mind, they electrical gremlins are a common to these bikes, you either seem to get a good one or a bad one but Triumph's dealer customer service is not good from my experience.
You may find it easy to get a replacement bike but its taken me from the 25th of September to today for a refund to happen.
Edited by podman on Tuesday 8th February 15:30
Edited by podman on Tuesday 8th February 16:05
Edited by podman on Tuesday 8th February 16:12
These problems, and many others, are by no means limited to Triumph.
I had one of the original 900 Tridents in the early 1990s which was top quality and performed faultlessly. It was manufactured in the UK.
A lot of manufacturers have outsourced production to Asia and other parts of the World (no doubt because of the cheaper labour rates) and quality has suffered as a result.
I am in the market for a new bike and would like one of the latest Harleys but this manufacturer is having a lot of quality problems as well.
I had one of the original 900 Tridents in the early 1990s which was top quality and performed faultlessly. It was manufactured in the UK.
A lot of manufacturers have outsourced production to Asia and other parts of the World (no doubt because of the cheaper labour rates) and quality has suffered as a result.
I am in the market for a new bike and would like one of the latest Harleys but this manufacturer is having a lot of quality problems as well.
3DP said:
Sorry to hear this, but worked out well - what's next?? 
Well Pete, the only other bike that I really put in the same ball park was the SuperDuke R but my local dealer is no longer selling KTM and the next nearest dealer doesnt enjoy the best reputation, nor does the quality of the bike unfortunately.Once bitten, twice shy n all that.
It also really, really peeved me that dealers wanted £500-£850 for features such as a quickshifter which are already on the bike but just require unlocking with a tap on the keyboard.
The Tuono for me wasn't comfortable Vs my old BMW or the Triumph, to sportsbike like..
As i said before, I absolutely loved my S1000R and my local dealer, it was great to ride in any conditions , I used it for work and for fun at the weeks, was a very confident inspiring bike, didn't have the low down umph of the ST or KTM and horny looks but was never lacking in power or handling..I even liked its squinty looks...and my local dealer is superb.
The latest model I just couldnt get my head around, for me, aside from the dash it was a step backwards.
So I went looking for a low mileage S1000R exactly as I had PXd on the Triumph, I bought a 2020 bike with just 600 miles on the clock in a nice San Marino Blue from Cheltenham BMW, was delivered late December. Now in the process of buying all the aftermarket goodies I took off and flogged from my old one!
podman said:
Well Pete, the only other bike that I really put in the same ball park was the SuperDuke R but my local dealer is no longer selling KTM and the next nearest dealer doesnt enjoy the best reputation, nor does the quality of the bike unfortunately.
Once bitten, twice shy n all that.
It also really, really peeved me that dealers wanted £500-£850 for features such as a quickshifter which are already on the bike but just require unlocking with a tap on the keyboard.
The Tuono for me wasn't comfortable Vs my old BMW or the Triumph, to sportsbike like..
As i said before, I absolutely loved my S1000R and my local dealer, it was great to ride in any conditions , I used it for work and for fun at the weeks, was a very confident inspiring bike, didn't have the low down umph of the ST or KTM and horny looks but was never lacking in power or handling..I even liked its squinty looks...and my local dealer is superb.
The latest model I just couldnt get my head around, for me, aside from the dash it was a step backwards.
So I went looking for a low mileage S1000R exactly as I had PXd on the Triumph, I bought a 2020 bike with just 600 miles on the clock in a nice San Marino Blue from Cheltenham BMW, was delivered late December. Now in the process of buying all the aftermarket goodies I took off and flogged from my old one!
Great colour scheme and exhaust - sometimes the stealth, slightly unfashionable option suits best - like my 2015 Blade. Agreed on the new S1000R - not for me either - enjoy and hope it goes better than the speed!Once bitten, twice shy n all that.
It also really, really peeved me that dealers wanted £500-£850 for features such as a quickshifter which are already on the bike but just require unlocking with a tap on the keyboard.
The Tuono for me wasn't comfortable Vs my old BMW or the Triumph, to sportsbike like..
As i said before, I absolutely loved my S1000R and my local dealer, it was great to ride in any conditions , I used it for work and for fun at the weeks, was a very confident inspiring bike, didn't have the low down umph of the ST or KTM and horny looks but was never lacking in power or handling..I even liked its squinty looks...and my local dealer is superb.
The latest model I just couldnt get my head around, for me, aside from the dash it was a step backwards.
So I went looking for a low mileage S1000R exactly as I had PXd on the Triumph, I bought a 2020 bike with just 600 miles on the clock in a nice San Marino Blue from Cheltenham BMW, was delivered late December. Now in the process of buying all the aftermarket goodies I took off and flogged from my old one!
The problem I have with the Triumph is that it's a very capable bike but there are just too many 'phantom' electrical / electronic issues at this stage to have any confidence with it. They are such a pain to diagnose and often require the dealer rather than my socket set, and the dealers (as shown above) really are a mixed back to deal with.
The bike I really want will soon become a weight around my neck when it starts letting me down. I'd take a slightly less capable but dependable bike these days as I hate computer issues with bikes.
The bike I really want will soon become a weight around my neck when it starts letting me down. I'd take a slightly less capable but dependable bike these days as I hate computer issues with bikes.
When I was researching KTM super adventures, which have their fair share of electrical problems, I read quite a few cases where people had uprated to lithium batteries and seen an end to electrical problems including a lot of random error messages, I think the general thinking was all control units were very sensitive to voltage and the lithium batteries were a lot more stable?
I don’t know if there’s any truth in the above but modern electrics do seem quite vulnerable and dangerous from what I’ve read recently.
I don’t know if there’s any truth in the above but modern electrics do seem quite vulnerable and dangerous from what I’ve read recently.
That was a long ordeal but I'm glad, finally, you have this all sorted
The only guy I ride with every week who still has his 1200RS seems to be OK now but no kidding I think its gone back in 5 times for warranty work ranging from overheating on tour (literally steam/water coming out) and thats against my Tuono which are notorious for running hot and mine was fine
Sticky fuel guage, gear shifter return snapped/loose so shifter essentially dropped and got stuck, fuel pipe under tank coming off and dropping a good 12 litres of fuel all over the bike and my mate (and yes we have pics of all this)
Engine management light like toxicnerve came on and something else which I forget - it was the exhaust valve and something to do with the moving and throwing something on the dash
Touch wood his bike seems to be all good now but he is early 60s old school and paid cash. To say he said this has taken the shine off would be putting it mild
The only guy I ride with every week who still has his 1200RS seems to be OK now but no kidding I think its gone back in 5 times for warranty work ranging from overheating on tour (literally steam/water coming out) and thats against my Tuono which are notorious for running hot and mine was fine
Sticky fuel guage, gear shifter return snapped/loose so shifter essentially dropped and got stuck, fuel pipe under tank coming off and dropping a good 12 litres of fuel all over the bike and my mate (and yes we have pics of all this)
Engine management light like toxicnerve came on and something else which I forget - it was the exhaust valve and something to do with the moving and throwing something on the dash
Touch wood his bike seems to be all good now but he is early 60s old school and paid cash. To say he said this has taken the shine off would be putting it mild
You are a patient person and it is quite shocking how some dealers/manufacturers conduct themselves in this day and age.
I like the comment above about the USA and would imagine they would react different there? We need something like that in the UK to prevent occurrences like this.
On a side note one of the guys who I do ride outs with has a 20 plate RS Speed Triple (I've got a 17 plate Speed Triple S) and he has held off getting the 1200 because of reading problems like you and others have had. He's had Speeds for quite a few years now and thinking of getting a Ducati or something else for an easier life.
Glad you got it sorted but some of the hoops you were forced to jump through were totally wrong IMO but glad you got the outcome you needed.
I like the comment above about the USA and would imagine they would react different there? We need something like that in the UK to prevent occurrences like this.
On a side note one of the guys who I do ride outs with has a 20 plate RS Speed Triple (I've got a 17 plate Speed Triple S) and he has held off getting the 1200 because of reading problems like you and others have had. He's had Speeds for quite a few years now and thinking of getting a Ducati or something else for an easier life.
Glad you got it sorted but some of the hoops you were forced to jump through were totally wrong IMO but glad you got the outcome you needed.
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