2015-2022 Yamaha R1 Buying / Owning Advice Required
Discussion
Looking at getting a late model R1 or R1-M after upcoming house move settles down money-wise.
Not ridden one yet & need to organise a test ride.
What I think I know (please correct me where appropriate!).
2CR Model 2015 - 2016, original one with silver engine, Euro 3 emissions / electronics
BX4 Model 2017 - 2019, looks same with black engine, Euro 4 emissions / electronics
B3L Model 2020 - 2022, slightly different top & side fairings??
Budget is £12 to 15k. Will be used for a couple of Euro trackdays a year and a few in the U.K. so 8 ish days on track - 1000 miles or thereabouts and a similar amount on the road so about 2k per year.
What’s the advantages & disadvantages of each model - electronics/ throttle response / reliability / tunability / fault codes / ECU flashing etc. I understand 2015 model has a gearbox recall.
Is it better to get standard model and add sexy suspension or go for the M model with the electronic Ohlins?
I like the look of the 2016 yellow anniversary one but whatever I buy will get a cheapo set of Chinese fairings fitted straightaway so I can replicate that.
Quite a few not yet registered ex-Silverstone Yamaha instructor bikes floating about so might be an option?
Not ridden one yet & need to organise a test ride.
What I think I know (please correct me where appropriate!).
2CR Model 2015 - 2016, original one with silver engine, Euro 3 emissions / electronics
BX4 Model 2017 - 2019, looks same with black engine, Euro 4 emissions / electronics
B3L Model 2020 - 2022, slightly different top & side fairings??
Budget is £12 to 15k. Will be used for a couple of Euro trackdays a year and a few in the U.K. so 8 ish days on track - 1000 miles or thereabouts and a similar amount on the road so about 2k per year.
What’s the advantages & disadvantages of each model - electronics/ throttle response / reliability / tunability / fault codes / ECU flashing etc. I understand 2015 model has a gearbox recall.
Is it better to get standard model and add sexy suspension or go for the M model with the electronic Ohlins?
I like the look of the 2016 yellow anniversary one but whatever I buy will get a cheapo set of Chinese fairings fitted straightaway so I can replicate that.
Quite a few not yet registered ex-Silverstone Yamaha instructor bikes floating about so might be an option?
I had a late 16/early 17 R1 race bike that I did 3 race seasons on and a load of UK/Euro Trackdays (Something like 8k track miles). It had a mid life motor refresh and another one before going to it's new owner, but it was otherwise faultless. It had KIT ECU/Loom so electronics weren't as per standard
I now have a 21 model, which has the new motor design from 20 onwards
Throttle is now electronic, and TC etc is a little more refined (Although previous standard model electronics are still pretty decent)
20+ model motor makes a little more midrange, and Woolich now have a map available for it so you can run all the race tools etc if needed
We have standard R1 and R1M road bikes as our instructor bikes at Silverstone so I've done a million track miles on most R1 models, and the 18 model was a good step up from previous models in the smoothness of the motor and instrusion of electronics, and 20+ model is the same difference improvement again,
Personally, I wouldn't bother with the R1M over the standard R1 as it's quite a lot more money for what you're getting unless you don't like having adjustable suspension with aftermarket stuff and just like the electronic ohlins to do it all for you
The Electronic suspension was a lot better on the 20 onwards model, and I don't remember there being any changes to the Suspension software on the 18 onwards, but I might be wrong
I now have a 21 model, which has the new motor design from 20 onwards
Throttle is now electronic, and TC etc is a little more refined (Although previous standard model electronics are still pretty decent)
20+ model motor makes a little more midrange, and Woolich now have a map available for it so you can run all the race tools etc if needed
We have standard R1 and R1M road bikes as our instructor bikes at Silverstone so I've done a million track miles on most R1 models, and the 18 model was a good step up from previous models in the smoothness of the motor and instrusion of electronics, and 20+ model is the same difference improvement again,
Personally, I wouldn't bother with the R1M over the standard R1 as it's quite a lot more money for what you're getting unless you don't like having adjustable suspension with aftermarket stuff and just like the electronic ohlins to do it all for you
The Electronic suspension was a lot better on the 20 onwards model, and I don't remember there being any changes to the Suspension software on the 18 onwards, but I might be wrong
I've got an early R1M and it's a great bike, the electronically adjustable Ohlins suspension is nice and does work well on the road, is it worth the extra outlay over the standard model?, probably not but on the plus side they retain more value when you want to sell on.
Only real complaint is the snatchy throttle/cutting out in A Mode, other than that great bike, I prefer it to the Panigale V4 that preceeded it.
Only real complaint is the snatchy throttle/cutting out in A Mode, other than that great bike, I prefer it to the Panigale V4 that preceeded it.
Krikkit said:
Dunno how common it is, but the early ones have some cases of snapping the crank, I think it's 16-on they fixed it with some thrust washers.
Just to come back to this, it's any of them with the 2015 2CR1 code which don't have the thrust washers:https://www.fowlersparts.co.uk/parts/5652180/yzf-r...
2016-on 2CRC on do have it (part #10 x2)
https://www.fowlersparts.co.uk/parts/5784488/yzf-r...
I think I’ll be avoiding 2015 models by the sound of it!
In fact the latest one at £14k-ish (standard non M model) seems better value for money - just a few more grand and get something 5 years newer / later tech / better looks / less snatchy maybe.
Test ride first. I take it as read that they’re good on track (chased them often enough) but how rubbish / compromised they are for cruising around on the road is a worry.
Interestingly comment ref the Ducati V4 - that’s one of the other ideas! Don’t think I could cope with the maintenance / spares / crash rebuilds etc . Test rode the latest S model last year and it was lush - should be for £24k!!
In fact the latest one at £14k-ish (standard non M model) seems better value for money - just a few more grand and get something 5 years newer / later tech / better looks / less snatchy maybe.
Test ride first. I take it as read that they’re good on track (chased them often enough) but how rubbish / compromised they are for cruising around on the road is a worry.
Interestingly comment ref the Ducati V4 - that’s one of the other ideas! Don’t think I could cope with the maintenance / spares / crash rebuilds etc . Test rode the latest S model last year and it was lush - should be for £24k!!
moto_traxport said:
I think I’ll be avoiding 2015 models by the sound of it!
In fact the latest one at £14k-ish (standard non M model) seems better value for money - just a few more grand and get something 5 years newer / later tech / better looks / less snatchy maybe.
Test ride first. I take it as read that they’re good on track (chased them often enough) but how rubbish / compromised they are for cruising around on the road is a worry.
Interestingly comment ref the Ducati V4 - that’s one of the other ideas! Don’t think I could cope with the maintenance / spares / crash rebuilds etc . Test rode the latest S model last year and it was lush - should be for £24k!!
I had a 2016 60th anniversary for a year/6000 miles, mostly road miles, for a road bike I always really enjoyed it, the engine is lovely on the road as obviously it’s got the right noise but it’s got some good low down torque, handling I always found nice on the road on stock suspension, and I could ride it all day long in comfort, though the seat is on the stiff side In fact the latest one at £14k-ish (standard non M model) seems better value for money - just a few more grand and get something 5 years newer / later tech / better looks / less snatchy maybe.
Test ride first. I take it as read that they’re good on track (chased them often enough) but how rubbish / compromised they are for cruising around on the road is a worry.
Interestingly comment ref the Ducati V4 - that’s one of the other ideas! Don’t think I could cope with the maintenance / spares / crash rebuilds etc . Test rode the latest S model last year and it was lush - should be for £24k!!
The biggest problem is how easy it is to go banzai on the roads as it’s so easy and confidence inspiring to ride.
What I didn’t like, fuel consumption and rear tyre wear, and that I only found it enjoyable when I was giving it some.
Regarding the new Pani, 44 Teeth did a good review which says its a lot easier to ride than all the previous models.
2022 Ducati Panigale V4S Review
https://youtu.be/i--M-vwv0Zo
Here's another group review from them covering last years models and including the R1 and Pani.
2021 Isle of Man Superbike Shootout | RSV4 v S 1000 RR v Panigale v Fireblade v ZX-10R v GSX-R v R1M
https://youtu.be/hIAR5e3Z4_c
I'd love the Ducati as I've never owned one but the insurance quote was frankly bonkers.
2022 Ducati Panigale V4S Review
https://youtu.be/i--M-vwv0Zo
Here's another group review from them covering last years models and including the R1 and Pani.
2021 Isle of Man Superbike Shootout | RSV4 v S 1000 RR v Panigale v Fireblade v ZX-10R v GSX-R v R1M
https://youtu.be/hIAR5e3Z4_c
I'd love the Ducati as I've never owned one but the insurance quote was frankly bonkers.
LordFlathead said:
Regarding the new Pani, 44 Teeth did a good review which says its a lot easier to ride than all the previous models.
2022 Ducati Panigale V4S Review
https://youtu.be/i--M-vwv0Zo
Here's another group review from them covering last years models and including the R1 and Pani.
2021 Isle of Man Superbike Shootout | RSV4 v S 1000 RR v Panigale v Fireblade v ZX-10R v GSX-R v R1M
https://youtu.be/hIAR5e3Z4_c
Haven’t watched any vlogging magazine type stuff before but I’ve now done both the 2020 & 2021 44teeth versions of this as well as some individual tests. 2022 Ducati Panigale V4S Review
https://youtu.be/i--M-vwv0Zo
Here's another group review from them covering last years models and including the R1 and Pani.
2021 Isle of Man Superbike Shootout | RSV4 v S 1000 RR v Panigale v Fireblade v ZX-10R v GSX-R v R1M
https://youtu.be/hIAR5e3Z4_c
R1 doesn’t come out massively well and raises a few things where more money needs to be spent (ECU reflash / throttle mapping / exhaust / suspension / abs delete / brake calipers / steering damper) which reinforces what I’ve read elsewhere as well. The essence of which is “great bike, just spend another £5k on it and make it awesome on track & still will be mostly rubbish on the road”.
BMW came out well. For £15k low mileage secondhand it appears you can just buy, use & enjoy. Also comes with cruise
and heated grips.RSV4 not going to happen. Does nothing for me and whatever Aprilia you buy it will always be the last ‘bad’ one before they started making the ‘good’ ones.
To be fair, all the latest super bikes are great, you can’t buy a bad one, is the new Panigale V4 incrementally better than the R1?, quite possibly but the R1 is still a brilliant bike.
I’d like to have a go on an updated V4S to see what it’s like, if I ever got another I wouldn’t get the base model again but in honesty I’m thinking about making this my last year on the road (on a sports bike at least) and track converting what I’ve already got.
I’d like to have a go on an updated V4S to see what it’s like, if I ever got another I wouldn’t get the base model again but in honesty I’m thinking about making this my last year on the road (on a sports bike at least) and track converting what I’ve already got.
I’ve got a 2015 standard R1 and love it. Absolutely love the engine note with the factory fit Akrapovic end can.
No engine problems that I know of and it’s serviced each year at Yamaha.
My top-tip: the valve in the exhaust just before the end can - it is supposed to open at c.6,500 rpm and above for emissions reasons. I was told a lot of the bikes from around this year have such a thing as the Euro emissions test is done up to 6000 revs. Whether that’s true or not is another story. When I first bought it I thought it felt lacking in torque low down but then would suddenly surge as it went over c.6500 revs. So I spoke to a reputable bike performance specialist and they removed the cables to the valve, fixed it open, and did a re-map. Instantly felt a lot better and the graphs on the dyno readout showed the curve was higher at the lower revs. Its something I’d investigate doing with any modern bike which might be restricted due to emissions.
No engine problems that I know of and it’s serviced each year at Yamaha.
My top-tip: the valve in the exhaust just before the end can - it is supposed to open at c.6,500 rpm and above for emissions reasons. I was told a lot of the bikes from around this year have such a thing as the Euro emissions test is done up to 6000 revs. Whether that’s true or not is another story. When I first bought it I thought it felt lacking in torque low down but then would suddenly surge as it went over c.6500 revs. So I spoke to a reputable bike performance specialist and they removed the cables to the valve, fixed it open, and did a re-map. Instantly felt a lot better and the graphs on the dyno readout showed the curve was higher at the lower revs. Its something I’d investigate doing with any modern bike which might be restricted due to emissions.
Basically what Graeme Said,
I'd buy as new as you can afford, each year has added small refinements, but for sure 2017 onwards, don't bother with an M, unless you really want one, there's bugger all difference other than the suspension of course and the carbon parts, (M is actually heavier than the stock bike) but if you're planning on tracking it i imagine you'll get some fairings for it anyway.
mods wise, well you can go as balls deeps as you want really, for most it's exhaust, filter and flash, some VO2s and away you go though.
myself personally i'd recommend an exhaust, but bare in mind noise testing, akra with baffle, SC with baffles can squeeze onto 105db days, but for anything over than a noisy day a Donny you'll need something like the PipewerX or MHP Clubman systems, long cans with plenty of baffling, zero loss in power either, in fact most increase the midrange by a fair amount, 6bhp when comparing the PipewerX with the Akra.
get a decent filter, no a huge fan of MWR but i've used K&N race filters without issue in the UK and abroad, get it flashed, i can highly recommend REPS in Caldicot just over the bridge into Wales, JHS, Seton, PCR etc etc, loads about that can do it, most will make between 178-190 after all that, anything more and the dyno is catering to ego, the bike will be transformed after this, especially the throttle connection, which is jerky as standard but smooth after reflash.
Brakes are a common complaint with the 2015 R1s, mainly down to feel and ABS run on, i tried a few things, Brembo GP4RX callipers, RCS Corsa Corta, in the end i dropped back to the OEM callipers with some Z04 pads and kept the RCS, the actual stopping power is fine even stock, just loses a lot of feel with the ABS in place i guess, tbh I've only had the ABS run me on into a corner twice, I'd like to think I'm going at a decent pace in fast groups, certainly for me it isn't an issue that needs addressing straight away if your new to the bike.
Definitely worth investing in some clip ons and rearsets, makes the world of difference on the R1, i went with Valtermoto for rearsets and Extreme Components for clip ons.
I'd grab some CRC/SHEPS etc fairings over some Chinese sets, they tend to melt quite quickly, especially the belly pan at the front.
blingy bits then i guess, we went down the I2M route after working with them a bit, tbh i love the dashes, little tricky to setup and make your own, but great when they are, there's just so much data you can harvest from them, in fact we are planning some online tutorials in the coming weeks into setting up and running the I2M dashes.
P.S.. if the bike is on Paddock stands don't allow the back wheel to spin while the front is stationary, it'll throw up and error that can only be cleared via yamaha or a tech.
To summrise
2017 onwards
Exhaust
filter
Flash
suspension leave stock, plenty of adjustment available.
brakes, Z04 pads and that's all you need for now.
I know in the 44 teeth vids it comes lower down, 5th or 6th if i remember right, but in truth, it's all b
ks, modern day superbikes are all so fast and capable that what it really comes down to is which one you perfer the looks and sound of, for me that is the R1, which i still think is the best of the bunch.
the BMW is fast and extremely capable, but does nothing for me in the looks dept, sounds like a bag of spanners and from the few i've seen on track, tend to not hold up that well.
I'd buy as new as you can afford, each year has added small refinements, but for sure 2017 onwards, don't bother with an M, unless you really want one, there's bugger all difference other than the suspension of course and the carbon parts, (M is actually heavier than the stock bike) but if you're planning on tracking it i imagine you'll get some fairings for it anyway.
mods wise, well you can go as balls deeps as you want really, for most it's exhaust, filter and flash, some VO2s and away you go though.
myself personally i'd recommend an exhaust, but bare in mind noise testing, akra with baffle, SC with baffles can squeeze onto 105db days, but for anything over than a noisy day a Donny you'll need something like the PipewerX or MHP Clubman systems, long cans with plenty of baffling, zero loss in power either, in fact most increase the midrange by a fair amount, 6bhp when comparing the PipewerX with the Akra.
get a decent filter, no a huge fan of MWR but i've used K&N race filters without issue in the UK and abroad, get it flashed, i can highly recommend REPS in Caldicot just over the bridge into Wales, JHS, Seton, PCR etc etc, loads about that can do it, most will make between 178-190 after all that, anything more and the dyno is catering to ego, the bike will be transformed after this, especially the throttle connection, which is jerky as standard but smooth after reflash.
Brakes are a common complaint with the 2015 R1s, mainly down to feel and ABS run on, i tried a few things, Brembo GP4RX callipers, RCS Corsa Corta, in the end i dropped back to the OEM callipers with some Z04 pads and kept the RCS, the actual stopping power is fine even stock, just loses a lot of feel with the ABS in place i guess, tbh I've only had the ABS run me on into a corner twice, I'd like to think I'm going at a decent pace in fast groups, certainly for me it isn't an issue that needs addressing straight away if your new to the bike.
Definitely worth investing in some clip ons and rearsets, makes the world of difference on the R1, i went with Valtermoto for rearsets and Extreme Components for clip ons.
I'd grab some CRC/SHEPS etc fairings over some Chinese sets, they tend to melt quite quickly, especially the belly pan at the front.
blingy bits then i guess, we went down the I2M route after working with them a bit, tbh i love the dashes, little tricky to setup and make your own, but great when they are, there's just so much data you can harvest from them, in fact we are planning some online tutorials in the coming weeks into setting up and running the I2M dashes.
P.S.. if the bike is on Paddock stands don't allow the back wheel to spin while the front is stationary, it'll throw up and error that can only be cleared via yamaha or a tech.
To summrise
2017 onwards
Exhaust
filter
Flash
suspension leave stock, plenty of adjustment available.
brakes, Z04 pads and that's all you need for now.
I know in the 44 teeth vids it comes lower down, 5th or 6th if i remember right, but in truth, it's all b
ks, modern day superbikes are all so fast and capable that what it really comes down to is which one you perfer the looks and sound of, for me that is the R1, which i still think is the best of the bunch.the BMW is fast and extremely capable, but does nothing for me in the looks dept, sounds like a bag of spanners and from the few i've seen on track, tend to not hold up that well.
Edited by GYTRDave on Tuesday 8th February 14:06
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