Klim worth the money?
Discussion
Hi All,
I currently ride with RST gear, Paragon 5 jacket and pants, paragon boots and gloves. RST Ventilator stuff for the summer.
I used to do alot of commuting but not so much now, so its mostly touring and some weekend blasts in the cooler weather, i have mesh gear for when its warmer. I also have the heated gillet and under trousers if required. Touring can range from weekenders across the country, 7 days around Scotland, or a 14 day euro trip planned in 2021. I'm 5'11", and heavy at over 17st, wearing 2XL pants and jacket.
Last year I did an IOM trip, and on the way to the ferry, got totally drenched to the bone by a heavy rain shower, this took the full three days of the trip to dry out and did make it a bit miserable. It was so heavy, i do wonder if any gear could have put up with it.
We haven't done much touring this year due to Covid, so I'm thinking of upping the gear to something with goretex, and maybe some better armour, like a chest protector. Klim Badlands seems to fit the bill, but at near £1700 for the jacket/pants versus the RST's £400, i want some re-assurance that its the tool for the job.
Any klim users give me some actual long term use insights?
I currently ride with RST gear, Paragon 5 jacket and pants, paragon boots and gloves. RST Ventilator stuff for the summer.
I used to do alot of commuting but not so much now, so its mostly touring and some weekend blasts in the cooler weather, i have mesh gear for when its warmer. I also have the heated gillet and under trousers if required. Touring can range from weekenders across the country, 7 days around Scotland, or a 14 day euro trip planned in 2021. I'm 5'11", and heavy at over 17st, wearing 2XL pants and jacket.
Last year I did an IOM trip, and on the way to the ferry, got totally drenched to the bone by a heavy rain shower, this took the full three days of the trip to dry out and did make it a bit miserable. It was so heavy, i do wonder if any gear could have put up with it.
We haven't done much touring this year due to Covid, so I'm thinking of upping the gear to something with goretex, and maybe some better armour, like a chest protector. Klim Badlands seems to fit the bill, but at near £1700 for the jacket/pants versus the RST's £400, i want some re-assurance that its the tool for the job.
Any klim users give me some actual long term use insights?
A few years back I did a load of research in to commuting gear after needing to not get drenched. Below I'm only talking about GoreTex Pro Shell (the bonded stuff)
In short:
Rukka - expensive, nice features (pockets, vents, etc), but reports of parts failing, although these were replaced under warranty. I tried them on and they were nice, just out of my budget.
Rev-It - Really liked these, cheaper than Rukka but still pricey, weird sizing, especially if you are small. The smallest size was about 3 times too big for me (70kg, 5'7"). Did like the super fabric on the contact points though.
Klim - pricey and didn't include any thermal layers. I appreciate it allows people to layer as they want, but sometimes I don't want to have to take a mid layer as well when I'm commuting.
Dane - cheapest Pro-Shell I could find. The fit was really good for me. Light on features (pockets and vents) though and more for the slimmer build.
In the end I went for a Dane suit, combined with Held Gloves and A* boots (that have lasted 50k and 9 years). I've ridden in some awful weather in it and been totally dry, commuting and touring.
My advice is: go try it on as all the fits are very different. Make sure you can fit the maximum layers you will need under it, sit on your bike and if you ride with a bag then try this too. Make sure whatever you buy has storm cuffs or water will run down into your gloves or it is pain to try and zip them under the jacket sleeves.
Definitley go ProShell though. In a touring session in Wales, we got hit with hours of rain. The other rider was dry-ish but his kit was waterlogged. I got in, shook the water off and then in an hour my kit was warm and good to go.
On the protection front, I took out the back and chest protector recently and went with a Dainese Smart Jacket. But the SASTech protectors are good.
In short:
Rukka - expensive, nice features (pockets, vents, etc), but reports of parts failing, although these were replaced under warranty. I tried them on and they were nice, just out of my budget.
Rev-It - Really liked these, cheaper than Rukka but still pricey, weird sizing, especially if you are small. The smallest size was about 3 times too big for me (70kg, 5'7"). Did like the super fabric on the contact points though.
Klim - pricey and didn't include any thermal layers. I appreciate it allows people to layer as they want, but sometimes I don't want to have to take a mid layer as well when I'm commuting.
Dane - cheapest Pro-Shell I could find. The fit was really good for me. Light on features (pockets and vents) though and more for the slimmer build.
In the end I went for a Dane suit, combined with Held Gloves and A* boots (that have lasted 50k and 9 years). I've ridden in some awful weather in it and been totally dry, commuting and touring.
My advice is: go try it on as all the fits are very different. Make sure you can fit the maximum layers you will need under it, sit on your bike and if you ride with a bag then try this too. Make sure whatever you buy has storm cuffs or water will run down into your gloves or it is pain to try and zip them under the jacket sleeves.
Definitley go ProShell though. In a touring session in Wales, we got hit with hours of rain. The other rider was dry-ish but his kit was waterlogged. I got in, shook the water off and then in an hour my kit was warm and good to go.
On the protection front, I took out the back and chest protector recently and went with a Dainese Smart Jacket. But the SASTech protectors are good.
Edited by Wildfire on Tuesday 29th September 15:32
Edited by Wildfire on Tuesday 29th September 15:36
I've been a Badlands Pro Jacket owner for over 5 years and never had an issue with it letting in water, its a pretty robust jacket and has lots of vents for those hot summer days and even has provision for a water bladder. Klim kit doesnt come with any liners for colder rides but its easy enough to sort that out yourself and imo works better wearing the gear you would after you take the jacket off rather than having a liner for the jacket (etc) then a fleece or whatever for when not wearing the jacket. Ive also got the matching Badlands pro pants but these dont get used much as these were made when the trews were cut like a fishermans waterproofs so tended to wear other gear.(stadler goretex pro touring pants). The later (this years kit) badlands tends to have slimmer cut trews but that might not suite yourself so best try b4 buying if your not sure of fit. Some Klim suppliers have end of this season sales on so you might strike lucky with a discount, I did when replacing my go to trews (stadlers -which I holed) with a new pair of badlands , and will be at some point flogging me old uns or perhaps saving them for when I have a fat Elvis phase (again)
Edited by fredd1e on Tuesday 29th September 15:43
Had lots of Goretex stuff over the years - from Hein Gericke, Rukka, Dainese, BMW (their own proprietary version of Goretex), Rev-It, and now Klim.
One of the best jacket/suits I had was the HG Master V. Brilliant. Water tight. But boil-in-the-bag during Spanish summers. No longer available, but way ahead of its time.
Rukka - had the Armas or something like that. Super waterproof, trim was prone to failing, and the material faded a bit... but also boil-in-the-bag during the summer. Sadly, Rukka has still not addressed their lack of venting. If you ride Autumn/Winter/Spring, then it is good kit. But not for the summer.
Dainese - not the ProShell stuff, but the Explorer suit. One of the very best drop-liner Goretex suits I've had. Crash tested. Had 2 suits. Best ventilation of any jacket. It is, however, a faff as a 3 layer suit: insulation, Gore drop liner, outer. But brilliant in the Spanish sun and very comfortable.
BMW - so so waterproofing. Great detailing and overall very good kit, but also boil-in-the-bag (at least for the StreetGuard Pro suit).
Rev-It - really really good kit. Nice details and seems to offer a lot of performance/value. I would recommend Rev-it at anything less than...
Klim - I have 2 of their suits: the Badlands Pro (2020 edition) and the Marrakesh suit. The Marrakesh is really superb as an all round 20-33c suit. Perhaps the most comfortable suit I have ever worn as the jacket and pants fit like a softshell jacket and pants. It is not waterproof. However - it has a DWR and I tested it in medium rain this summer and it was still good! Throw a waterproof shell on top to make it 100% waterproof - which is what I did when the rain was heavy. I love the Marrakesh for it's comfort and overall dual purpose.
The Badlands Pro is a battle-ready ProShell suit. It vents really well - far better than Rukka or any other proshell from what I can tell. It is also fully waterproof. It has a lot of structure to it, is stiff at first, and it is heavy. It does not have a liner of any sort - and this I really like. The Klim shell itself kind of floats over your body and allows good airflow in warm temps. It allows me to wear my regular [other brand] softshell or puffa jacket underneath making it far more comfortable and practical than having to wear a compromised zip-in liner. Loads of useful pockets. It is expensive, but it certainly feels the most bomb-proof jacket I have ever had. It worked perfectly offroad too. As with many things, you get what you pay for.
It is worth trying the Klim Kodiak if you have a slim build, or are focused on tarmac only riding on a sports tourer. The Badlands is quite boxy and baggy for offroad/adv biking.
So... having done the above brands, my current 2 suits are all from Klim. I voted with my wallet and have been very happy so far.
One of the best jacket/suits I had was the HG Master V. Brilliant. Water tight. But boil-in-the-bag during Spanish summers. No longer available, but way ahead of its time.
Rukka - had the Armas or something like that. Super waterproof, trim was prone to failing, and the material faded a bit... but also boil-in-the-bag during the summer. Sadly, Rukka has still not addressed their lack of venting. If you ride Autumn/Winter/Spring, then it is good kit. But not for the summer.
Dainese - not the ProShell stuff, but the Explorer suit. One of the very best drop-liner Goretex suits I've had. Crash tested. Had 2 suits. Best ventilation of any jacket. It is, however, a faff as a 3 layer suit: insulation, Gore drop liner, outer. But brilliant in the Spanish sun and very comfortable.
BMW - so so waterproofing. Great detailing and overall very good kit, but also boil-in-the-bag (at least for the StreetGuard Pro suit).
Rev-It - really really good kit. Nice details and seems to offer a lot of performance/value. I would recommend Rev-it at anything less than...
Klim - I have 2 of their suits: the Badlands Pro (2020 edition) and the Marrakesh suit. The Marrakesh is really superb as an all round 20-33c suit. Perhaps the most comfortable suit I have ever worn as the jacket and pants fit like a softshell jacket and pants. It is not waterproof. However - it has a DWR and I tested it in medium rain this summer and it was still good! Throw a waterproof shell on top to make it 100% waterproof - which is what I did when the rain was heavy. I love the Marrakesh for it's comfort and overall dual purpose.
The Badlands Pro is a battle-ready ProShell suit. It vents really well - far better than Rukka or any other proshell from what I can tell. It is also fully waterproof. It has a lot of structure to it, is stiff at first, and it is heavy. It does not have a liner of any sort - and this I really like. The Klim shell itself kind of floats over your body and allows good airflow in warm temps. It allows me to wear my regular [other brand] softshell or puffa jacket underneath making it far more comfortable and practical than having to wear a compromised zip-in liner. Loads of useful pockets. It is expensive, but it certainly feels the most bomb-proof jacket I have ever had. It worked perfectly offroad too. As with many things, you get what you pay for.
It is worth trying the Klim Kodiak if you have a slim build, or are focused on tarmac only riding on a sports tourer. The Badlands is quite boxy and baggy for offroad/adv biking.
So... having done the above brands, my current 2 suits are all from Klim. I voted with my wallet and have been very happy so far.
Edited by spareparts on Tuesday 29th September 18:58
I have a Klim Marrakesh jacket which I've worn all year and has been great. On colder days I wear a down jacket or some other windbreaker underneath, and I've recently bought a Scott ergo pro shell to go over the top for wet days.
I didn't know much about Klim beforehand but the jacket was recommended to me by Motolegends when I was visiting for some jeans. Very happy with the features, comfort and quality.
I didn't know much about Klim beforehand but the jacket was recommended to me by Motolegends when I was visiting for some jeans. Very happy with the features, comfort and quality.
Textile gear is a funny one, from my experience you don't automatically get a jacket/trousers significantly better than a less expensive item despite spending considerably more.
My £150 Frank Thomas jacket has been well tested and proved to b100% waterproof and has been designed much better to access pockets and other nice touches for adjustment/sealing pockets etc and than my previous Dainese and Furygan items.
Same goes for my Akito trousers...there nearly as plush as my PJs ! Braces also keep them in place n held up(cant believe I said that but its true!) which that helps prevent rain getting in the area where jacket and trousers meet.
My £150 Frank Thomas jacket has been well tested and proved to b100% waterproof and has been designed much better to access pockets and other nice touches for adjustment/sealing pockets etc and than my previous Dainese and Furygan items.
Same goes for my Akito trousers...there nearly as plush as my PJs ! Braces also keep them in place n held up(cant believe I said that but its true!) which that helps prevent rain getting in the area where jacket and trousers meet.
I went through a few cheaper jackets and trousers before biting the bullet and going for full on Gortex Pro gear. The cheaper jackets often have a separate waterproof layer, so in summer and its raining, you have to wear the waterproof layer and the outer jacket and I used to get really hot.
Also, jackets with a separate waterproof layer often absorb the water, so from a commuting perspective, they can be wet the morning after when you have to gear up to go to work the following day, and putting on soggy gear is no fun.
I went for the Klim Badlands Jacket and trousers and they have never let me down, I have even had a minor off and beyond a few scuff marks, still work well, they are good few years old now and still great and the ventilation in the Badlands jacket is very good.
Dane gear is also good, Rukka whilst some love it, I think is very much overpriced.
Also, jackets with a separate waterproof layer often absorb the water, so from a commuting perspective, they can be wet the morning after when you have to gear up to go to work the following day, and putting on soggy gear is no fun.
I went for the Klim Badlands Jacket and trousers and they have never let me down, I have even had a minor off and beyond a few scuff marks, still work well, they are good few years old now and still great and the ventilation in the Badlands jacket is very good.
Dane gear is also good, Rukka whilst some love it, I think is very much overpriced.
Thanks for all advice, some good replies there.
In fairness to the RST, it has been mostly water tight in the times its been used in heavy rain, but the problems i have, as a poster mentioned above, its saturated at that point and doesn't dry out, which is a major difference between that and a Gore-Tex shell.
Also the paragon jacket gets very hot very quickly, not a problem when its a short trip and you can select between waterproof and mesh depending on conditions. But if I'm doing 2 weeks around Europe, you're bound to come across all types of weather. Maybe even a mesh style jacket with a Gore-Tex over suit would be a better idea, I dunno.
I know that I am definitely not 'euro' cut, so I think the Kodiak would be tight on me, but it does make sense though, i don't plan on doing off road.
Thanks
Matt
In fairness to the RST, it has been mostly water tight in the times its been used in heavy rain, but the problems i have, as a poster mentioned above, its saturated at that point and doesn't dry out, which is a major difference between that and a Gore-Tex shell.
Also the paragon jacket gets very hot very quickly, not a problem when its a short trip and you can select between waterproof and mesh depending on conditions. But if I'm doing 2 weeks around Europe, you're bound to come across all types of weather. Maybe even a mesh style jacket with a Gore-Tex over suit would be a better idea, I dunno.
I know that I am definitely not 'euro' cut, so I think the Kodiak would be tight on me, but it does make sense though, i don't plan on doing off road.
Thanks
Matt
I'll put another vote in for Dane gear. I bought a Sealand jacket about 4 years ago and it has been bombproof. I commute 15 miles each way pretty much every day on the bike and the weather in these parts can be variable to say the least. The Dane has stood up to every downpour I've had to endure, and it dries overnight as it doesn't soak the water up.
It was also only about £500 (I say only... it was a big investment for me, but still much cheaper than the Rukka equivalent).
It was also only about £500 (I say only... it was a big investment for me, but still much cheaper than the Rukka equivalent).
there are other laminates out there by oxford, halvarssons (never sure how to spell that?) and hideout.
you could buy a drop liner suit and use a rain jacket for really bad conditions over the top, this was suggested on a motolegends video even for laminates
rukka has been meh, popper fell off within the first week, zip tags have bust, main zip bust and i couldn't get out of it until someone got paper clip and released the zip cam, crashed in it not that crash proof, areas i thought wouldn't rip did, took armour out and reverted to knox shirt as it was uncomfortable back protector especially
overall, not impressed for £2000 probably will not buy again
you could buy a drop liner suit and use a rain jacket for really bad conditions over the top, this was suggested on a motolegends video even for laminates
rukka has been meh, popper fell off within the first week, zip tags have bust, main zip bust and i couldn't get out of it until someone got paper clip and released the zip cam, crashed in it not that crash proof, areas i thought wouldn't rip did, took armour out and reverted to knox shirt as it was uncomfortable back protector especially
overall, not impressed for £2000 probably will not buy again
Not just because I'm tight honest
I have always founda cheaper midrange jacket with a pakamac type jacket to be adequate, I only commuted 22 miles each way but even if it was - 10 I was out in it, the lightweight jacket makes a huge difference
My next suit will probably be a Oxford laminated one, but I will still have the pakamac stored on the bike
I have always founda cheaper midrange jacket with a pakamac type jacket to be adequate, I only commuted 22 miles each way but even if it was - 10 I was out in it, the lightweight jacket makes a huge difference
My next suit will probably be a Oxford laminated one, but I will still have the pakamac stored on the bike
Let me pit a word in for a Lindstrand jacket and pants. Lindstrand is a sub brand of Halvarsson. They have a zip in waterproof liner for both jacket and pants and a zip in themal liner for your torso.
Not as heavy duty as the Rukka, Halvarsson stuff but for most stuff above freezing they are really good. Suit on its own is shower proof but heavier rain you need to zip in the liners or slip on a waterproof jacket. From recollection the suit in total was around the £650 mark,
Not as heavy duty as the Rukka, Halvarsson stuff but for most stuff above freezing they are really good. Suit on its own is shower proof but heavier rain you need to zip in the liners or slip on a waterproof jacket. From recollection the suit in total was around the £650 mark,
wa16 said:
there are other laminates out there by … Hideout.
At this price elevation, I reckon Klim and Rukka – good though they are – are second best compared to Hideout Hi-Pro textiles. The Hi-Pro range is the premier league champion of textiles. They are beautifully made, with your choice of colour, jacket length, etc – probably the only textiles with a made-to-measure option and by far the most crash-proof. And if you're airbag-curious, Hideout can add one too. I'm saving up by selling off family members!wa16 said:
rukka has been meh … crashed in it not that crash-proof, areas I thought wouldn't rip did … not impressed for £2000 probably will not buy again
At a lower price altitude, Scott Leathers' New Road and Road Airflow jackets are excellent, IME. Not laminate but they're fully waterproof and (like Hideout) considerably more crash-proof than Rukka. Ignore how crap Scott Leathers' website is. (Like Hideout, the best clothing manufacturers have the worst websites.)A lot of the Klim kit is rated AA on the CE safety rating, most of the others with Goretex only get to A. Have a look on Sportsbikeshop, they have a filter for the CE safety rating that appears once you browse down to jackets or jeans. Just a thought, may or may not be important to everyone but surely must be a factor in deciding if Klim represent good value.
NJH said:
may or may not be important to everyone but surely must be a factor in deciding if Klim represents good value.
It should matter; otherwise, we might as well wear ski gear – protection from the weather but not injury. And the protection required for an A-rating is so low that ski gear could be a better bet. In the A-rating, regular denim can pass the abrasion test for high-risk areas. And the chest area can have zero abrasion resistance because the A-rating doesn’t require it!See: How much protection does the new CE standard offer?
NJH said:
A lot of the Klim kit is rated AA on the CE safety rating, most of the others with Goretex only get to A. Have a look on Sportsbikeshop; they have a filter for the CE safety rating that appears once you browse down to jackets or jeans.
In MotoCAP tests, Klim gives between 0.5 and 3.5 seconds abrasion resistance before ‘Bonjour, monsieur Rash de Gravel.” Not great but better than many other textiles. But Hideout’s Hi-Pro textiles are around twenty times more abrasion-resistant (as are Scott Leathers' New Road and Road Airflow textile jackets).Salted_Peanut said:
In MotoCAP tests, Klim gives between 0.5 and 3.5 seconds abrasion resistance before ‘Bonjour, monsieur Rash de Gravel.” Not great but better than many other textiles. But Hideout’s Hi-Pro textiles are around twenty times more abrasion-resistant (as are Scott Leathers' New Road and Road Airflow textile jackets).
Thank you for that info, Salted Peanut, it made for good reading. Unf I just had a look at the textile jacket I just splashed £200+ on and it only has an EN A rating. Maybe I’ll get another jacket prior to next summer, but at least until then the thermal liner will provide some level of increased abrasion protection. I assume removable liners are not present during the test.
Ordinary denim would meet level A and I think there is consensus that denim is not suitable for bike use, if you want to avoid road rash.
I don’t think the Australian database provides much useful information if you are actually buying a textile jacket. It does indicate that leather is much much better than textile. There are only 3 textile jackets which rate 3 stars out of 5.
Question for Klim owners: are they as comfortable and as much freedom of movement as other jackets? If you had the Klim jacket and a cheaper jacket which is only Level A, but you were only doing a 30 min town ride, had to walk around a bit with the jacket on and wanted to be comfortable, would you wear the Klim jacket or the cheapie?
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