Chipping a 320D v 330d E46
Discussion
Well since I'm starting to pay for my own fuel in the new year, I think I might have to move to the dark side and get a diesel...
I'll really miss my 5 series Touring, but looking at costs and the fact that a lot of my miles will be just me commuting, I'm being drawn down to a 3 series (E46) touring. Both the 320d and 330d seem to be highly regarded, which makes them obvious choices (although I still think I'd prefer a 325i just to get to hear a petrol 6 cylinder motor sing when its reved...)
So a couple of questions
1 - Is a 3 series as quiet as a 5 series? One of the things I love is the silence on the motorway and also the fact that stationary on a wet M25, it is silent and I don't hear much of the traffic going past on the other carriageway or the rain window... Small things but they keep you sane on a commute...
2 - Has anyone got experience of a chipped 320D? I was looking at a 330d to start with, but looking at the rices, I can get an 02 facelift 320d for less than a 2000 w 330d, with less miles, which looks pretty attractive... I'll also benefit from #55 a year less road tax, 47 v 40 to the gallon etc, etc...
However, the performance looks a little low... Most of the time it won't matter as it will be commuting, but I'd love to have some welly for a few trips to the track (when the lighter 2 litre engine should help too!). So if I chipped a 150bhp 320d, wouldn't that give me more power than an early 184bhp 330d? If so, has anyone had experience of them - do they use much more fuel when chipped (have heard sometimes it even improves!)? DOes the performance really jump up? Is the engine still decently torquey?
Be grateful for advice of owners! And anyone else who has the e46 diesels...
I'll really miss my 5 series Touring, but looking at costs and the fact that a lot of my miles will be just me commuting, I'm being drawn down to a 3 series (E46) touring. Both the 320d and 330d seem to be highly regarded, which makes them obvious choices (although I still think I'd prefer a 325i just to get to hear a petrol 6 cylinder motor sing when its reved...)
So a couple of questions
1 - Is a 3 series as quiet as a 5 series? One of the things I love is the silence on the motorway and also the fact that stationary on a wet M25, it is silent and I don't hear much of the traffic going past on the other carriageway or the rain window... Small things but they keep you sane on a commute...
2 - Has anyone got experience of a chipped 320D? I was looking at a 330d to start with, but looking at the rices, I can get an 02 facelift 320d for less than a 2000 w 330d, with less miles, which looks pretty attractive... I'll also benefit from #55 a year less road tax, 47 v 40 to the gallon etc, etc...
However, the performance looks a little low... Most of the time it won't matter as it will be commuting, but I'd love to have some welly for a few trips to the track (when the lighter 2 litre engine should help too!). So if I chipped a 150bhp 320d, wouldn't that give me more power than an early 184bhp 330d? If so, has anyone had experience of them - do they use much more fuel when chipped (have heard sometimes it even improves!)? DOes the performance really jump up? Is the engine still decently torquey?
Be grateful for advice of owners! And anyone else who has the e46 diesels...
I have a totally std 6spd 330d (204bhp) and my mate has a chipped 320d and once they are rolling there is nothing between them in terms of accel or top speed (think his is claimed to be 190 (ish) bhp. The only real difference is that my 330 has little or no lag, whereas the 320 needs 2k on the clock before she goes. hence if we are both just pootling around in the usual "diesel in traffic at 1500rpm" zone my 330 will accel away from his if we both boot it without a downshift. He gets a couple more mpg than me on a commuter run, although if we both welly it they both seem to do about 32mpg. Should also add, both cars are manuals.
If i wasn't towing my rally car up hill and down dale i would have probably got a 320d!
Hope that kinda helps!
If i wasn't towing my rally car up hill and down dale i would have probably got a 320d!
Hope that kinda helps!
Edited by max_torque on Monday 27th November 09:38
Cheers for the response - interesting to hear the differences... Seems to point towards the 320d given my limited budget I think, although I had hoped to hear you get much more mpg out of it than with a 330d... A little disappointing in some ways as it is the torque I'm looking forward to (something that is a little lacking in my 520, which loves to rev...), but I expect I won't notice coming from a petrol.
Do you find the car quiet? How insulated are you from wind noise and road noise etc?
Anyone else any feelings on this?
Do you find the car quiet? How insulated are you from wind noise and road noise etc?
Anyone else any feelings on this?
Hi Tim
I've got an E60 530d and a E46 320td compact, both superchipped.
The 5's loads more refined but I couldn't call the 3 'noisy' either, just no where near the 5's level of comfort and relaxation.
The 3 is a much quicker car now and unless your using full throttle/torque all the time, the consumption is actually better then standard. It also spools up much earlier than standard with my chip, about 1600 rpm and huge shove at 1800. I've caught 993C4/WRX and E30 M3's around Croft in this car as the combination of grunt and handling balance are great.
Look around for the ES models as they had 3 years 60k free servicing!
Good luck.
I've got an E60 530d and a E46 320td compact, both superchipped.
The 5's loads more refined but I couldn't call the 3 'noisy' either, just no where near the 5's level of comfort and relaxation.
The 3 is a much quicker car now and unless your using full throttle/torque all the time, the consumption is actually better then standard. It also spools up much earlier than standard with my chip, about 1600 rpm and huge shove at 1800. I've caught 993C4/WRX and E30 M3's around Croft in this car as the combination of grunt and handling balance are great.
Look around for the ES models as they had 3 years 60k free servicing!
Good luck.
Or you could get a 330i converted to LPG...
I do 30-40k miles a year so should have a 320d. I really wanted a 330i so I looked into the lpg conversion after seeing a friends Audi A8 and Range Rover with conversions.
I did masses of reasearch, contacted people with converted cars and checked out many converters. To cut a long story short, I was convinced and went out and bought a 330i and had it converted by a quality company who really know their LPG and know their 'modern' cars (there are lots of dodgy lpg fitters out there...).
I have a 45l tank in the spare wheel well of the boot. It doesn't intrude into the boot space (although the space saver spare does if you choose to carry it). A colour coded filler cap has been discreetly fitted and a very small lpg gauge and switchover button has been fitted in the dash behind the steering wheel (near the light switch).
Overall it is a very discreet conversion.
The driving experience is unchanged: the car automatically switches over to lpg once the engine is warm and automatically swithes back to petrol if you run out of lpg. You can flick between modes at the touch of the dash mounted button. You can switch to petrol if you can't find lpg (I travel the length and breadth of the country and have always managed to get lpg easily-it helps that I have a map of all the stations too). It is the same level of inconvenience as trying to find a Shell station (I always used to fill up with Shell fuel only).
The performance is for all intents the same. There is a mild reduction in power at the top end of the rev range when compared to Shell V-Power 99ron, but the car still showed an indicated 155mph whist driving on lpg.
The best part is that I get to drive around in one of the best sounding engines for the same price as a diesel:
Averaging 26.10mpg on the OBC
LPG price per litre: 48p (in London-elsewhere as low as 40p!)
With these figures the car only costs 10p a mile!!!
If I get lpg for 40p and do a nice motorway run at that figure can be as low as 8p a mile!
This compares favourably with the 330d and is a little more than the 320d. The diesels are great and have more torque (although the 330i is hardly lacking in that dept!) but they just don't deliver the sound and that top end rush of power. I find myslef blipping the throttle on down changes and using a lower gear to overtake just because it sounds so good!! The best bit is getting home to my underground car park after a long run, the exhaust is that much bassier when hot-sounds superb!
The conversion cost me £2300.00. The car was away for 5 days so I had to hire a car. The lpg only requires and annual service at around £50.00+vat.
I can highly recommend the place that converted my car.
Now the plug: I am moving to Greece in December and I need to sell the car as taking it with me is impractical(steering on the wrong side, lack of lpg in Greece, exorbitant import taxes and red tape and horrible roads in Athens only fit for a Jeep!)
I know I am not supposed to advertise on the forum so I will be brief and just say that you can see it in the classified section of PH (search 330i and lpg) or drop me a PM.
Thanks, Dino
I do 30-40k miles a year so should have a 320d. I really wanted a 330i so I looked into the lpg conversion after seeing a friends Audi A8 and Range Rover with conversions.
I did masses of reasearch, contacted people with converted cars and checked out many converters. To cut a long story short, I was convinced and went out and bought a 330i and had it converted by a quality company who really know their LPG and know their 'modern' cars (there are lots of dodgy lpg fitters out there...).
I have a 45l tank in the spare wheel well of the boot. It doesn't intrude into the boot space (although the space saver spare does if you choose to carry it). A colour coded filler cap has been discreetly fitted and a very small lpg gauge and switchover button has been fitted in the dash behind the steering wheel (near the light switch).
Overall it is a very discreet conversion.
The driving experience is unchanged: the car automatically switches over to lpg once the engine is warm and automatically swithes back to petrol if you run out of lpg. You can flick between modes at the touch of the dash mounted button. You can switch to petrol if you can't find lpg (I travel the length and breadth of the country and have always managed to get lpg easily-it helps that I have a map of all the stations too). It is the same level of inconvenience as trying to find a Shell station (I always used to fill up with Shell fuel only).
The performance is for all intents the same. There is a mild reduction in power at the top end of the rev range when compared to Shell V-Power 99ron, but the car still showed an indicated 155mph whist driving on lpg.
The best part is that I get to drive around in one of the best sounding engines for the same price as a diesel:
Averaging 26.10mpg on the OBC
LPG price per litre: 48p (in London-elsewhere as low as 40p!)
With these figures the car only costs 10p a mile!!!
If I get lpg for 40p and do a nice motorway run at that figure can be as low as 8p a mile!
This compares favourably with the 330d and is a little more than the 320d. The diesels are great and have more torque (although the 330i is hardly lacking in that dept!) but they just don't deliver the sound and that top end rush of power. I find myslef blipping the throttle on down changes and using a lower gear to overtake just because it sounds so good!! The best bit is getting home to my underground car park after a long run, the exhaust is that much bassier when hot-sounds superb!
The conversion cost me £2300.00. The car was away for 5 days so I had to hire a car. The lpg only requires and annual service at around £50.00+vat.
I can highly recommend the place that converted my car.
Now the plug: I am moving to Greece in December and I need to sell the car as taking it with me is impractical(steering on the wrong side, lack of lpg in Greece, exorbitant import taxes and red tape and horrible roads in Athens only fit for a Jeep!)
I know I am not supposed to advertise on the forum so I will be brief and just say that you can see it in the classified section of PH (search 330i and lpg) or drop me a PM.
Thanks, Dino
Edited by Dino D on Monday 27th November 10:39
Hi Dino, great looking car yours... An interesting proposition too with the reduced running costs, but unfortunately I'm looking for a touring, and didn't want to spend as much as yours is obviously worth...
Interesting the comments about the refinement levels of a 3 and 5 series - sounds a pity, I really value how quiet my e39 is, and don't really want to give that up, but the numbers won't stack up to keep it... Just been told that my first 6-9 month assignment with the new job in January will be a 105 mile round trip each day, so that is definately going to mean a diesel...
THink a chipped 320d sounds like the way to go!
Interesting the comments about the refinement levels of a 3 and 5 series - sounds a pity, I really value how quiet my e39 is, and don't really want to give that up, but the numbers won't stack up to keep it... Just been told that my first 6-9 month assignment with the new job in January will be a 105 mile round trip each day, so that is definately going to mean a diesel...
THink a chipped 320d sounds like the way to go!
A colleague of mine 12 months ago went from a basic Peugeot 206 to an '03 or '04 320d. It went fairly well and was quite nice in a day-to-day kind of way. However he just upgraded it to the 330cd (204bhp) that he always wanted. It is like a totally different car.
I have to say that it is a very impressively quick car by any standards. Compared to his (standard) 320d it feels like a real performance car rather than a quickish 4-cyl diesel family car! The engine sounds a lot better and has real grunt.
So IMO it's certainly worth getting the 3.0 engine. We also dyno'd it just last Saturday and it showed 225bhp which is 20 over standard!
I have to say that it is a very impressively quick car by any standards. Compared to his (standard) 320d it feels like a real performance car rather than a quickish 4-cyl diesel family car! The engine sounds a lot better and has real grunt.
So IMO it's certainly worth getting the 3.0 engine. We also dyno'd it just last Saturday and it showed 225bhp which is 20 over standard!
Test drove a standard 320D at lunch today - pretty impressive car... Went well, not too diesl-ey, and won't round corners in a decent fashion... Average economy meter was showing 47.8mpg on it too, which is pretty impressive... Space in the back was a lot better than I thought it would be, even with the drivers seat in my position (I'm 6'2"
.
Negative points:
Seemed to be more wind and general road noise than in the 5 series
Seat base doesn't adjust for pitch as it does in the 5 series, which means my leg is going to be un-supported on a long run. Not sure if I can put up with that, as one of the things I love the 5 for is the comfort over distance...
So - does anyone else have a 3 series that has adjustable seat base pitch? The salesman mentioned that the sport or electric seats give you that, but I'm not sure I believe him as he was wrong about a couple of other bits of spec... So those of you with a sport seats - can you adjust seat base? And with electric seats - Any luck?
If not, I can see myself going towards a 525D instead... But I enjoyed the more direct feel of the 3 today!
. Negative points:
Seemed to be more wind and general road noise than in the 5 series
Seat base doesn't adjust for pitch as it does in the 5 series, which means my leg is going to be un-supported on a long run. Not sure if I can put up with that, as one of the things I love the 5 for is the comfort over distance...
So - does anyone else have a 3 series that has adjustable seat base pitch? The salesman mentioned that the sport or electric seats give you that, but I'm not sure I believe him as he was wrong about a couple of other bits of spec... So those of you with a sport seats - can you adjust seat base? And with electric seats - Any luck?
If not, I can see myself going towards a 525D instead... But I enjoyed the more direct feel of the 3 today!
[quote=timwatsham]So - does anyone else have a 3 series that has adjustable seat base pitch? The salesman mentioned that the sport or electric seats give you that, but I'm not sure I believe him as he was wrong about a couple of other bits of spec... So those of you with a sport seats - can you adjust seat base? And with electric seats - Any luck?[quote]
Yes, my Sport tourer has tilting seat bases. (although, if i were being ultra critical i would say that the rear part of the seat still doesn't quite go low enough, but that is really only noticed when i get out of the Vantage and back into the beemer)
Yes, my Sport tourer has tilting seat bases. (although, if i were being ultra critical i would say that the rear part of the seat still doesn't quite go low enough, but that is really only noticed when i get out of the Vantage and back into the beemer)
Edited by max_torque on Thursday 30th November 08:54
Did you consider an E39 diesel touring?
I had a manual E39 525d saloon and got over 40mpg - performance was pretty good, and would have been even better chipped/remapped, but it was a company car so I didn't want to take the risk.
5 Series are quite different from 3 Series - just more refined and quieter. I'm in a 3-Series now, and although it's a great car, it's not as smooth as a 5, but I knew that when I went for it... depends what you're looking for and how long you plan to spend in the car. ;-)
I had a manual E39 525d saloon and got over 40mpg - performance was pretty good, and would have been even better chipped/remapped, but it was a company car so I didn't want to take the risk.
5 Series are quite different from 3 Series - just more refined and quieter. I'm in a 3-Series now, and although it's a great car, it's not as smooth as a 5, but I knew that when I went for it... depends what you're looking for and how long you plan to spend in the car. ;-)
aeroresh said:
Beemer-5 said:
Get the best 330d you can afford. Much better than the 2 litre engine imo.
....and then chip that!
which is what I did, 30k miles later (me) it's on 69k and fine.
awesome mile coverer, quite, comfortable, rapid (220hp), stylish, economical, comedy smokescreen behind when overtaking (not too much)
Edited by The_Doc on Sunday 3rd December 15:39
hi,
I've had a E46 330d Touring for a couple of years. I've not delved into the world of chipping, but if I were, I'd be looking at what extra torque I'd get - after all, isn't it the extra grunt for overtaking we want 'in real life'? When you look at the 330d, I think there's more than enough already. At least I thought so till they brought out the 335d
I can't say the 330d is silent but it is v smooth. Most of them are auto's though and although the running costs haven't been high for me, I'm not a high miler, mpg struggles to get over 30, 40 max on a long M Way run.
I've had a E46 330d Touring for a couple of years. I've not delved into the world of chipping, but if I were, I'd be looking at what extra torque I'd get - after all, isn't it the extra grunt for overtaking we want 'in real life'? When you look at the 330d, I think there's more than enough already. At least I thought so till they brought out the 335d
I can't say the 330d is silent but it is v smooth. Most of them are auto's though and although the running costs haven't been high for me, I'm not a high miler, mpg struggles to get over 30, 40 max on a long M Way run.
My superchipped 320 had a problem, dealer changed 4 injectors and then replaced the ECU under warranty, no comments about chips 
Difference to driving is worth the cost twice over, massive improvement in all areas, including fuel economy!
So impressed, I had my 530d chipped the day I collected it
Difference to driving is worth the cost twice over, massive improvement in all areas, including fuel economy!
So impressed, I had my 530d chipped the day I collected it
Gassing Station | BMW General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff