Swapping alloys for steel wheels, use same bolts?

[_Rich_]

About to change over to winter wheels/ tyres.

But just looking at another general thread a few people are saying you also need to change the bolts you use if you're taking off alloys and putting on steel wheels. Is this true?
It's an e92 330 (if that makes a difference).

[E30M3SE]

Depends on the steel wheel and the type of bolt seat the steel wheel has.

Your BMW alloy bolts have a 60 degree taper.

[_Rich_]

http://www.mrwinterwheels.co.uk/17-bmw-3-series-e9...

This is what I bought, when goes on about 100% fitment I assume it would be a straight swap. I think a phone call in the morning may be in order. I don't fancy driving to work and a wheel falls off

[Sushifiend]

E30M3SE said:

Depends on the steel wheel and the type of bolt seat the steel wheel has.

Your BMW alloy bolts have a 60 degree taper.

If the wheel stud holes align with the wheel hub, then the wheel must have been designed to fit BMW in which case the taper can't be a problem. No other manufacturer uses the same stud spacing as BMW. Steel wheels also don't tend to have a flat tapered mating surfaces so the taper of the studs should not be an issue. I was thinking the OP was referring to the metal of the studs - some metals don't like to sit together. As far as I know, all studs are steel anyway so they should be fine with steel wheels.

[E30M3SE]

_Rich_ said:

http://www.mrwinterwheels.co.uk/17-bmw-3-series-e9...

This is what I bought, when goes on about 100% fitment I assume it would be a straight swap. I think a phone call in the morning may be in order. I don't fancy driving to work and a wheel falls off

From the link you posted on the wheels you have, look under 'Wheel Specification'.

States, "Fixings:Use OEM Bolts/Nuts".

So you'll be fine, just make sure you torque them up to 120nms.

Sushifiend said:

If the wheel stud holes align with the wheel hub, then the wheel must have been designed to fit BMW in which case the taper can't be a problem. No other manufacturer uses the same stud spacing as BMW. Steel wheels also don't tend to have a flat tapered mating surfaces so the taper of the studs should not be an issue. I was thinking the OP was referring to the metal of the studs - some metals don't like to sit together. As far as I know, all studs are steel anyway so they should be fine with steel wheels.

If you actually look into this you will find that BMW are not the only manufacturer.

Edited by E30M3SE on Sunday 22 November 14:04

[Sushifiend]

E30M3SE said:

If you actually look into this you will find that BMW are not the only manufacturer.

Edited by E30M3SE on Sunday 22 November 14:04

I looked into it about a year ago. Every other major manufacturer seems to use a different bolt circle diameter. There may be one or two leftfield mfrs that use BMWs spacings.

[E30M3SE]

Vauxhall, Land Rover, leftfield?.. and the bore sizes match up too.

[_Rich_]

Sorted. A few things I've learnt; that is ball ache, 3 of the wheels would not come off without a lot of force, and trying to line the holes up on the front is well more ball ache.
On the plus side I took it for a test drive and the wheels didn't fall off, and it doesn't feel so harsh when I hit a bump in the road.







Also noticed a lot of rust I assume this is normal?

[E30M3SE]

_Rich_ said:

Also noticed a lot of rust I assume this is normal?

Quite normal.

[anonymous-user]

_Rich_ said:

Sorted. A few things I've learnt; that is ball ache, 3 of the wheels would not come off without a lot of force, and trying to line the holes up on the front is well more ball ache.
On the plus side I took it for a test drive and the wheels didn't fall off, and it doesn't feel so harsh when I hit a bump in the road.







Also noticed a lot of rust I assume this is normal?

A lot of rust isn't normal and there's no reason why the rims need to be stuck on the hubs.

I've just put on my winter wheels, 530D. As I do every time I change, I put copper grease on the hub mating surface. Wheels come off easily every time. There are a couple of little rust spots inside the rear hubs but nothing to speak of. I just put some WD into the centre space, seems to work.

I know what you mean about the front wheels being more difficult to locate. What I do is turn the hub to get a hole at the top. Position the wheel similarly and just lift it up into position. Have a stud ready inside a long socket and then holding the wheel with one hand start the bolt with the other. When it's in a fair way you can let the rim go, fit another bolt. Run them in a fair way and the rim will stay where it is.

Takes me about an hour including getting everything ready, checking pads, tyre pressures etc. and tidying up.

[E-bmw]

E30M3SE said:

Vauxhall, Land Rover, leftfield?.. and the bore sizes match up too.

Don't forget the VW vans, SAAB 9-5 and some Lexi.

Edited by E-bmw on Sunday 22 November 16:56

[Sushifiend]

E-bmw said:

Don't forget the VW vans, SAAB 9-5 and some Lexi.

Edited by E-bmw on Sunday 22 November 16:56

According to this it's BMW, Land Rover and a couple of assorted others:
http://www.wheelsupport.com/bolt-pattern-list-5-x-...

I have a set of 17" Borbet alloys fitted with Michelin Pilot Winters for my 330Ci which is now on 175k hard miles, the rear arches are rusting, the engine burns and leaks oil. It might be the car's last winter with me, so I'll probably sell the winter set unless I get another BMW. I know modern cars need tyre pressure sensors, so even if I get another BMW I don't know if I can use the tyres. Discounting MOT issues, are there any problems with not having tyre pressure sensors on a car designed for them? Would I just get some sort of warning, and if so can it be dismissed? I'm seriously considering an E92 M3 as the replacement - will 17" alloys even fit over the front brakes?

[E30M3SE]

If you're considering E92 M3 and it is fitted with the active TPM system then you can put in normal valves and live with the warning on the dash, it will fail MOT, if presented, for TPM system indicating a fault, or buy from BMW dealer 4 sensor valve and fit to your winter wheels, £ 57 + VAT for each sensor with valve is the retail price.

ETA, not sure if 17's will clear brakes on front, BMW list 18" for winter wheel/tyres.

Edited by E30M3SE on Sunday 22 November 21:31

[Maracus]

REALIST123 said:

I put copper grease on the hub mating surface. Wheels come off easily every time.

^^^ This ^^^

I use it when I swap mine over, never had a problem.

[apotts]

You may never have had a problem, but it's a really really bad idea to lubricate the bolts or mating surfaces.

[anonymous-user]

apotts said:

You may never have had a problem, but it's a really really bad idea to lubricate the bolts or mating surfaces.

Well, I meant that I put it on the spigot that sits inside the hole of the alloy wheel, which is where they corrode and stick. Some may get on the vertical surface but it wouldn't do any harm anyway.

There's a school of thought that wheel bolts should be lightly oiled to make sure the correct torque is applied, especially if the bolts are corroding a bit.

Particularly for heavy commercial vehicles, it is almost standard practice to oil studs and nuts when fitting wheels.

[SuffolkIan]

apotts said:

You may never have had a problem, but it's a really really bad idea to lubricate the bolts or mating surfaces.

Why? How do you expect to correctly torque bolts without lubrication?

Without lubrication all you are doing when you try and torque bolts is fighting friction, this is not the point of torquing any bolted assembly. Bolt thread and mating face should be lubricated.

I also always use copper grease on spigot to avoid wheels becoming stuck.

Ian

[Martyn76]

What tyres did you go for? I'm looking at getting a set of steelies but anything about the Avon winter tyres gets quite expensive.

[Sushifiend]

E30M3SE said:

If you're considering E92 M3 and it is fitted with the active TPM system then you can put in normal valves and live with the warning on the dash, it will fail MOT, if presented, for TPM system indicating a fault, or buy from BMW dealer 4 sensor valve and fit to your winter wheels, £ 57 + VAT for each sensor with valve is the retail price.

ETA, not sure if 17's will clear brakes on front, BMW list 18" for winter wheel/tyres.

Thanks for that!

[_Rich_]

Martyn76 said:

What tyres did you go for? I'm looking at getting a set of steelies but anything about the Avon winter tyres gets quite expensive.

I went with the Avon tyres because of price, they do seem to get positive reviews online. I've only had them on just over a day, but they did there job on an icy country road this morning.