3000GTO Hunting
Discussion
Simonelite501 said:
I've very recently fallen in love with the 3000 GTO, does anyone have any advice as to what to look for before buying?
Have a look on www.gtouk.co.uk - they have an excellent buyers guide. There are usually some nice, well looked after examples in the For Sale section.
A recently bought a 1999 3000GT (UK version) - fantastic car although I think I need to replace the turbos soon! The UK versions are a bit more difficult to come buy and a bit more expensive but the insurance is cheaper. The import version (GTO) is a lot more common but you have to look very carefully as a lot of them have been thrashed, modded, clocked etc... Insurance is a lot more expensive as well.
How much were you looking at spending?
I was looking around £7K, TT models are probably out of my price range, well good ones anyway. I'll have a look on the link you provided. The insurance thing may prove to be a bind. Both of my "toy" vehicles (85 Turbo Esprit & 88 Cosworth Serria) are classed as classics and cost peanuts to insure. In comparison to the Lotus and Cosworth, would a non TT GTO be sluggish?
best advice is go to www.gtouk.org.uk - all your questions will be answered....
If you splash out a bit and buy a 3000GT (UK-spec) insurance is far better and cheaper than on a GTO (JDM-spec). You'll also get bigger turbos, an engine ready set to use UK fuel and no JDM speed limiter (although most JDM imports have had this removed - not mine though) along with 320b.h.p as opposed to the JDM car's 280b.h.p. - but they are more expensive than the imports and far rarer.
[quote]I was looking around £7K, TT models are probably out of my price range, well good ones anyway. [/quote]
You should get a very nice 3000GT for that (all UK-spec cars are twin-turbo).
Cheers
>> Edited by GTO Scott on Monday 29th August 22:28
If you splash out a bit and buy a 3000GT (UK-spec) insurance is far better and cheaper than on a GTO (JDM-spec). You'll also get bigger turbos, an engine ready set to use UK fuel and no JDM speed limiter (although most JDM imports have had this removed - not mine though) along with 320b.h.p as opposed to the JDM car's 280b.h.p. - but they are more expensive than the imports and far rarer.
[quote]I was looking around £7K, TT models are probably out of my price range, well good ones anyway. [/quote]
You should get a very nice 3000GT for that (all UK-spec cars are twin-turbo).
Cheers
>> Edited by GTO Scott on Monday 29th August 22:28
I had one for 4 years great car!! Well until the head gasket went! Oh and the gearbox had problems 10 days outside the warrantee and Mitsubishi refused to help! 
Apart from that I did 60k miles and a great day at Castle Combe.
If you play with it a little there is no reason why you can’t see 170 on the clock
Standard brakes are awful though so before you do anything make sure you play with them!
Have fun
Apart from that I did 60k miles and a great day at Castle Combe.
If you play with it a little there is no reason why you can’t see 170 on the clock
Standard brakes are awful though so before you do anything make sure you play with them!
Have fun
Power Junkie said:
MarkK
I have a pare of Std GTO Turbos, good condition no shaft play run at std boost.
I am actually thinking of replacing my turbos as they are a bit smokey but I need 13bs for the 3000GT - the GTO has smaller 9bs.
Thanks for letting me know though - have you tried sticking them on GTOUK? - there are a few turbo upgrades going on and people need exchange units.
Simonelite501 said:
I was looking around £7K, TT models are probably out of my price range, well good ones anyway. I'll have a look on the link you provided. The insurance thing may prove to be a bind. Both of my "toy" vehicles (85 Turbo Esprit & 88 Cosworth Serria) are classed as classics and cost peanuts to insure. In comparison to the Lotus and Cosworth, would a non TT GTO be sluggish?
There are a couple of good MK1 / 2 GTOs around on the forum I mentioned for around your price range. I don't know a lot about the N/A version but I suspect it may feel a bit sluggish compared to your other cars.
Despite the insurance I'd definitely go for the TT - it's a buyers market for these so stick in a few low offers and you may get a good deal.
Remember one thing about the GTO forum, you CANT read any of the important info from the members on the site due to the fact you need to join the club...BUT they do have a FANTASTIC buyers guide on the link provided. Apart from the joining of the club being a bit annoying to see what the community is like, its actually well worth it and VERY helpful.
Check out the USA one as well:
www.3si.org/forum
The yanks do have different versions of the 3000GT, the one's you'd end up buying would be AWD.
My only problem with this car is how heavy it is.
Check out the USA one as well:
www.3si.org/forum
The yanks do have different versions of the 3000GT, the one's you'd end up buying would be AWD.
My only problem with this car is how heavy it is.
GTO Scott said:
You'll also get bigger turbos, an engine ready set to use UK fuel and no JDM speed limiter (although most JDM imports have had this removed - not mine though) along with 320b.h.p as opposed to the JDM car's 280b.h.p. - but they are more expensive than the imports and far rarer.
You just remove a rubber grommet and the GTO is up to 320bhp as per the 3000GT. Obviously the smaller turbos are then working harder but still fine.
jap-car said:
You'll also get bigger turbos, an engine ready set to use UK fuel and no JDM speed limiter (although most JDM imports have had this removed - not mine though) along with 320b.h.p as opposed to the JDM car's 280b.h.p. - but they are more expensive than the imports and far rarer.
You just remove a rubber grommet and the GTO is up to 320bhp as per the 3000GT. Obviously the smaller turbos are then working harder but still fine.
Hmmmmmmm..... 'optimistic'.
Just remember that by allowing more air into the engine by removing the grommet you need to book a session on the dyno to adjust the fuelling - or you'll run lean and go BANG - expensive.
Don't be put off by reports of unreliability - if the car is kept in good nick and serviced on time by someone who knows what they are doing, you'll have no problems - just like any other sports car actually.
Biggest bonus with the 3000GT over the GTO is the cheaper insurance - my insurance is £1500 TPFT (21/garaged/2yrNCB) on a GTO N/A - the quote for the 3000GT (twin turbo-only) was £1100 FC - and more insurance companies will quote you as well. Wanted an N/A as a step-up car so it had to be a GTO - no 3000GT n/a's built (apart from american LHD versions - and they're FWD not 4WD).
Looking for a non-running Mk.1 3000GT now as a project - 450bhp will be mine.....
GTO Scott said:
You just remove a rubber grommet and the GTO is up to 320bhp as per the 3000GT. Obviously the smaller turbos are then working harder but still fine.
Hmmmmmmm..... 'optimistic'.
Just remember that by allowing more air into the engine by removing the grommet you need to book a session on the dyno to adjust the fuelling - or you'll run lean and go BANG - expensive.
Looking for a non-running Mk.1 3000GT now as a project - 450bhp will be mine.....
Why's that optimistic and why a dyno session? As far as I know the cars run the same ECU, fuel pump, injectors and intercooler and therefore by doing this, must still be in the range of the standard fuel map.
jap-car said:
jap-car said:
You just remove a rubber grommet and the GTO is up to 320bhp as per the 3000GT. Obviously the smaller turbos are then working harder but still fine.
Hmmmmmmm..... 'optimistic'.
Just remember that by allowing more air into the engine by removing the grommet you need to book a session on the dyno to adjust the fuelling - or you'll run lean and go BANG - expensive.
Why's that optimistic and why a dyno session? As far as I know the cars run the same ECU, fuel pump, injectors and intercooler and therefore by doing this, must still be in the range of the standard fuel map.
The 3000GT makes it's extra power from the bigger turbos and an ECU mapped to cope. You are certainly correct in saying there will be a gain from removing the grommet on the GTO, but not 40bhp.
I would go for a dyno session personally - safety by checking that the engine is not running lean and the whole setup can be adjusted/checked to run at peak performance and to make the most of the standard setup. A pro rebuild by an expert on one of these motors can run to over £3000 - not small change. Say an hour on the dyno costs around £75-100 - for 2 hours of making sure thats potentially £2800 less than a rebuild....
GTO Scott said:
GTO Scott said:
jap-car said:
You just remove a rubber grommet and the GTO is up to 320bhp as per the 3000GT. Obviously the smaller turbos are then working harder but still fine.
Hmmmmmmm..... 'optimistic'.
Just remember that by allowing more air into the engine by removing the grommet you need to book a session on the dyno to adjust the fuelling - or you'll run lean and go BANG - expensive.
Why's that optimistic and why a dyno session? As far as I know the cars run the same ECU, fuel pump, injectors and intercooler and therefore by doing this, must still be in the range of the standard fuel map.
The 3000GT makes it's extra power from the bigger turbos and an ECU mapped to cope. You are certainly correct in saying there will be a gain from removing the grommet on the GTO, but not 40bhp.
I would go for a dyno session personally - safety by checking that the engine is not running lean and the whole setup can be adjusted/checked to run at peak performance and to make the most of the standard setup. A pro rebuild by an expert on one of these motors can run to over £3000 - not small change. Say an hour on the dyno costs around £75-100 - for 2 hours of making sure thats potentially £2800 less than a rebuild....
But are you certain that the ECU's and therefore fuel maps are different? I don't think they are (but I could be wrong). Therefore turning the boost up to the same level as the UK version must be safe (I think the AFM is the same).
jap-car said:
But are you certain that the ECU's and therefore fuel maps are different? I don't think they are (but I could be wrong). Therefore turning the boost up to the same level as the UK version must be safe (I think the AFM is the same).
The ECU is (as far as i know) physically the same, as is the MAF (AFM) sensor. The map will be slightly different at least to cope with lower octane (95-97 RON) UK fuel as opposed to the Jap high octane (100 RON) stuff.
GTO Scott said:
jap-car said:
But are you certain that the ECU's and therefore fuel maps are different? I don't think they are (but I could be wrong). Therefore turning the boost up to the same level as the UK version must be safe (I think the AFM is the same).
The ECU is (as far as i know) physically the same, as is the MAF (AFM) sensor. The map will be slightly different at least to cope with lower octane (95-97 RON) UK fuel as opposed to the Jap high octane (100 RON) stuff.
Good point on the map re the octane.
Are you aware of anyone who has had problems when the rubber grommet is removed? The problems I have seen with these engines are mainly either (1) a spun crank-shaft bearing or (2) the piston lands cracking. I don't think those problems are associated with det (again could be wrong!)
>> Edited by jap-car on Friday 2nd September 12:44
Right....
Spent an hour searching GTOUK and came up with this....
www.stealth316.com/2-freeboost.htm
I can't link to the thread i found this in - restricted access - however, while the mod is easy, the general opinion is that it depends on the car's overall mechanical condition before you do the mod - some cars have been known to start boost-spiking (peaking and troughing rather than holding a certain pressure) or alternatly the knock (detonation) counts have increased from 0 - around 4-12 - DEFINATLY not good....
Rather than a rolling road session, another way of checking is to 'log' the car using a Palm or Laptop based system through the diagnostics port in the drivers footwell by the fusebox - you can also continually moniter knock this way.
Spent an hour searching GTOUK and came up with this....
www.stealth316.com/2-freeboost.htm
I can't link to the thread i found this in - restricted access - however, while the mod is easy, the general opinion is that it depends on the car's overall mechanical condition before you do the mod - some cars have been known to start boost-spiking (peaking and troughing rather than holding a certain pressure) or alternatly the knock (detonation) counts have increased from 0 - around 4-12 - DEFINATLY not good....
Rather than a rolling road session, another way of checking is to 'log' the car using a Palm or Laptop based system through the diagnostics port in the drivers footwell by the fusebox - you can also continually moniter knock this way.
GTO Scott said:
Right....
Spent an hour searching GTOUK and came up with this....
www.stealth316.com/2-freeboost.htm
I can't link to the thread i found this in - restricted access - however, while the mod is easy, the general opinion is that it depends on the car's overall mechanical condition before you do the mod - some cars have been known to start boost-spiking (peaking and troughing rather than holding a certain pressure) or alternatly the knock (detonation) counts have increased from 0 - around 4-12 - DEFINATLY not good....
Rather than a rolling road session, another way of checking is to 'log' the car using a Palm or Laptop based system through the diagnostics port in the drivers footwell by the fusebox - you can also continually moniter knock this way.
Thanks for the info. That's the mod I was talking about.
I know my engine will be in good condition as I'm in the middle of a complete rebuild. As you imply, if boost is increased then monitoring the boost pressure is essential. However, this is very easy and cheap. Is monitoring knock as easy / cheap? Relating to me 200SX experience, because so many folks have increased the boost above standard, the maximum safe boost pressure on standard components is well documented and can be used, safe in the knowledge that knock is not a problem. Do you know if there is such a setting for the GTO? (as you may have guessed, all I'm planning is a K&N, a free-flow exhaust and a bit more boost ie nothing very expensive)
I've not investigated this subject in detail as I'm yet to drive the car.
GTO Scott said:
Right....
or alternatly the knock (detonation) counts have increased from 0 - around 4-12 - DEFINATLY not good....
Any knock readings can be worrying, I appreciate that,however,Knock levels such as above are really nothing to worry about-I promise.If your are regulary getting knock readings above 60 it is the time to worry.
The GTO ecu certainly does have its own knock monitoring sensor & will retard timing accordingly if necessary.I don't know what the reset threshold is tho.
jap-car said:
[quote]
Thanks for the info. That's the mod I was talking about.
You can get logging kits off ebay for £60-70 - thats the way everyone I know logs the knock count.
[quote]
Relating to me 200SX experience, because so many folks have increased the boost above standard, the maximum safe boost pressure on standard components is well documented and can be used, safe in the knowledge that knock is not a problem. Do you know if there is such a setting for the GTO? (as you may have guessed, all I'm planning is a K&N, a free-flow exhaust and a bit more boost ie nothing very expensive)
[/quote]
The standard 9b's aren't up to much more than standard boost anyway - they run around 0.5/6BAR and don't hold more than 0.9BAR reliably (good for around 310bhp).
The general consensus on GTOUK seems to be 'increase boost if you want but log it regularly to make sure'.
If you haven't driven the car, how about trying it for a while with stock boost? 'Slow' isn't a word i'd use to describe it.....
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