Help settling an argument - Elise 1.8 and Integra
Discussion
Can anyone help me settle a work debate.
I am contending that on track, against a stock 1.8 Elise (120bhp), an Integra Type R (old shape, DC2) would be at least as quick, and on a power circuit like Donington would arguably be quicker. (OK, Anglesey might well be the other way around)
My colleagues at work are telling me I'm living in cloud-cuckoo land and that an Elise will be clearly be quicker. Yet I have been at Donington and clearly closed in on and passed an Elise (not on his cool down lap, before anyone gets cheeky!), and I'm not the worlds best driver (but I do acknowledge the ITR is probably easier to drive at the limit than a mid-engine rwd lightweight). So I'm interested to know if Donny was just a cautious Elise driver, or if I've actually got a point.
I'm looking for opinions from people who've owned, or at least driven, both, ideally on-track. Alternatively from people who've done trackdays against the other car, their experiences.
Oh - no Elise Sports or 111S's - I know how capable they are!
Thanks guys,
M.
I am contending that on track, against a stock 1.8 Elise (120bhp), an Integra Type R (old shape, DC2) would be at least as quick, and on a power circuit like Donington would arguably be quicker. (OK, Anglesey might well be the other way around)
My colleagues at work are telling me I'm living in cloud-cuckoo land and that an Elise will be clearly be quicker. Yet I have been at Donington and clearly closed in on and passed an Elise (not on his cool down lap, before anyone gets cheeky!), and I'm not the worlds best driver (but I do acknowledge the ITR is probably easier to drive at the limit than a mid-engine rwd lightweight). So I'm interested to know if Donny was just a cautious Elise driver, or if I've actually got a point.
I'm looking for opinions from people who've owned, or at least driven, both, ideally on-track. Alternatively from people who've done trackdays against the other car, their experiences.
Oh - no Elise Sports or 111S's - I know how capable they are!
Thanks guys,
M.
I owned a 99 Elise & a 2002 CTR - not quite what you were lookng for but...
Away from the line & out of corners the Elise would pull away as there is far more grip from the RWD chassis. The Elise would also be faster round corners because of the balance of the car & any changes in direction would be handled better because of the lack of weight. Into corners the Elise would brake better partly due to it's weight & partly due to the lack of intference from ABS
Once the CTR hits 60 & you drop it on to the hot cam at 6k plus in forth gear the CTR would pull away in a straight line - by a considerable amount. The Elise hits hardest below 60 because of the lack of weight.
Remember the CTR & Elise's 0-60 & 100 times are about 6.8/16.2 & 5.9/17.9 respectively making the CTR faster between 60 & 100 by about 2.6 seconds.
Round a wide open circuit such as Silverstone the CTR would be faster because of it's top end. Round a tight circuit the Elise would be much faster. At Donnigton Park the Elise would be faster to the hairpin, slower up the hill on to the main straight & faster round the bottom hairpins. So it'd be pretty close. With an average skilled driver the CTR would probably be a little quicker.
Away from the line & out of corners the Elise would pull away as there is far more grip from the RWD chassis. The Elise would also be faster round corners because of the balance of the car & any changes in direction would be handled better because of the lack of weight. Into corners the Elise would brake better partly due to it's weight & partly due to the lack of intference from ABS
Once the CTR hits 60 & you drop it on to the hot cam at 6k plus in forth gear the CTR would pull away in a straight line - by a considerable amount. The Elise hits hardest below 60 because of the lack of weight.
Remember the CTR & Elise's 0-60 & 100 times are about 6.8/16.2 & 5.9/17.9 respectively making the CTR faster between 60 & 100 by about 2.6 seconds.
Round a wide open circuit such as Silverstone the CTR would be faster because of it's top end. Round a tight circuit the Elise would be much faster. At Donnigton Park the Elise would be faster to the hairpin, slower up the hill on to the main straight & faster round the bottom hairpins. So it'd be pretty close. With an average skilled driver the CTR would probably be a little quicker.
CTR dosnt have an LSD though does it? the entry speed of an integra is very high and you can maintain corner speed and boot it early cos of the LSD. But I imagine the elises low weight and layout give it some grunt out of teh corners
Id be happy to wager that I could take on an elise in a DC2.
Would be interesting. even if teh elise was quicker im sure teh DC2 wouldnt be far behind.
Have you posted on the elise forum someone may have been on a track with a teg.
Id be happy to wager that I could take on an elise in a DC2.
Would be interesting. even if teh elise was quicker im sure teh DC2 wouldnt be far behind.
Have you posted on the elise forum someone may have been on a track with a teg.
I driven both on a track on the same day. As said before, the lightness of the Elise makes it a lot more nimble around the "track" (Kemble Airfield)but my 'Teg is faster on the straights as long as you keep the engine in the Vtec zone. Lack of torque and the weight of the car can severely hamper it on really twisty, slower sections.
HOWEVER in the real world, i.e on wet British roads, my mates Elise couldn't even keep near my 'Teg, and he ended up spinning it, ending up in the driveway of somebodies house. FWD does have its uses after all!!
HOWEVER in the real world, i.e on wet British roads, my mates Elise couldn't even keep near my 'Teg, and he ended up spinning it, ending up in the driveway of somebodies house. FWD does have its uses after all!!
M12_Nathan said:
I too have driven an integra at Donington, and passed standard elises all day long.
GOOD man! Nice to have some support. Was starting to wonder if that particular Elsie driver was over-cautious, or had the handbrake on. To be fair, there was a Sport 135 there which I was having real trouble making ANY progress on at all...I think comparisons there depended on who was going 100% at the time, and on traffic.
Same thread is on the Elise forum...comments there aren't THAT far off - they're saying that it's straights vs corners as well, with the consensus being "depends on the track". Seems fair to me...Donny is a ballsy circuit, suits power cars more (NEVER thought I'd refer to the 'teg as a power car!?!).
Come Monday, I'll have a bit more ammo and confidence - a room full of car nuts and even the CTR owner there is against you!
Thanks again all,
Martin
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