Finance on a used Aston DB9 - just not sitting right with me

[rick111s]

Hi all,

i wonder if anyone on here can offer me any advice please..?

I currently run a 996t which in october comes to the end of it's 4 year finance agreement. The balloon is less then what the car is worth so i've got some cash left it in.

I had "stupidly" thought that i would be able to basically match the same kind of finance deal that i got on the porsche 4 years ago (my financial position had not really changed since then etc) as i've got the same kind of deposit (15k) i had back then so i starting looking at cars for about the came money as my porsche was (55k mark).

However after talking to several finance companies i cannot get anywhere near the same kind of offer.
I now understand that finance has changed a lot since then but my porsche is really hardly used nor would the aston be due (about 2k a year) to work / family and access to other cars.

I had wanted to try and keep the repayments to approx the same per month (under £500 p/m) but it means that i need to spend approx £60 to £90 more per month and look at cars just under the 50k bracket or put in close to 20k deposit to reduce the payments - again i cannot justify that.

Like most owners i want to be a bit fussy and get as close to a perfect car for me as i can but the balloons are really making the monthly payment more then i can really justify for the little use it would get and it also means that i need to look at cars under the 50k mark. Which is not a problem - i'm lucky to be in this position but i had wanted to be able to get my perfect car - right colour, right spec, low mileage etc. Most of the cars i've seen on the net are almost there but something with each is wrong.

i know that in four years time the lower balloon means i'm in a far better place financially and i also know that for the kind of money above i could join a car club but it's not me. I want the car in the garage for when i want to use it (meant in a nice way)

Does anyone know of a finance company that is able to get a balloon on a used aston above the 20k mark as this would then lower the monthly repayments closer to where i am at the moment and sit better with me. Best i can get balloon wise is about 18k - I can afford to do the deal how (subject to selling the porsche) but it's just not sitting well with me for the little i would use it etc.

Or do i need to realise that things have change for the finance companies and i need to accept the higher payments on a lower priced car? Just doesn't seem that great a deal.

My finance history is fine and i can afford to own and run an aston but I've been told it's based on the residual on the car (not me) and finance companies worrying i might give it back through the agreement. I had even asked if i can sign a doc waving this right in return for a higher balloon but no luck there. I struggle to see how on a 50k car with me doing low mileage how it could not be worth 30k in 4 years time so a balloon of say 23k or 24k will still leave me with money in it. I dont want to have to sell my soul to get into any car (not that car mad) but i do want to feel like i've got a good deal on the finance.

am i missing something?

Sorry if any of the above offends. I know the recession has been hard on people and i'm very luckly to have the porsche let alone sell it and walk into an aston but at 38 years old i dont want to grow up just yet and buy a sensible family car..

thanks in advance
thanks
Rick

[DSLiverpool]

I think the baloons are too tight now but they are (quite rightly) covering themselves in case of financial armageddon.

As such they are asking you to pay a bit more but if all is well in 4 years you will better off at trade in

Have you considered over 2 / 3 years ?

[michael gould]

pay cash

[Rawwr]

Rick, as for finding the perfect car, just wait. I'm doing the same and there's no real rush. Speak to your local dealer and get them to keep an eye out for you - at least if you give them an idea of colour, trim and desired options, it's surprising how quickly they can find stuff.

As for the finance, consider using a specialist broker rather than going to the fico directly. I know a chap called Peter Waugh who is based out of Royston and I'd definitely recommend you give him a call and explain the situation, chances are that he'll be able to help and if he can't, you can probably treat that as a good indicator that you don't have many options. You can reach him on 01763 242444.

[Soovy]

Finance companies got MASSIVELY burned on Astons (and others) on balloons and people handing back cars half way through.

A bloke here bought a DB9 new on a balloon, and ended up handing it back to the finance company half way. It was worth about £20k less than he owed!

[Murph7355]

rick111s said:

... I can afford to do the deal how (subject to selling the porsche) but it's just not sitting well with me for the little i would use it etc....

I don't understand this Rick...

Ultimately you're paying the same for the car, or potentially a chunk more, using finance versus any other means of paying for it. So why does this matter? Why would you feel better not using a car that you're paying a finance company for??

Have you considered flogging the Porsche first, see what you can get for it. Then approaching a bank for a loan and walking into a dealer with a bagful of cash? With the way things are at the moment, on an older used DB9 I would have thought this would be a much better approach all round (assuming you don't have the funds to do it without a loan).

Agree that the residual is likely to be much higher than 18k in 4yrs. But you simply never know for sure with high end cars. So much can happen in 4yrs.

While it's no doubt still possible to leverage finance to keep funds liquid for other investments etc (how many genuinely do this...?), I'm more and more thinking that we all need to wake up and smell the coffee with what's happened to the economy over the last couple of years. Too many risks being taken by too many people is what caused the ste we're in.

[tuscaneer]

rick111s said:

Hi all,

i wonder if anyone on here can offer me any advice please..?

I currently run a 996t which in october comes to the end of it's 4 year finance agreement. The balloon is less then what the car is worth so i've got some cash left it in.

I had "stupidly" thought that i would be able to basically match the same kind of finance deal that i got on the porsche 4 years ago (my financial position had not really changed since then etc) as i've got the same kind of deposit (15k) i had back then so i starting looking at cars for about the came money as my porsche was (55k mark).

However after talking to several finance companies i cannot get anywhere near the same kind of offer.
I now understand that finance has changed a lot since then but my porsche is really hardly used nor would the aston be due (about 2k a year) to work / family and access to other cars.

I had wanted to try and keep the repayments to approx the same per month (under £500 p/m) but it means that i need to spend approx £60 to £90 more per month and look at cars just under the 50k bracket or put in close to 20k deposit to reduce the payments - again i cannot justify that.

Like most owners i want to be a bit fussy and get as close to a perfect car for me as i can but the balloons are really making the monthly payment more then i can really justify for the little use it would get and it also means that i need to look at cars under the 50k mark. Which is not a problem - i'm lucky to be in this position but i had wanted to be able to get my perfect car - right colour, right spec, low mileage etc. Most of the cars i've seen on the net are almost there but something with each is wrong.

i know that in four years time the lower balloon means i'm in a far better place financially and i also know that for the kind of money above i could join a car club but it's not me. I want the car in the garage for when i want to use it (meant in a nice way)

Does anyone know of a finance company that is able to get a balloon on a used aston above the 20k mark as this would then lower the monthly repayments closer to where i am at the moment and sit better with me. Best i can get balloon wise is about 18k - I can afford to do the deal how (subject to selling the porsche) but it's just not sitting well with me for the little i would use it etc.

Or do i need to realise that things have change for the finance companies and i need to accept the higher payments on a lower priced car? Just doesn't seem that great a deal.

My finance history is fine and i can afford to own and run an aston but I've been told it's based on the residual on the car (not me) and finance companies worrying i might give it back through the agreement. I had even asked if i can sign a doc waving this right in return for a higher balloon but no luck there. I struggle to see how on a 50k car with me doing low mileage how it could not be worth 30k in 4 years time so a balloon of say 23k or 24k will still leave me with money in it. I dont want to have to sell my soul to get into any car (not that car mad) but i do want to feel like i've got a good deal on the finance.

am i missing something?

Sorry if any of the above offends. I know the recession has been hard on people and i'm very luckly to have the porsche let alone sell it and walk into an aston but at 38 years old i dont want to grow up just yet and buy a sensible family car..

thanks in advance
thanks
Rick

i don't know the ins and outs of it fella, but have you thought about just selling the porker and taking out a contract hire deal??i think you can even do it tax efficiently if you have your own company(don't quote me!)

[rick111s]

hi all,

thanks for the advice and comments.

Rawwr thanks! - i'll give him a call.

I dont want to sell the porsche yet in case i cannot get the deal that i think is right for me and then i'm without that car. What i am hoping to find is a finance company that will give me a slightly higher balloon then the 18k by not only looking at the car but also me as a financial risk.

I agree that balloons were too high 4 years back on certain models but i don't think that what i'm asking for it too much or would leave me or them too exposed. I am i imagine going to find out differently and it will be a case of either keeping the porsche and watching till things change or paying the extra and getting the db9.

thanks again for the comments
Rick

[toofastforme]

Don't want to sound dismissive, but you ought to consider whether you can really afford to buy one of these cars. Scraping together the money for a deposit is one thing, but the cost of ownership shouldn't be underestimated especially on a used model.

[rick111s]

toofastforme said:

Don't want to sound dismissive, but you ought to consider whether you can really afford to buy one of these cars. Scraping together the money for a deposit is one thing, but the cost of ownership shouldn't be underestimated especially on a used model.

Valid point and your not sounding dismissive.

i can afford to run it. i currently spend about 2k to 2.5k per year running the porsche (that included the warranty etc which i know i wont have on the aston) I do have a very low mortage and a fair amount of disposable income each month, credit card is paid off monthly so unless it's a major major breakdown i'm covered on a monthly basis but it's a valid point as you not know my finances. I'm not scrapping the deposit together either. Even after putting in the 15k i won't touch any of my rainly day savings. Don't get me wrong i'm not minted (depends on your point of view i imagine) i work hard for my money and the last thing i want is to have to change my lifestyle for any car. I've always been sensible with my personnal and the two companies i co-own finances so all i'm trying to do is to get the best finance deal i can.

i've budgeted on 3k per year for running costs. Does that sound about right? I intend to use rick@ DMS who seem to be the specialist to go for.

Edited by rick111s on Thursday 10th June 15:45

[mikey k]

A few friends have used these guys for financing 911's & Maseratis

http://www.classicandsportsfinance.com/

[rick111s]

mikey k said:

A few friends have used these guys for financing 911's & Maseratis

http://www.classicandsportsfinance.com/

thanks for that.

I've emailed over an online enquiry.

[RichB]

Murph7355 said:

Have you considered flogging the Porsche first, see what you can get for it. Then approaching a bank for a loan and walking into a dealer with a bagful of cash? With the way things are at the moment, on an older used DB9 I would have thought this would be a much better approach...

Given that the dealer probably makes a commission on selling finance plans I wouldn't have thought it would make any difference. Certainly that was my experience recently, the Merc dealer was very keen to sell finance and the dealer from where I bought my Porsche made no concession to the negotiated price whether it was financed or paid in full in cash, which it was.

[JohnG1]

RichB said:

Murph7355 said:

Have you considered flogging the Porsche first, see what you can get for it. Then approaching a bank for a loan and walking into a dealer with a bagful of cash? With the way things are at the moment, on an older used DB9 I would have thought this would be a much better approach...

Given that the dealer probably makes a commission on selling finance plans I wouldn't have thought it would make any difference. Certainly that was my experience recently, the Merc dealer was very keen to sell finance and the dealer from where I bought my Porsche made no concession to the negotiated price whether it was financed or paid in full in cash, which it was.

Note sure if it's still true but about three years ago I was told by a senior chap in a firm that owns a chain of dealers that - at that time - a dealer will make more on finance than on selling the car.

I've always paid cash for my cars but I always get someone trying to sell me finance - I once got the hump and walked out of a Porsche dealer when the guy said "cash or finance" and after I replied cash he tried to insist I listen to the finance deal "because the FSA insist" - I smiled and walked out the door and bought the porker elsewhere...

[michael gould]

JohnG1 said:

RichB said:

Murph7355 said:

Have you considered flogging the Porsche first, see what you can get for it. Then approaching a bank for a loan and walking into a dealer with a bagful of cash? With the way things are at the moment, on an older used DB9 I would have thought this would be a much better approach...

Given that the dealer probably makes a commission on selling finance plans I wouldn't have thought it would make any difference. Certainly that was my experience recently, the Merc dealer was very keen to sell finance and the dealer from where I bought my Porsche made no concession to the negotiated price whether it was financed or paid in full in cash, which it was.

Note sure if it's still true but about three years ago I was told by a senior chap in a firm that owns a chain of dealers that - at that time - a dealer will make more on finance than on selling the car.

I've always paid cash for my cars but I always get someone trying to sell me finance - I once got the hump and walked out of a Porsche dealer when the guy said "cash or finance" and after I replied cash he tried to insist I listen to the finance deal "because the FSA insist" - I smiled and walked out the door and bought the porker elsewhere...

had the same experience when buying my wife a BMW for cash....the tried to sell me gap insurance/finance insisting it was FSA rules......all a load of bks

[RichB]

michael gould said:

...the tried to sell me gap insurance/finance insisting it was FSA rules......all a load of bks

Indeed, I just listened to the story and said no thanks, maybe I'm too tolerant

[S1M VP]

I got out the finance trap years ago, then let my lust for a 911 turbo get the better of me.

£25k deposit, £450/mth, £28k balloon ... And 4yrs of everyday use meant I owed them £3k on top of what I sold it for privately and lost my £25k deposit.

I am all for having what you want, but justto offer another opinion;

why not take the £500/month + £2-3k pa in running costs and leave it for 2-3yrs so you can buy outright rather than financing yourself up to the hilt.

[tuscaneer]

S1M VP said:

I got out the finance trap years ago, then let my lust for a 911 turbo get the better of me.

£25k deposit, £450/mth, £28k balloon ... And 4yrs of everyday use meant I owed them £3k on top of what I sold it for privately and lost my £25k deposit.

I am all for having what you want, but justto offer another opinion;

why not take the £500/month + £2-3k pa in running costs and leave it for 2-3yrs so you can buy outright rather than financing yourself up to the hilt.

that sounded like a horror story until i thought about it.if you look at it another way it's cost you 50 grand to drive a 911 turbo for 4 years.that's only about 12 1/2 grand a year + consumables.not a massive amount of money if you look at it that way.

[DSLiverpool]

tuscaneer said:

S1M VP said:

I got out the finance trap years ago, then let my lust for a 911 turbo get the better of me.

£25k deposit, £450/mth, £28k balloon ... And 4yrs of everyday use meant I owed them £3k on top of what I sold it for privately and lost my £25k deposit.

I am all for having what you want, but justto offer another opinion;

why not take the £500/month + £2-3k pa in running costs and leave it for 2-3yrs so you can buy outright rather than financing yourself up to the hilt.

that sounded like a horror story until i thought about it.if you look at it another way it's cost you 50 grand to drive a 911 turbo for 4 years.that's only about 12 1/2 grand a year + consumables.not a massive amount of money if you look at it that way.

Thats not a bad deal - issue is the monthly payments should have been £750 - you have paid at the front and back of the deal not in the middle - you have to pay somewhere

[tuscaneer]

that's kind of the way i see it as well fella. in the region of 90 grand car,if you insist on paying cash you still have to accumulate 90 grand in the first place.i personally have a figure in my mind that i am quite happy to spend on motors every year.it keeps more funds liquid for spot deals on work related stuff.what to do with 90 grand right now? i would buy a wreck of a terraced house,put new windows and doors on it.new roof,central heating etc.immediately put 40 grand on the value of the property and bring in about 7 or 8 grand a year in rents.then finance half of a new car out of the rents!!if i took the 90 grand and just sank it into a new v8 i'd lose 15 grand just driving it off the forecourt.