Vantage V12 in the wet?
Discussion
I have had a couple of test drives booked in the past which have been cancelled due to adverse weather conditions (snow and surface water). For those who have a V12 - what's it like in the wet on a public road? For me a V12 would be a weekends/fun days only car (not a daily driver) but I don't want to find that it's too much of a beast to be driven in typical British weather.
I have driven about 1000 miles over the past two weeks on standard tyres and had no problems at all. Just the final mile of my journey home last week in a reasonable amount of snow (4 inches settled and beginning to compact) after leaving A roads when I had to take it fairly carefully. I had a great drive down to Hay on Wye at the weekend across to Worcester/Leominster/Hay - a great road to enjoy driving on. Can't wait for the summer though when I can really test what is an uncanny level of grip.
I have just rounded 2000 miles. I use my V12 Vantage as a daily driver and after going sidewards in a roundabout just after i got it back in November I opted for a set of Pirelli Soto Zero wintertyres which proved to be a good decision as they have performed excellently over the winter and in wet conditions. The standard Pirelli P Zero Corsas do not provide sufficient grip below 7 degrees and are very poor at dispersing water so I would not recommend driving the car with the standard tyres in this kind of environment. With the winter tyres you still get the traction control to react in 1st 2nd and 3rd gear due to the monumental torque of the V12 engine but it is never unsafe and you can really push it.
On the standard tyres there is a noticeable difference once you have warmed up the tyres - only in the winter you rarely reach those operating temperatures.
On the standard tyres there is a noticeable difference once you have warmed up the tyres - only in the winter you rarely reach those operating temperatures.
Edited by clorenzen on Wednesday 24th February 03:29
Any views on aquaplaning? I have been told that the standard tyres are very prone to aquaplaning.
I don't mind slowing down when wet and leaving bigger gaps and margins of error but I don't want to find that a drive in the wet turns into squeaky bum time!
I am trying to decide between 911 turbo, Gallardo or V12V for the next car (or just stick with the V8 and maybe add a few enhancements) and I don't want a car that is too much of a beast...
I don't mind slowing down when wet and leaving bigger gaps and margins of error but I don't want to find that a drive in the wet turns into squeaky bum time!
I am trying to decide between 911 turbo, Gallardo or V12V for the next car (or just stick with the V8 and maybe add a few enhancements) and I don't want a car that is too much of a beast...
I drive a 997tt and a V12 Vantage and the V12 Vantage is much more lively with the rear end than the turbo - which also makes it much more fun to drive as it is easy to control. It is virtually impossible to get the traction control to cut in on the Porsche but with the V12 Vantage it comes on quite often. See the V12 Vantage more as a GT3. A feature of the Pirelli P Zero Corsas is the that the thread debt is reduced which make them more prone to aquaplaning but as earlier threads reveal it is manageable but requires respect. The 997tt has Michelin Pilot Sports and 4 wheel drive which is completely different from the Astons 510 HP over the rear wheels with essentially track day tyres. However the winter tyres solve this issue in the colder months and I have no hesitation in using the V12 Vantage as a daily driver as a result. The linear torque of the engine makes this car addictive to drive.
I agree with the GT3 comparison - I have owned both and the key is the tyres. In both cases the grip in the dry is phenominal and the shallow grooves disperse less water in very wet conditions. I researched the use of winter tyres and was finally told by Aston that winter tyres were not recommended for the UK market for a typical UK winter. This year has been exceptional but I have used standard tyres throughout driving 2500 miles from late November. I accept all the points made by Clorenzen but I would add that providing you are sensible about driving in bad conditions and also avoid the very rare occasion that aquaplaneing is a real issue from exceptionally heavy rain then you will have no problem. The more that I have driven the V12V this winter the more that I have become confident in its abilities. I drive fast but I hope not foolishly and so far no scary moments. The 997 GT3 I owned did give pause for thought on a couple of occasions. For extra confidence you can invest in winter tyres (probably too late for this year) but, as I have said, both my dealer and AM advised against it on both need and economic terms. You will however get a written warning about driving carefully in adverse conditions and the need to be aware at driving below 7 deg C.
I have a manual DB9, not a V12V, so I'm a little down on torque and power, but I have the same experience. Thre rear end is lively in cold and wet conditions, but controllable (unless and until I fail to control it!).
I've always had winter tyres on my M5 from end of November to late March and the only real issue is that they lack dry grip in warmer temperatures, but that has not been much of a problem this year!
I've always had winter tyres on my M5 from end of November to late March and the only real issue is that they lack dry grip in warmer temperatures, but that has not been much of a problem this year!
WantanewV12V said:
For extra confidence you can invest in winter tyres (probably too late for this year) but, as I have said, both my dealer and AM advised against it on both need and economic terms.
Unless the wear rates are very different the only long term cost will be having the tyres swapped twice a year. That's assuming you don't buy a set of winter wheels as well...Captain Beaky said:
WantanewV12V said:
For extra confidence you can invest in winter tyres (probably too late for this year) but, as I have said, both my dealer and AM advised against it on both need and economic terms.
Unless the wear rates are very different the only long term cost will be having the tyres swapped twice a year. That's assuming you don't buy a set of winter wheels as well...WantanewV12V said:
Captain Beaky said:
WantanewV12V said:
For extra confidence you can invest in winter tyres (probably too late for this year) but, as I have said, both my dealer and AM advised against it on both need and economic terms.
Unless the wear rates are very different the only long term cost will be having the tyres swapped twice a year. That's assuming you don't buy a set of winter wheels as well...Presumably in properly cold countries the advice is different ?
The window where the Pirelli Sottozero (wintertyres) work better than the Pirelli Zero Corsas is below 7 degrees and in the wet. Hence, for most of this winter we have been in an environment here in the UK where the winter tyres have been the better option. I have done 2200 miles on the winter tyres and have had hardly any wear so the additional costs come down to two trips to the dealership for the swap and a set of rims as the wintertyres do not fit the polished aluminum standard rims. The costs for the additional wheels is app. 1500 pounds (with tyres app 5k in total) and they look quite racy so for peace of mind and safe driving it is small extra to pay. This morning it was still only 2 degrees so I will probably swap towards the end of the month and then report wether there is any difference in performance as I only driven with the standard tyres for the first 200 miles before I decided to change after I went sidewards in the Robin Hood roundabout early one Sunday in the wet and on a cold set of tyres.
Captain Beaky said:
JohnG1 said:
ok, so it's +1 for winter tyres and +1 for just using the regular tyres...
I think I'll just have to get a test drive set up and have a see for myself...
Maybe one on each set of tyres ? I think I'll just have to get a test drive set up and have a see for myself...
clorenzen said:
The window where the Pirelli Sottozero (wintertyres) work better than the Pirelli Zero Corsas is below 7 degrees and in the wet. Hence, for most of this winter we have been in an environment here in the UK where the winter tyres have been the better option. I have done 2200 miles on the winter tyres and have had hardly any wear so the additional costs come down to two trips to the dealership for the swap and a set of rims as the wintertyres do not fit the polished aluminum standard rims. The costs for the additional wheels is app. 1500 pounds (with tyres app 5k in total) and they look quite racy so for peace of mind and safe driving it is small extra to pay. This morning it was still only 2 degrees so I will probably swap towards the end of the month and then report wether there is any difference in performance as I only driven with the standard tyres for the first 200 miles before I decided to change after I went sidewards in the Robin Hood roundabout early one Sunday in the wet and on a cold set of tyres.
The winter set of tyres and wheels has come down in price and now should be around the £3000.00, that is for the wheels tyres, new tyre pressure sensors, fitting and balancing and the vat, these have proved to be popular with V12 Vantage owners and the difference in the cold and wet is quite noticeable, Edited by rick-derby- on Wednesday 3rd March 10:28
I have just changed back to summer tyres and as the morning temperature was around zero degrees I can now compare one to one. So here is the initial impression. In cold temperatures (below 7 degrees) it is very difficult to get the summer tyres up to ideal operating temperatures and every standing start pretty much involves a degree of spinning the wheels whereas with the winter tyres this doesn't happen. The summer tyres are more prone to tram lining due to the increased width and are noticeable quieter on the open road. There is less steering judder when maneuvering in tight places where the power steering has to work overtime. All in all the two sets of tyres complement each other perfectly so I can really recommend it (next winter). The winter tyres are not only safer in colder temperatures but will allow you to accelerate harder without loosing the tail. In the wet this is even more pronounced.
The only issue i have now is that it shows "tyre system fault" in the display. So will probably have to go back to the dealer for a bit of finetuning if it doesn't go away.
...and forgot that it is somewhat lower than with the wintertyres so grounded the spoiler twice in the gravel outside our drive - ouch!
The only issue i have now is that it shows "tyre system fault" in the display. So will probably have to go back to the dealer for a bit of finetuning if it doesn't go away.
...and forgot that it is somewhat lower than with the wintertyres so grounded the spoiler twice in the gravel outside our drive - ouch!
Edited by clorenzen on Saturday 6th March 17:02
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