Discussion
I'm considering a V12V S, ideally a convertible.
I hear such differing views about the SS3 gearbox. There's not one near me, so I don't want to waste a journey (or the dealer's time) if I'm going to hate it. Any informed opinions gratefully received. My experience are largely McLaren and Ferrari DCT boxes, though I did have a V8V 4.3 manual as my first "proper" car.
I want to tick the V12 front engine box before they're not around anymore, and starting from £65k it feels like a relatively safe place to put some money for a year or two. From the age of some of the adverts, though, I'm guessing they are a bit of a hard sell for some reason when I'd try to move it on - probably the gearbox.
If you look at Seen Through Glasse's video, he loves it. But JayEmm presents it as an insurmountable flaw. For me this will be a weekend car, maybe 3k miles a year, I have another car for London daily driving. I wouldn't be buying it for it to be a mile muncher, nor would I expect recent technology - I just want something that is involving and makes me smile (the fact that it is one of the most beautiful shapes ever devised is also a nice to have). Thanks.
I hear such differing views about the SS3 gearbox. There's not one near me, so I don't want to waste a journey (or the dealer's time) if I'm going to hate it. Any informed opinions gratefully received. My experience are largely McLaren and Ferrari DCT boxes, though I did have a V8V 4.3 manual as my first "proper" car.
I want to tick the V12 front engine box before they're not around anymore, and starting from £65k it feels like a relatively safe place to put some money for a year or two. From the age of some of the adverts, though, I'm guessing they are a bit of a hard sell for some reason when I'd try to move it on - probably the gearbox.
If you look at Seen Through Glasse's video, he loves it. But JayEmm presents it as an insurmountable flaw. For me this will be a weekend car, maybe 3k miles a year, I have another car for London daily driving. I wouldn't be buying it for it to be a mile muncher, nor would I expect recent technology - I just want something that is involving and makes me smile (the fact that it is one of the most beautiful shapes ever devised is also a nice to have). Thanks.
You have to remove yourself from the idea that they are automatic or dual clutch , it is neither .
It’s a manual gearbox without a clutch pedal ,and whilst it can be used in an auto mode it is best used by utilising the paddles .
If you get your head around that it is fine ,and in respect of involvement one could argue it is better than autos/dct .
It’s a manual gearbox without a clutch pedal ,and whilst it can be used in an auto mode it is best used by utilising the paddles .
If you get your head around that it is fine ,and in respect of involvement one could argue it is better than autos/dct .
I agree with frankie68. The motoring journos tend not to like the SS3 gearbox because it isn’t a superfast dual clutch, and it isn’t a three pedal manual. And it isn’t either of things - so to that extent they are right.
But it requires a degree of learning and control to get the most out of it; less so than a manual but more so than a dual clutch shift. It is noticeably slower to shift than Porsche’s PDK box, but (at least IMO) it suits the car a bit more, because the V12VS is a much more analogue, old school car.
I ran a manual GT4 alongside mine for a while, and all that did was underline to me that whilst a manual gearbox can be satisfying to use, more often than not I was left thinking that I could have changed gear slightly more smoothly, or more rapidly, or with a slightly different timing. I’m sure than had I stuck at it for more than a year I would have (re-)honed my manual gearbox skills. But I remember feeling that the SS3 made shifting a lot more precise and only a little bit less involving. For what it is worth, I have a PDK-equipped car as well now, and shifting in that might as well be a video game.
But it requires a degree of learning and control to get the most out of it; less so than a manual but more so than a dual clutch shift. It is noticeably slower to shift than Porsche’s PDK box, but (at least IMO) it suits the car a bit more, because the V12VS is a much more analogue, old school car.
I ran a manual GT4 alongside mine for a while, and all that did was underline to me that whilst a manual gearbox can be satisfying to use, more often than not I was left thinking that I could have changed gear slightly more smoothly, or more rapidly, or with a slightly different timing. I’m sure than had I stuck at it for more than a year I would have (re-)honed my manual gearbox skills. But I remember feeling that the SS3 made shifting a lot more precise and only a little bit less involving. For what it is worth, I have a PDK-equipped car as well now, and shifting in that might as well be a video game.
franki68 said:
You have to remove yourself from the idea that they are automatic or dual clutch , it is neither .
It’s a manual gearbox without a clutch pedal ,and whilst it can be used in an auto mode it is best used by utilising the paddles .
If you get your head around that it is fine ,and in respect of involvement one could argue it is better than autos/dct .
This is the perfect summary. Forget the comfort of an autobox or the speed of a porsche pdk.It’s a manual gearbox without a clutch pedal ,and whilst it can be used in an auto mode it is best used by utilising the paddles .
If you get your head around that it is fine ,and in respect of involvement one could argue it is better than autos/dct .
It's like a manual, slightly lift your foot from the accelerator when shifting up (as you would do with a manual gearbox) and the shift will be as rewardng as slow. If you are driving hard, you can keep you foot on the accelerator, though.
It takes a while but the SSII and SSIII (basically the same HW) are definitely not too bad.
If the car is a keeper I would nayhow stretch my budget a little bit and go for a real three pedal manual.
Thanks very much. I had considered the manual but I live in the South East, there's just so much traffic everywhere I think I'd find a manual tiring. I ran my V8V when I lived in Islington and my God did I get a tired left foot going up and down the Euston Road.
I think I'm going to find the car I want, work out a price, and see if I can test drive before committing a deposit. I'm so conscious of coming across as a test pilot.
My other convertibles have been folding hardtop. And obviously no real compromise in my Mclaren in particular. What are the downsides of the convertible for anyone who has been in one? Is the noise too bad? Meaningful scuttle shake?
I think I'm going to find the car I want, work out a price, and see if I can test drive before committing a deposit. I'm so conscious of coming across as a test pilot.
My other convertibles have been folding hardtop. And obviously no real compromise in my Mclaren in particular. What are the downsides of the convertible for anyone who has been in one? Is the noise too bad? Meaningful scuttle shake?
My standards may be low (the AM replaced a boxster spyder, the one with the bikini top) but I find the AM soft top superb in terms of insulation, noise, temperature and interior lining quality/
Surprisingly is as well decently fast and you do not have to come to a full stop to open/close it.
Make sure it does not fail... Or make sure to have the aston extended warranty up and running.
Mine just leaked (I still do not know why, it's at dealer place) but spare parts prices are... well... interesting.
https://www.scuderiacarparts.com/part-finder/aston...
https://www.scuderiacarparts.com/part-finder/aston...
Surprisingly is as well decently fast and you do not have to come to a full stop to open/close it.
Make sure it does not fail... Or make sure to have the aston extended warranty up and running.
Mine just leaked (I still do not know why, it's at dealer place) but spare parts prices are... well... interesting.
https://www.scuderiacarparts.com/part-finder/aston...
https://www.scuderiacarparts.com/part-finder/aston...
As said already SS3 is an automated manual but doesn’t mean it’s still not huge fun to drive.
The D ( fully auto ) button should never be pressed - paddles work fine.
A slight toe curl when up shifting is all that is required.
In heavy traffic ( mine was a daily ) I found the SS more comfortable to live with than the manual V8 mine replaced.
The D ( fully auto ) button should never be pressed - paddles work fine.
A slight toe curl when up shifting is all that is required.
In heavy traffic ( mine was a daily ) I found the SS more comfortable to live with than the manual V8 mine replaced.
The automated manual just takes time to get used to. Given time, lots of owners come to love the quirkiness and required driver involvement and interaction. Almost the exact same system was fitted to thousands of performance BMW, Ferrari, Lamborghini etc. These 'F1' automated boxes are nowhere near as bad as some like to make out and are a part of history.
Ignore any 'influencer' unless it's Harry Metcalfe. It might be on video, but it's just an (often spoilt) individuals opinion - usually based on a relatively short time with the car. As someone once pointed out, opinions are like a
holes, everyone has one.
If it must be a V12, and a manual (twin plate clutch on V12 will have a slightly lighter pedal) is out of reach or not desired, but an auto is just too numb, then the SS may be made for you. Just give it time, ideally have an extended test with a co-pilot who can show/demonstrate how to get the best out of it and let you know how to 'work around' its principal weakness - low speed manoeuvring.
Ignore any 'influencer' unless it's Harry Metcalfe. It might be on video, but it's just an (often spoilt) individuals opinion - usually based on a relatively short time with the car. As someone once pointed out, opinions are like a
holes, everyone has one. If it must be a V12, and a manual (twin plate clutch on V12 will have a slightly lighter pedal) is out of reach or not desired, but an auto is just too numb, then the SS may be made for you. Just give it time, ideally have an extended test with a co-pilot who can show/demonstrate how to get the best out of it and let you know how to 'work around' its principal weakness - low speed manoeuvring.
Edited by Calinours on Sunday 17th November 15:44
Well, most has been said on the SportshiftIII gearbox on here already and I can only agree with previous comments.
Gearbox is great, never use D, consider it as a manual without a clutch pedal and you’ll be fine.
There’s great enjoyment in learning to do the near perfect shift and a short test drive might not reveal this.
I can also give you some info on the convertible as I own one, it’s properly insulated and mine’s a bit noisy as I have the titanium exhaust that comes with the Performance Pack but trying to remember how it sounded before I fitted the Pack, the noise level was pretty decent as opposed to now, but my exhaust valves are permanently open since I took the exhaust valve fuse out.
For me it’s an occasional fun car so that works.
Happy to let you have a drive in mine whenever you are on the French Riviera.
A pic of mine with Fernando’s company car!
Gearbox is great, never use D, consider it as a manual without a clutch pedal and you’ll be fine.
There’s great enjoyment in learning to do the near perfect shift and a short test drive might not reveal this.
I can also give you some info on the convertible as I own one, it’s properly insulated and mine’s a bit noisy as I have the titanium exhaust that comes with the Performance Pack but trying to remember how it sounded before I fitted the Pack, the noise level was pretty decent as opposed to now, but my exhaust valves are permanently open since I took the exhaust valve fuse out.
For me it’s an occasional fun car so that works.
Happy to let you have a drive in mine whenever you are on the French Riviera.
A pic of mine with Fernando’s company car!
Cod
once youget used to the slight lift off the accel;erator as you change gear its a great gearbox
it has one unusual quirk which you need to get used to
as you slow down, say coming to an intersection it will change down gear automatically for you to match the speed, if you are almost stopped (below about 15km/hour it will look for 1st) if you are not careful it can change just as you intend to accelerate across / into the intersection and it gets very lumpy/ hesitates then grabs the gear when that happens
its often better to actually stop, or to change down into 1st, then accelerate so you and the car know which gear yopuvare in
other than that its a hoot (& it was the first non manual car I'd owned) but I love it
I have it 6 years done 60,00km and its the longest I have ever owned a car - its a fixture in the garage
Graze
once youget used to the slight lift off the accel;erator as you change gear its a great gearbox
it has one unusual quirk which you need to get used to
as you slow down, say coming to an intersection it will change down gear automatically for you to match the speed, if you are almost stopped (below about 15km/hour it will look for 1st) if you are not careful it can change just as you intend to accelerate across / into the intersection and it gets very lumpy/ hesitates then grabs the gear when that happens
its often better to actually stop, or to change down into 1st, then accelerate so you and the car know which gear yopuvare in
other than that its a hoot (& it was the first non manual car I'd owned) but I love it
I have it 6 years done 60,00km and its the longest I have ever owned a car - its a fixture in the garage
Graze
Graze01 said:
Cod
once youget used to the slight lift off the accel;erator as you change gear its a great gearbox
it has one unusual quirk which you need to get used to
as you slow down, say coming to an intersection it will change down gear automatically for you to match the speed, if you are almost stopped (below about 15km/hour it will look for 1st) if you are not careful it can change just as you intend to accelerate across / into the intersection and it gets very lumpy/ hesitates then grabs the gear when that happens
its often better to actually stop, or to change down into 1st, then accelerate so you and the car know which gear yopuvare in
other than that its a hoot (& it was the first non manual car I'd owned) but I love it
I have it 6 years done 60,00km and its the longest I have ever owned a car - its a fixture in the garage
Graze
OP - This is exactly the sort of tip that someone experienced with the system can show you on a test drive. It is possible to avoid the low speed lurching that can make the uninitiated loath the automated 'box. once youget used to the slight lift off the accel;erator as you change gear its a great gearbox
it has one unusual quirk which you need to get used to
as you slow down, say coming to an intersection it will change down gear automatically for you to match the speed, if you are almost stopped (below about 15km/hour it will look for 1st) if you are not careful it can change just as you intend to accelerate across / into the intersection and it gets very lumpy/ hesitates then grabs the gear when that happens
its often better to actually stop, or to change down into 1st, then accelerate so you and the car know which gear yopuvare in
other than that its a hoot (& it was the first non manual car I'd owned) but I love it
I have it 6 years done 60,00km and its the longest I have ever owned a car - its a fixture in the garage
Graze
Imagine you are co-driving a car with a passenger, like one of these corporate team-build events.
You as driver are in control of the wheel, and have two pedals, throttle and brakes, but your passenger controls clutch and stick, and crucially also the ignition key. There's two ways to drive the car - where the passenger dips the clutch and changes gear as fast as he or she can - but only when you as driver command him ie 'manual mode'. The other way to drive the car is 'auto mode' where the passenger can change gear when they think that it's a good time, but they must always cut engine power while shifting by briefly switching off ignition (to be able to shift).
Obviously it's always be going to be a smoother drive when you as driver command the change (manual mode), especially at medium accelerations as you can moderate the throttle to remove load and subconsciously pre-brace for the brief lapse in acceleration because you know it's going to happen (exactly as in any manual car).
As you learn how your passenger reacts to your commands, how fast he or she gets the clutch in and out and how smoothly they change, and perhaps more importantly in real life situations, how they feather the clutch in low speed manoeuvres, you learn to work better with the passenger, communicate better and anticipate the reaction and action of the passenger better. Over time you develop the ability to drive the car very smoothly. But unlike a slush box auto or a more modern clutch box (DCT, PDK etc) - it does take time to learn and always requires driver interaction.
I have V12 AMR Roadster with SSIII no problem whatsoever.
Have a look at following:-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5IJZSyJ9W8
Also the second video helps even though it is a Vanquish S the same applies to the SSIII re the operation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jegx_WGwpPc
Have a look at following:-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5IJZSyJ9W8
Also the second video helps even though it is a Vanquish S the same applies to the SSIII re the operation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jegx_WGwpPc
I have driven the Vanquish as in that video and it was one of the worst gearboxes i have ever tried.
The same with the Ferrari 575 manual vs F1 they are like two differant car the manual is a joy the F1 terrible.
As for the V12V i have not tried one but owned the manual which for me is the best.
The same with the Ferrari 575 manual vs F1 they are like two differant car the manual is a joy the F1 terrible.
As for the V12V i have not tried one but owned the manual which for me is the best.
SHIFTY said:
I have V12 AMR Roadster with SSIII no problem whatsoever.
Have a look at following:-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5IJZSyJ9W8
No, don't. Just ignore this video - the guy has no idea. Anyone who suggests knocking a Sportshift into neutral and coasting up to a junction does not deserve to be taken seriously. And this weird idea that both he and she seem to have that you have to plan ahead differently because of the gearbox. FFS it's no different to driving a manual - if you have to stop talking because you have to concentrate so hard on deciding which gear to be in as you approach a hazard, like an oncoming car in a narrow road.....words fail me. Have a look at following:-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5IJZSyJ9W8
SHIFTY said:
Also the second video helps even though it is a Vanquish S the same applies to the SSIII re the operation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jegx_WGwpPc
The driver in this is Les Goble, ex-AML driving instructor and he does know what he's talking abouthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jegx_WGwpPc
For what it is worth I have had a 2007 Vanquish S for the last 11 years. Sadly, it has languished in my garage for the last few years with only the odd journey. Last month I decided to take her on a road trip and took her to the South of France returning to the UK earlier this month via Italy, Switzerland, Germany and France. The total mileage covered was about 2,500 miles (adding almost 20% to the total mileage of the car). During that trip I confess that I fell in love with the car, including the gearbox which is a forerunner to the SS3. As others have said it takes some getting used to but it is not rocket science and there is a real pleasure, for example, in learning exactly how much to ease off the throttle to smooth the gear changes which becomes second nature. It is not for everyone but for someone who wants a degree of driver involvement that you do not get with an automatic box it can be very satisfying. The Les Goble video linked by SHIFTY really tells you all you need to know. It actually taught me after some years of ownership that you need to use the handbrake on hillstarts to take the weight of the car as you would on a three-pedal car. Fairly obvious when you think about it. It is no accident that Aston Martin invited all new NP Vanquish owners for driver instruction when they took delivery.
I bought at V12S last year (3 pedal). That really is a very special car and I would encourage OP to buy, whichever transmission he chooses. There really is no other relatively recent V12 production car that can give that sort of nimble experience that feels so analogue.
I bought at V12S last year (3 pedal). That really is a very special car and I would encourage OP to buy, whichever transmission he chooses. There really is no other relatively recent V12 production car that can give that sort of nimble experience that feels so analogue.
OLDBENZ said:
It actually taught me after some years of ownership that you need to use the handbrake on hillstarts to take the weight of the car as you would on a three-pedal car.
To be clear for the OP, the SS3 box in a V12VS has hill hold. The main issue, if it really counts as one, with the SS3 box is that you can’t feather the clutch at low speed in 2 as you would in a manual. There are two solutions: one is to plant the throttle, but this is not workable if you are in a queue of stop-start traffic unless you like either to rear end the car in front or want to leave a big gap to launch into.
The other is to drop manually to 1 at around 5-6 mph, which is what I do.
Gassing Station | Aston Martin | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff