The origins of the Aston Martin Heritage Trust
Discussion
In the early 1990s, the Aston Martin Owners Club faced a problem. Members of the Club were found to be organising events in the name of the AMOC without the Club’s knowledge. If the Club didn’t know about an event, it couldn’t arrange insurance and if something went wrong at the event, the Club feared it could be sued. Notices were put in the Club’s monthly News Sheet encouraging Members to inform the Club Secretary of events they planned to see if the event could be an official AMOC event. To some enthusiastic Members, being asked to submit ideas to the Committee of Management for ratification seemed like petty interference.
In 1989 I had been invited to edit the AMOC monthly News Sheet. With the job came a seat on the Committee of Management.
(Much of the AMOC’s image was shaped by its adherence to its past; the News Sheet was by then an A5 booklet that had retained its name from the time it was sheets of Roneoed paper stapled together. The Committee of Management retained its name from the 1930s but by the early fifties had become the Board of Directors of a Limited Company.)
In awe of both Aston Martin and the AMOC and knowing nothing about committee work, this was a big step for me. Looking back, I can see why there was some resistance to my appointment as I was fairly typical of the Members who thought enthusiasm should come first and rules and regulations a distant second. Joining the Committee of Management tempered that for me as I began to see the amount of work that went on behind the scenes by volunteers and the Secretary, the Club’s first paid employee, and what was at risk. At the time, the Club wasn’t particularly wealthy, it didn’t own its own premises and its wealth, such as it was, was the value of its Archive, its Aston Martin racing memorabilia, the Aston Martin Ulster that had been bequeathed to the Club and cash in the bank. All this was believed to be vulnerable in the event of legal action stemming from an accident at an event held in the name of the Club over which the Club had no knowledge or control.
(The hypothetical example that was discussed was someone being injured by a car at an event in Southern California. If the event they organised - and for which they had spent time and money making AMOC signs and printing AMOC posters – was vetoed by a bunch of fuddy-duddies on the other side of the planet, it wasn’t going to be well received. But if one of them was injured and the event was billed as an AMOC event then the Club feared it could be sued. Unlikely? An actual event, that took place in the UK, was a car gymkhana organised by a Club Area Representative, had Members’ Astons negotiating an obstacle course in a field where the drivers had buckets over their heads while being guided by their passengers. The Club knew nothing of it until photos were submitted for publication.)
All this unfolded before me during my time as editor of the News Sheet. But I was the very inexperienced new boy with ideas that didn’t necessarily sit well with the Committee who had pondered all manner of problems for years. When I asked the Committee if newly appointed Club Area Representatives were given a Welcome Pack of information explaining their duties and responsibilities there was laughter and scoffing around the Committee table. It seemed to me that the elder statesmen of the Club thought Members should know instinctively how to behave. Simple good manners should be enough to steer their actions to the benefit of the Club rather than its detriment.
How to make the Members behave as the Club would like them to behave? The question went round and round and got nowhere.
Around this time, my father believed his estate was at risk from death duties. When I spoke to him, his conversation was dominated by talk of trusts. He would make a trust and my brother and I would be trustees. His estate wasn’t all that big but protecting it was important to him. Meanwhile my brother was involved with a preserved railway that was open to the public and ran passenger carrying trains. He explained how the railway had two distinct parts: the preservation society that owned everything and the railway company that had the responsibility for running trains.
Light bulb moment.
Instead of trying to make Members behave in a particular way that did not leave the Club’s valuables vulnerable, how about creating a trust and removing them from harm’s way? A trust to look after the valuables while the Club carried on as normal.
When I suggested it, the Club asked me to write a discussion document. This I did and it was distributed to Committee members before the Committee of Management meeting in March 1993.
This is where the story gets a bit hazy. The AMOC and AMHT refer to a sub-committee being formed in late 1996 ‘to find a method to safeguard and protect for the Membership the Club’s assets from any legal situation that might arise from the Club’s activities’ and the Aston Martin Heritage Trust being founded in 1998. There is no direct link between my suggestion in 1993 and the creation of the sub-committee in 1996. I believe the idea was bubbling away in the background just waiting to be formalised. Unfortunately, most of the Members of the Club who could help have either died or don't remember.
Finishing up with almost exactly what I suggested a few years earlier feels good. Not being credited with the original suggestion is a real disappointment.
I was going to call the thread 'Ask a disillusioned club member anything' but calling it 'The origins of the Aston Martin Heritage Trust' may allow it to be found in 200 years' time by researchers. You never know.
In 1989 I had been invited to edit the AMOC monthly News Sheet. With the job came a seat on the Committee of Management.
(Much of the AMOC’s image was shaped by its adherence to its past; the News Sheet was by then an A5 booklet that had retained its name from the time it was sheets of Roneoed paper stapled together. The Committee of Management retained its name from the 1930s but by the early fifties had become the Board of Directors of a Limited Company.)
In awe of both Aston Martin and the AMOC and knowing nothing about committee work, this was a big step for me. Looking back, I can see why there was some resistance to my appointment as I was fairly typical of the Members who thought enthusiasm should come first and rules and regulations a distant second. Joining the Committee of Management tempered that for me as I began to see the amount of work that went on behind the scenes by volunteers and the Secretary, the Club’s first paid employee, and what was at risk. At the time, the Club wasn’t particularly wealthy, it didn’t own its own premises and its wealth, such as it was, was the value of its Archive, its Aston Martin racing memorabilia, the Aston Martin Ulster that had been bequeathed to the Club and cash in the bank. All this was believed to be vulnerable in the event of legal action stemming from an accident at an event held in the name of the Club over which the Club had no knowledge or control.
(The hypothetical example that was discussed was someone being injured by a car at an event in Southern California. If the event they organised - and for which they had spent time and money making AMOC signs and printing AMOC posters – was vetoed by a bunch of fuddy-duddies on the other side of the planet, it wasn’t going to be well received. But if one of them was injured and the event was billed as an AMOC event then the Club feared it could be sued. Unlikely? An actual event, that took place in the UK, was a car gymkhana organised by a Club Area Representative, had Members’ Astons negotiating an obstacle course in a field where the drivers had buckets over their heads while being guided by their passengers. The Club knew nothing of it until photos were submitted for publication.)
All this unfolded before me during my time as editor of the News Sheet. But I was the very inexperienced new boy with ideas that didn’t necessarily sit well with the Committee who had pondered all manner of problems for years. When I asked the Committee if newly appointed Club Area Representatives were given a Welcome Pack of information explaining their duties and responsibilities there was laughter and scoffing around the Committee table. It seemed to me that the elder statesmen of the Club thought Members should know instinctively how to behave. Simple good manners should be enough to steer their actions to the benefit of the Club rather than its detriment.
How to make the Members behave as the Club would like them to behave? The question went round and round and got nowhere.
Around this time, my father believed his estate was at risk from death duties. When I spoke to him, his conversation was dominated by talk of trusts. He would make a trust and my brother and I would be trustees. His estate wasn’t all that big but protecting it was important to him. Meanwhile my brother was involved with a preserved railway that was open to the public and ran passenger carrying trains. He explained how the railway had two distinct parts: the preservation society that owned everything and the railway company that had the responsibility for running trains.
Light bulb moment.
Instead of trying to make Members behave in a particular way that did not leave the Club’s valuables vulnerable, how about creating a trust and removing them from harm’s way? A trust to look after the valuables while the Club carried on as normal.
When I suggested it, the Club asked me to write a discussion document. This I did and it was distributed to Committee members before the Committee of Management meeting in March 1993.
This is where the story gets a bit hazy. The AMOC and AMHT refer to a sub-committee being formed in late 1996 ‘to find a method to safeguard and protect for the Membership the Club’s assets from any legal situation that might arise from the Club’s activities’ and the Aston Martin Heritage Trust being founded in 1998. There is no direct link between my suggestion in 1993 and the creation of the sub-committee in 1996. I believe the idea was bubbling away in the background just waiting to be formalised. Unfortunately, most of the Members of the Club who could help have either died or don't remember.
Finishing up with almost exactly what I suggested a few years earlier feels good. Not being credited with the original suggestion is a real disappointment.
I was going to call the thread 'Ask a disillusioned club member anything' but calling it 'The origins of the Aston Martin Heritage Trust' may allow it to be found in 200 years' time by researchers. You never know.
Richard I'm glad you brought this up and I remember quite of bit of the friction setting up the Trust. A certain Mr. Hayes hijacked the idea and made it his own, as he did with many things, and pushed it through. I remember at the meeting in the RAC to form the Trust he threw a hissy fit and stormed out over it. It is sad to see you received no credit for your idea.
ds666 said:
Well done - a wise move . AMHT seems like a good place.
I do fear that some of the less " member focused" people from AMOC are also on the AMHT board ; you know, the ones more interested in the job title than the actual job .
I have absolutely no idea how you could come to that conclusion. Or how they could employ themselves to give advice to the same Board... £50k on crap legal advice springs to mind. I do fear that some of the less " member focused" people from AMOC are also on the AMHT board ; you know, the ones more interested in the job title than the actual job .
Richard, I had not been a member of AMOC for that long when the AMHT and AMOC were effectively splitting and going separate ways. There was general feeling with many AMOC members the AMHT had stolen the clubs Crown Jewels and was walking out the door with them.
Your idea was clever and deserves a great amount of merit. The reality was that the two entities slowly drifted apart. The Charities Commission (I think) were distinctly uncomfortable that AMHT & AMOC Board members were to some extent one and the same group of people and that the AMHT should be not back seat steered by the AMOC.
Suddenly the AMHT was living rent free in the Barn, paying a peppercorn fee for utilities etc. But also burning through there own funding and relying heavily on AMOC subsidies whilst increasingly telling AMOC to keep their nose out of their business. At the time I felt AMOC was badly done to and AMHT were wrong to distance themselves from AMOC ever more clearly.
Then we all started to understand how incompetent the AMOC board was and how much that board was looking at the board members interests rather than the members interests. The percentage of AMOC funds spent entirely within the UK despite a world wide membership was ridiculous. Plus the money spent on racing or appointing a board member or a sub committee member a fee for consulting on AMOC Racing events. The board was dominated by racers and benefitted from these events hugely, but very few members attended them. A QC based in Australia was thrown out for whistle blowing and emailing all members with a few uncomfortable facts.
Then we had the election where the result was disputed and they decided to throw out the opposition despite the legal advice obtained by AMOC saying that was not acceptable or legal. A court case followed. It all got rather out of hand and a breakaway club or two was formed. One growing quite comfortably.
Looking back with hindsight and AMHT was wise to break away in my eyes. It has distanced itself from a very dysfunctional AMOC that is increasingly becoming irrelevant, with shrinking membership and dwindling assets. Run by the red trouser brigade, often described as all male, pale and stale. Failing to attract hardly any Gaydon car drivers/owners, younger people or lady (primary) members. Running less events every year and failing to provide meaningful support to it area reps. Many of which deliver sterling service.
But now the AMHT is running its own festival events and lectures etc, does it not now need a trust to look after its assets? Could it not also be sued if something went wrong?
Your idea was clever and deserves a great amount of merit. The reality was that the two entities slowly drifted apart. The Charities Commission (I think) were distinctly uncomfortable that AMHT & AMOC Board members were to some extent one and the same group of people and that the AMHT should be not back seat steered by the AMOC.
Suddenly the AMHT was living rent free in the Barn, paying a peppercorn fee for utilities etc. But also burning through there own funding and relying heavily on AMOC subsidies whilst increasingly telling AMOC to keep their nose out of their business. At the time I felt AMOC was badly done to and AMHT were wrong to distance themselves from AMOC ever more clearly.
Then we all started to understand how incompetent the AMOC board was and how much that board was looking at the board members interests rather than the members interests. The percentage of AMOC funds spent entirely within the UK despite a world wide membership was ridiculous. Plus the money spent on racing or appointing a board member or a sub committee member a fee for consulting on AMOC Racing events. The board was dominated by racers and benefitted from these events hugely, but very few members attended them. A QC based in Australia was thrown out for whistle blowing and emailing all members with a few uncomfortable facts.
Then we had the election where the result was disputed and they decided to throw out the opposition despite the legal advice obtained by AMOC saying that was not acceptable or legal. A court case followed. It all got rather out of hand and a breakaway club or two was formed. One growing quite comfortably.
Looking back with hindsight and AMHT was wise to break away in my eyes. It has distanced itself from a very dysfunctional AMOC that is increasingly becoming irrelevant, with shrinking membership and dwindling assets. Run by the red trouser brigade, often described as all male, pale and stale. Failing to attract hardly any Gaydon car drivers/owners, younger people or lady (primary) members. Running less events every year and failing to provide meaningful support to it area reps. Many of which deliver sterling service.
But now the AMHT is running its own festival events and lectures etc, does it not now need a trust to look after its assets? Could it not also be sued if something went wrong?
The paradox of the AMHT holding more and more events and thereby running the risks it was founded to avoid is fascinating. The Trust is taking on some of the functions of the Club but without an AGM for supporters to voice their concerns. When the AMHT becomes the Aston Martin Museum a further separation of Club and Trust will occur as, presumably, the aim of the board is to make the museum self-funding.
In 1998, after Aston Martin Review 1997, I stood down from editing and left the AMOC but paid to become a Founder Member of the AMHT. Being a Founder Member of AMHT brought with it Life Membership. Last year I learned that I am no longer a Life Member because the Trust had become a Charitable Incorporated Organisation and was not bound by financial arrangements made in the past when it wasn't a CIO. Looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, claims to be an armadillo. There must be other Founder Members whose contributions have been similarly degraded. The Trust probably thought we had all died
The AMOC honoured its early supporters but the AMHT doesn't.
Editing club magazines is a poisoned chalice; you are going to be unpopular with some members for some reason. Poisoned chalice might be a bit strong but I do wonder if my treatment by the AMHT is personal. In June last year I offered to donate the remainder of my Aston Martin archive to the Trust. It's not huge but there are a few interesting things in there. The Collections Manager was keen but has to submit ideas to the Acquisitions and Disposals Committee for consideration. She did, but by January this year I had heard nothing - not even a 'hold tight, we're on it' - and I not only withdrew my offer but also threw all my spanners down the road and stood down as a supporter of the Trust.
All in all, my feeling is that the Trust has lost sight of what it set out to do. In the past when I had a pop at the Trust on Pistonheads, a prominent supporter asked me 'in a spirit of friendliness and fraternity in the Aston Martin community' to wind my neck in a bit and I did. I no longer feel bound by that arrangement.
In 1998, after Aston Martin Review 1997, I stood down from editing and left the AMOC but paid to become a Founder Member of the AMHT. Being a Founder Member of AMHT brought with it Life Membership. Last year I learned that I am no longer a Life Member because the Trust had become a Charitable Incorporated Organisation and was not bound by financial arrangements made in the past when it wasn't a CIO. Looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, claims to be an armadillo. There must be other Founder Members whose contributions have been similarly degraded. The Trust probably thought we had all died
The AMOC honoured its early supporters but the AMHT doesn't.Editing club magazines is a poisoned chalice; you are going to be unpopular with some members for some reason. Poisoned chalice might be a bit strong but I do wonder if my treatment by the AMHT is personal. In June last year I offered to donate the remainder of my Aston Martin archive to the Trust. It's not huge but there are a few interesting things in there. The Collections Manager was keen but has to submit ideas to the Acquisitions and Disposals Committee for consideration. She did, but by January this year I had heard nothing - not even a 'hold tight, we're on it' - and I not only withdrew my offer but also threw all my spanners down the road and stood down as a supporter of the Trust.
All in all, my feeling is that the Trust has lost sight of what it set out to do. In the past when I had a pop at the Trust on Pistonheads, a prominent supporter asked me 'in a spirit of friendliness and fraternity in the Aston Martin community' to wind my neck in a bit and I did. I no longer feel bound by that arrangement.
Richard,
This really does fit in with my initial thoughts that a petulant child snook into the parents home, stole everything of value (Millions of £) in assets and declared them their own and started squatting in the building without paying rent. The only reason why I now think that was a good think is the shear and total incompetence of the AMOC. Even AML don't bother with them anymore.
Why didn't they take your offer of material? They simply have zero space left. They even store valuable cars outside all year round. It's crazy.
As for them becoming a Museum. Pie in the sky is the thoughts of the AMOC members. Not because it is bad thing, but because not one single large car museum makes a profit. All of them run at a loss with financial support from donations or from manufacturers etc. So how AMHT thinks they will survive and fund the build is a complete loss to anyone with any sense. When these facts have been brought up at meetings they simply claim to know better. The AMHT is currently heavily subsidised by AMOC but that is unlikely to continue forever. Plus AMOC is shrinking year on year.
What will happen to the assets in AMHT and the museum go bankrupt? It might just be that a Trust set up to protect the assets will be the exact cause of them being lost to financiers.
Hopefully that will not happen, but the numbers say otherwise.
This really does fit in with my initial thoughts that a petulant child snook into the parents home, stole everything of value (Millions of £) in assets and declared them their own and started squatting in the building without paying rent. The only reason why I now think that was a good think is the shear and total incompetence of the AMOC. Even AML don't bother with them anymore.
Why didn't they take your offer of material? They simply have zero space left. They even store valuable cars outside all year round. It's crazy.
As for them becoming a Museum. Pie in the sky is the thoughts of the AMOC members. Not because it is bad thing, but because not one single large car museum makes a profit. All of them run at a loss with financial support from donations or from manufacturers etc. So how AMHT thinks they will survive and fund the build is a complete loss to anyone with any sense. When these facts have been brought up at meetings they simply claim to know better. The AMHT is currently heavily subsidised by AMOC but that is unlikely to continue forever. Plus AMOC is shrinking year on year.
What will happen to the assets in AMHT and the museum go bankrupt? It might just be that a Trust set up to protect the assets will be the exact cause of them being lost to financiers.
Hopefully that will not happen, but the numbers say otherwise.
VanquishRider said:
Richard,
This really does fit in with my initial thoughts that a petulant child snook into the parents home, stole everything of value (Millions of £) in assets and declared them their own and started squatting in the building without paying rent. The only reason why I now think that was a good think is the shear and total incompetence of the AMOC. Even AML don't bother with them anymore.
Why didn't they take your offer of material? They simply have zero space left. They even store valuable cars outside all year round. It's crazy.
As for them becoming a Museum. Pie in the sky is the thoughts of the AMOC members. Not because it is bad thing, but because not one single large car museum makes a profit. All of them run at a loss with financial support from donations or from manufacturers etc. So how AMHT thinks they will survive and fund the build is a complete loss to anyone with any sense. When these facts have been brought up at meetings they simply claim to know better. The AMHT is currently heavily subsidised by AMOC but that is unlikely to continue forever. Plus AMOC is shrinking year on year.
What will happen to the assets in AMHT and the museum go bankrupt? It might just be that a Trust set up to protect the assets will be the exact cause of them being lost to financiers.
Hopefully that will not happen, but the numbers say otherwise.
Yes, they are tight for space but they could have dropped me a note to say as much. Seven months with nothing. They could have at least been polite. It doesn't cost much.This really does fit in with my initial thoughts that a petulant child snook into the parents home, stole everything of value (Millions of £) in assets and declared them their own and started squatting in the building without paying rent. The only reason why I now think that was a good think is the shear and total incompetence of the AMOC. Even AML don't bother with them anymore.
Why didn't they take your offer of material? They simply have zero space left. They even store valuable cars outside all year round. It's crazy.
As for them becoming a Museum. Pie in the sky is the thoughts of the AMOC members. Not because it is bad thing, but because not one single large car museum makes a profit. All of them run at a loss with financial support from donations or from manufacturers etc. So how AMHT thinks they will survive and fund the build is a complete loss to anyone with any sense. When these facts have been brought up at meetings they simply claim to know better. The AMHT is currently heavily subsidised by AMOC but that is unlikely to continue forever. Plus AMOC is shrinking year on year.
What will happen to the assets in AMHT and the museum go bankrupt? It might just be that a Trust set up to protect the assets will be the exact cause of them being lost to financiers.
Hopefully that will not happen, but the numbers say otherwise.
Dear Richard, we have your email listing the items you have offered for the archive. Thanks for this but unfortunately we are unable to accommodate it at present due to an acute shortage of space. Would it be okay for us to contact you when matters improve? Yours sincerely, the AMHT.
But they didn't. They sent nothing.
I'm increasingly sure it's personal.
One of the things I offered was John (Lionel's son) Martin's diaries from when he was a boy, outlining life at home with the Martins. I thought they'd be very keen..How long did it take John to run from the house in Edwardes Square to the works? When was the last time the Bensons came to dinner?
Oh, well.
VanquishRider said:
You expected someone at the Barn to tell the truth. How very charitable of you.
The staff at the Barn I've always found friendly and helpful, it's dealing with the Trustees I find a bit of a struggle.The gist of one exchange:
"I paid to be a Founder Member. Paying to be a Founder Member brought with it Life Membership."
"No. You simply made a donation."
"Here's the application form which states: FOUNDER MEMBER A gift of £250 will secure Life Membership."
"That was a long time ago. Things are different now."
DickyC said:
The staff at the Barn I've always found friendly and helpful, it's dealing with the Trustees I find a bit of a struggle.
The gist of one exchange:
"I paid to be a Founder Member. Paying to be a Founder Member brought with it Life Membership."
"No. You simply made a donation."
"Here's the application form which states: FOUNDER MEMBER A gift of £250 will secure Life Membership."
"That was a long time ago. Things are different now."
The gist of one exchange:
"I paid to be a Founder Member. Paying to be a Founder Member brought with it Life Membership."
"No. You simply made a donation."
"Here's the application form which states: FOUNDER MEMBER A gift of £250 will secure Life Membership."
"That was a long time ago. Things are different now."
Two friends are the sons of Eric Cutler.
I expect Eric might have been a man you knew.
The two boys are great car enthusiasts and both enjoyed success motor racing, but never owned any Aston Martins. Perhaps not the ideal car for visiting customers, when explaining imminent price increases.
I was an AMOC member, but lapsed when renewal occurred during the pandemic. My impression was of a good, active local area, but sensed infighting at HQ. Peter Sprague’s account of the goings-on probably summed up the situation. A very successful business man and a rescuer of Aston Martin following administration. Certainly a person who was very well qualified and prepared to help the Club, but they did not want him and so he left.
As for the museum, I was shocked to read that they are storing some cars in the open. A quick way to deterioration. Not difficult to construct a timber protective structure to keep vehicles dry. Inexcusable.
There was some talk about AMHT occupying their own museum building, but I have not read anything about that idea recently.
As for someone saying the museum would be profitable - dream on.
I did enjoy the AMHT gathering at Brooklands.
DickyC said:
The staff at the Barn I've always found friendly and helpful, it's dealing with the Trustees I find a bit of a struggle.
The gist of one exchange:
"I paid to be a Founder Member. Paying to be a Founder Member brought with it Life Membership."
"No. You simply made a donation."
"Here's the application form which states: FOUNDER MEMBER A gift of £250 will secure Life Membership."
"That was a long time ago. Things are different now."
The Ladies are great, but even one of those was given the bullet for sending out nasty emails one New Years eve. The gist of one exchange:
"I paid to be a Founder Member. Paying to be a Founder Member brought with it Life Membership."
"No. You simply made a donation."
"Here's the application form which states: FOUNDER MEMBER A gift of £250 will secure Life Membership."
"That was a long time ago. Things are different now."
Dewi 2 said:
Two friends are the sons of Eric Cutler.
I expect Eric might have been a man you knew.
The two boys are great car enthusiasts and both enjoyed success motor racing, but never owned any Aston Martins. Perhaps not the ideal car for visiting customers, when explaining imminent price increases.
I was an AMOC member, but lapsed when renewal occurred during the pandemic. My impression was of a good, active local area, but sensed infighting at HQ. Peter Sprague’s account of the goings-on probably summed up the situation. A very successful business man and a rescuer of Aston Martin following administration. Certainly a person who was very well qualified and prepared to help the Club, but they did not want him and so he left.
As for the museum, I was shocked to read that they are storing some cars in the open. A quick way to deterioration. Not difficult to construct a timber protective structure to keep vehicles dry. Inexcusable.
There was some talk about AMHT occupying their own museum building, but I have not read anything about that idea recently.
As for someone saying the museum would be profitable - dream on.
I did enjoy the AMHT gathering at Brooklands.
The printer contract was fun when that hit the AMOC forum. Apparently you could have bought the same printer 3 times over and bought toner and paper for a million copies for less than half what the then office manager had signed for without the committees permission. It was so bad the refused point blank to tell the members what the figures actually were.
If it wasn't so sad it would be funny.
VanquishRider said:
A serving Police Officer was elected to the board. He resigned after the first meeting for fear of being implicated in the goings on. He raised his concerns and was given short shrift.
The printer contract was fun when that hit the AMOC forum. Apparently you could have bought the same printer 3 times over and bought toner and paper for a million copies for less than half what the then office manager had signed for without the committees permission. It was so bad the refused point blank to tell the members what the figures actually were.
If it wasn't so sad it would be funny.
Can we please not re-run the farce that is the recent AMOC on here? What with the legal cases, CoM shenanigans, etc. I left there solely because of the goings on, and I now believe there is another organisation for the disaffected (or excommunicated) ex-AMOC to gather and fulminate. I don't belong to that either. The printer contract was fun when that hit the AMOC forum. Apparently you could have bought the same printer 3 times over and bought toner and paper for a million copies for less than half what the then office manager had signed for without the committees permission. It was so bad the refused point blank to tell the members what the figures actually were.
If it wasn't so sad it would be funny.
I have no idea why this thread was started and I wish it hadn't been. For info, I am an AMHT supporter.
Dewi 2 said:
Two friends are the sons of Eric Cutler.
I expect Eric might have been a man you knew.
The two boys are great car enthusiasts and both enjoyed success motor racing, but never owned any Aston Martins. Perhaps not the ideal car for visiting customers, when explaining imminent price increases.
I was an AMOC member, but lapsed when renewal occurred during the pandemic. My impression was of a good, active local area, but sensed infighting at HQ. Peter Sprague’s account of the goings-on probably summed up the situation. A very successful business man and a rescuer of Aston Martin following administration. Certainly a person who was very well qualified and prepared to help the Club, but they did not want him and so he left.
As for the museum, I was shocked to read that they are storing some cars in the open. A quick way to deterioration. Not difficult to construct a timber protective structure to keep vehicles dry. Inexcusable.
There was some talk about AMHT occupying their own museum building, but I have not read anything about that idea recently.
As for someone saying the museum would be profitable - dream on.
I did enjoy the AMHT gathering at Brooklands.
At the time I joined, in 1981 or '82, the Club was run very well. This was at the time they went from all volunteers to taking on Jim Whyman as Secretary; the Club's first full-time employee. The AMOC was so well run, I believe they were the only one make car club entitled to run RAC MSA competition events.
LTP said:
Can we please not re-run the farce that is the recent AMOC on here? What with the legal cases, CoM shenanigans, etc. I left there solely because of the goings on, and I now believe there is another organisation for the disaffected (or excommunicated) ex-AMOC to gather and fulminate. I don't belong to that either.
I have no idea why this thread was started and I wish it hadn't been. For info, I am an AMHT supporter.
The thread was started by me to record my claim to have first suggested a Trust to run in parallel with the Club to safeguard the family silver from Club shenanigans. I have no idea why this thread was started and I wish it hadn't been. For info, I am an AMHT supporter.
The Trust won't recognise my claim in any way, shape or form. The Chairman - to his credit - did say he was intrigued when I contacted him to ask for formal recognition but when he delegated the investigation into my claim it all fizzled out.
If the Trust won't record it, then anyone searching the internet for its origins might find this thread and make up their own mind.
I wonder if their concern was me trying to make capital out of being pronounced the originator. The assurances I gave that I just wanted my contribution mentioned and wouldn't need to be carried to Gaydon on a sedan chair don't seem to have persuaded them.
DickyC said:
Yes, I knew Eric Cutler - some members assumed he was my father. My family was from Croydon and Eric was from a bit further south, Caterham or Warlingham IIRC. They met on one occasion and had an enjoyable time trying, but failing, to make a family connection. I'm surprised neither of his sons had an Aston as Eric had a Sutherland Aston 2 litre drophead in the garage when I visited. Too far gone, possibly. Lord Downe's solution to the 'having a business but liking Astons' problem was to use a Rover during the week. Before BL absorbed Rover, I imagine.
At the time I joined, in 1981 or '82, the Club was run very well. This was at the time they went from all volunteers to taking on Jim Whyman as Secretary; the Club's first full-time employee. The AMOC was so well run, I believe they were the only one make car club entitled to run RAC MSA competition events.
At the time I joined, in 1981 or '82, the Club was run very well. This was at the time they went from all volunteers to taking on Jim Whyman as Secretary; the Club's first full-time employee. The AMOC was so well run, I believe they were the only one make car club entitled to run RAC MSA competition events.
Correct, Warlingham.
I must remember to ask about the Sutherland Aston 2 litre drophead.
Think it still exists.
Possible conundrum when writing a will. One car, two sons.
Anyway, the boys were more interested in faster machinery. A racing MG Midget with remarkable modifications and a very successful Monoposto single seater, which achieved several overall wins and an excellent result at Spa.
Edited by Dewi 2 on Friday 8th March 16:25
DickyC said:
The Trust won't recognise my claim in any way, shape or form. The Chairman - to his credit - did say he was intrigued when I contacted him to ask for formal recognition but when he delegated the investigation into my claim it all fizzled out.
I suspect it was simply a case of 'NIH' - Not Invented Here.Simpo Two said:
DickyC said:
The Trust won't recognise my claim in any way, shape or form. The Chairman - to his credit - did say he was intrigued when I contacted him to ask for formal recognition but when he delegated the investigation into my claim it all fizzled out.
I suspect it was simply a case of 'NIH' - Not Invented Here./thebabesinthewood
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