'08 Vantage Battery Drain
Discussion
Firstly a thank you to all the contributors on the forum for the valuable information and insight they've shared with us all. I don't think i'd have managed to cope with the quirks of my Vantage without the information here.
I've had a consistent niggle with the battery usage on my car since I got bit 5 years ago 2nd owner. At the start I was unaware of the limited battery life and the risks of getting a flat battery when leaving the car over a 2 week summer holiday. Since then however I have bought my Ctek battery conditioner; replaced the battery itself 2 years ago (for an Enduroline 100mah 900 cca replacement, recommended in one of the threads).
The new battery has performed well, and with the occasional use of the conditioner I have managed to avoid a flat battery until the last few weeks when over a long golfing weekend (5 or 6 days) I returned to find my car dead.
My usage pattern is not good for the car with occasional short journeys and a 60 mile round trip only once or twice every two weeks. But only lasting a week was still a shock. I decided I needed to find a longer lasting solution than just buying a new battery every 2 years. The forums had plenty of commentary on the issues, but limited definitive figures allowing a true diagnosis of my situation.
I wanted to share the information I've gathered to provide more tangibility and seek your opinions on a solution.
Firstly Battery Drain (measured on the battery earth connection)
- drain reduced from 1.5-2,5a at the point the car was locked to a quiescent 100ma after approx. 4 minutes
- as systems were shutdown at around 1 min and 2 mins after locking (draw 0.6a & 0.3a respectively)
- timings varied slightly depending on if the boot was open or shut
- so the drain appears to be 100ma
- surprisingly the same end point was reached when using the battery disconnect switch.
- I do have a standard tracker fitted
- test was also done with door module fuses out, again 100ma stable drain after 4 minutes
- I wasn't sure which other fuses is is safe to try (Fuse 52 start button/tracker circuit)?
- conclusion I'm left with a constant drain of circa 100ma - that should give a battery life well above 5-6 days...
So onto the battery itself:
- The battery charges fine when the engine is running (14.5v)
- I can use the Ctek charger occasionally but it's less easy to leave connected whilst away
- Ctek performs fine, charges the battery and gives no errors
- I used the Recond. program when recovering from the flat battery after my holiday.
- Battery voltage does appear to drop quite quickly, and so I am now looking at that
- Voltage immediately after full charge - 13.0v
- Voltage after having let battery settle (30 mins) 12.5v
- Voltage after approx. 12 hours 12.2v
- looks to me that the battery is getting "old" and holding less of a charge, but should it get like this after only 2 years.
- It doesn't appear to be bad enough to fail, just not strong enough given the 100ma drain
I'd appreciate your comments on these figures and the initial conclusions I'm drawing. In particular I'd value suggestions as to what should be done to avoid this cycle of needing to replace the battery every 2 years. I think I read somewhere that AGM batteries are less prone to sulphation, should I replace with one of those?
Any help appreciated.
I've had a consistent niggle with the battery usage on my car since I got bit 5 years ago 2nd owner. At the start I was unaware of the limited battery life and the risks of getting a flat battery when leaving the car over a 2 week summer holiday. Since then however I have bought my Ctek battery conditioner; replaced the battery itself 2 years ago (for an Enduroline 100mah 900 cca replacement, recommended in one of the threads).
The new battery has performed well, and with the occasional use of the conditioner I have managed to avoid a flat battery until the last few weeks when over a long golfing weekend (5 or 6 days) I returned to find my car dead.
My usage pattern is not good for the car with occasional short journeys and a 60 mile round trip only once or twice every two weeks. But only lasting a week was still a shock. I decided I needed to find a longer lasting solution than just buying a new battery every 2 years. The forums had plenty of commentary on the issues, but limited definitive figures allowing a true diagnosis of my situation.
I wanted to share the information I've gathered to provide more tangibility and seek your opinions on a solution.
Firstly Battery Drain (measured on the battery earth connection)
- drain reduced from 1.5-2,5a at the point the car was locked to a quiescent 100ma after approx. 4 minutes
- as systems were shutdown at around 1 min and 2 mins after locking (draw 0.6a & 0.3a respectively)
- timings varied slightly depending on if the boot was open or shut
- so the drain appears to be 100ma
- surprisingly the same end point was reached when using the battery disconnect switch.
- I do have a standard tracker fitted
- test was also done with door module fuses out, again 100ma stable drain after 4 minutes
- I wasn't sure which other fuses is is safe to try (Fuse 52 start button/tracker circuit)?
- conclusion I'm left with a constant drain of circa 100ma - that should give a battery life well above 5-6 days...
So onto the battery itself:
- The battery charges fine when the engine is running (14.5v)
- I can use the Ctek charger occasionally but it's less easy to leave connected whilst away
- Ctek performs fine, charges the battery and gives no errors
- I used the Recond. program when recovering from the flat battery after my holiday.
- Battery voltage does appear to drop quite quickly, and so I am now looking at that
- Voltage immediately after full charge - 13.0v
- Voltage after having let battery settle (30 mins) 12.5v
- Voltage after approx. 12 hours 12.2v
- looks to me that the battery is getting "old" and holding less of a charge, but should it get like this after only 2 years.
- It doesn't appear to be bad enough to fail, just not strong enough given the 100ma drain
I'd appreciate your comments on these figures and the initial conclusions I'm drawing. In particular I'd value suggestions as to what should be done to avoid this cycle of needing to replace the battery every 2 years. I think I read somewhere that AGM batteries are less prone to sulphation, should I replace with one of those?
Any help appreciated.
Edited by BewickPlace on Monday 24th October 12:27
Not sure this helps, but I've got a similar issue at the moment - and my numbers seem similar to yours. I've only had the car a couple of weeks so am still "testing" what the issue is.
Voltage after 20-30 mins: 12.4v.
Voltage when running: 14.5v.
Drain when shut down: c. 0.6 amps.
I didn't notice it drop to 0.3a after a couple of minutes, but I probably didnt wait long enough - and I thought 0.6a seemed ok. I'm also wondering if it's the battery, though it was replaced last year and has been on trickle charge by previous owner, so shouldn't really have failed.
I've got the eurowatch tracker, which they advise me is inactive, so shouldn't be a problem.
Voltage after 20-30 mins: 12.4v.
Voltage when running: 14.5v.
Drain when shut down: c. 0.6 amps.
I didn't notice it drop to 0.3a after a couple of minutes, but I probably didnt wait long enough - and I thought 0.6a seemed ok. I'm also wondering if it's the battery, though it was replaced last year and has been on trickle charge by previous owner, so shouldn't really have failed.
I've got the eurowatch tracker, which they advise me is inactive, so shouldn't be a problem.
johnnyBv8 said:
Not sure this helps, but I've got a similar issue at the moment - and my numbers seem similar to yours. I've only had the car a couple of weeks so am still "testing" what the issue is.
Voltage after 20-30 mins: 12.4v.
Voltage when running: 14.5v.
Drain when shut down: c. 0.6 amps.
I didn't notice it drop to 0.3a after a couple of minutes, but I probably didnt wait long enough - and I thought 0.6a seemed ok. I'm also wondering if it's the battery, though it was replaced last year and has been on trickle charge by previous owner, so shouldn't really have failed.
I've got the eurowatch tracker, which they advise me is inactive, so shouldn't be a problem.
The tracker may well be 'inactive', in the sense it isn't live and on subscription, but it's still in there, and wired to the harness???Voltage after 20-30 mins: 12.4v.
Voltage when running: 14.5v.
Drain when shut down: c. 0.6 amps.
I didn't notice it drop to 0.3a after a couple of minutes, but I probably didnt wait long enough - and I thought 0.6a seemed ok. I'm also wondering if it's the battery, though it was replaced last year and has been on trickle charge by previous owner, so shouldn't really have failed.
I've got the eurowatch tracker, which they advise me is inactive, so shouldn't be a problem.
Just updating on this - as per the OP, mine dropped to 0.1a after 20 mins, which is probably about right. I think my battery is giving up, despite being fairly new (and no doubt within warranty still!) so will be putting a new one in.
EDIT: AM advise that 0.1a is too high....see below.
EDIT: AM advise that 0.1a is too high....see below.
Edited by johnnyBv8 on Thursday 27th October 13:55
johnnyBv8 said:
Just updating on this - as per the OP, mine dropped to 0.1a after 20 mins, which is probably about right. I think my battery is giving up, despite being fairly new (and no doubt within warranty still!) so will be putting a new one in.
I suspect your tracker is still connected. Do you get the flashing light on the dash when you set off?My AM garage have kindly offered to disconnect the tracker and re-programme the car accordingly - they've said it is an hours work, but have failed to quantify when the benefit will be - does anyone know? Unless the drain would come down to 10-20ma (like a normal car) then I can't see the value in paying for the tracker to be disconnected.
At around 10-20ma I think I would then be able to use a smallish solar panel to do the job of the battery conditioner and keep the battery topped up.
Mansfield said:
I've used a battery disconnect switch for the last 5 years with no problems to start the car even after 6 weeks (winter) of no use.
Car is still on its orginal battery.
They are less than £10 and a few minutes to fit.
I presume with this you are not using the in-line fuse (?), and thus totally disconnecting the battery so that it is subject to no drain. At the same time that would mean car unlocked and no alarm.Car is still on its orginal battery.
They are less than £10 and a few minutes to fit.
Edited by Mansfield on Thursday 27th October 04:54
BewickPlace said:
johnnyBv8 said:
Just updating on this - as per the OP, mine dropped to 0.1a after 20 mins, which is probably about right. I think my battery is giving up, despite being fairly new (and no doubt within warranty still!) so will be putting a new one in.
I suspect your tracker is still connected. Do you get the flashing light on the dash when you set off?My AM garage have kindly offered to disconnect the tracker and re-programme the car accordingly - they've said it is an hours work, but have failed to quantify when the benefit will be - does anyone know? Unless the drain would come down to 10-20ma (like a normal car) then I can't see the value in paying for the tracker to be disconnected.
At around 10-20ma I think I would then be able to use a smallish solar panel to do the job of the battery conditioner and keep the battery topped up.
Edited by johnnyBv8 on Thursday 27th October 13:50
If the battery is draining that quickly then you cannot be capturing the load properly, or the battery is properly knackered.
0.1A load (100mA) on a fully charged 100Ah battery should last in the region of 1000hours (41 days)
It sounds probable that the load is fluctuating, and when you've measured it it's not showing the peak.
The tracker does seem the most likely culprit given 1. Its reputation for this sort of behaviour, and 2. I think that they periodically "call home" which could easily add a different load profile
Unless you are going to sit there 24/7 watching it, you are not going to know about elevated currents.
Which means you need a logger left in circuit or possibly a "max hold" device. Check that they don't "go to sleep" though.
There are various things out there.
Owon B35 which has a bluetooth interface and will connect to iOS or Android. (make sure you check model compatibility)
You can also get one with internal logging (B35+)
Also Mooshimeter.
Others may be available to buy/rent
Don't own either of these, but given our MY07 V8V lasts for weeks and weeks without conditioner (and an active tracker) I haven't needed to.
0.1A load (100mA) on a fully charged 100Ah battery should last in the region of 1000hours (41 days)
It sounds probable that the load is fluctuating, and when you've measured it it's not showing the peak.
The tracker does seem the most likely culprit given 1. Its reputation for this sort of behaviour, and 2. I think that they periodically "call home" which could easily add a different load profile
Unless you are going to sit there 24/7 watching it, you are not going to know about elevated currents.
Which means you need a logger left in circuit or possibly a "max hold" device. Check that they don't "go to sleep" though.
There are various things out there.
Owon B35 which has a bluetooth interface and will connect to iOS or Android. (make sure you check model compatibility)
You can also get one with internal logging (B35+)
Also Mooshimeter.
Others may be available to buy/rent
Don't own either of these, but given our MY07 V8V lasts for weeks and weeks without conditioner (and an active tracker) I haven't needed to.
johnnyBv8 said:
Yes, the red light does come on for the first 30-60 seconds of running. It's been "deactivated" by Eurowatch, which presumably just means no subscription! Apparently removing fuse 2 under the bonnet (tracker and clock) would give a test to see whether this reduces the drain.
Just done the fuse 2 test and the quiescent reading falls to 10ma which is a sensible level..Edited by johnnyBv8 on Thursday 27th October 13:50
BewickPlace said:
johnnyBv8 said:
Yes, the red light does come on for the first 30-60 seconds of running. It's been "deactivated" by Eurowatch, which presumably just means no subscription! Apparently removing fuse 2 under the bonnet (tracker and clock) would give a test to see whether this reduces the drain.
Just done the fuse 2 test and the quiescent reading falls to 10ma which is a sensible level..BewickPlace said:
I presume with this you are not using the in-line fuse (?), and thus totally disconnecting the battery so that it is subject to no drain. At the same time that would mean car unlocked and no alarm.
Correct, its a total disconnect of the battery. The car can still be locked/unlocked with the key.A quick update for all.
Over the past few days I continued to test with fuse 2 out, where the load was circa 10ma, and the battery held it's voltage @ 12.5v.
My conclusion is that my drain has definitely been the tracker unit causing a drain in excess of 100ma and probably more at times. (although I don't have the data logger to check, but battery deterioration would suggest).
I have therefore been into my Aston specialist and they've disabled the tracker and re-flashed the car accordingly.
Now at home the quiescent load is circa 10ma and I'm hopeful I can now leave my car for reasonable periods without having the lottery of battery status on return. Figures crossed.
Thanks for all the help.
Over the past few days I continued to test with fuse 2 out, where the load was circa 10ma, and the battery held it's voltage @ 12.5v.
My conclusion is that my drain has definitely been the tracker unit causing a drain in excess of 100ma and probably more at times. (although I don't have the data logger to check, but battery deterioration would suggest).
I have therefore been into my Aston specialist and they've disabled the tracker and re-flashed the car accordingly.
Now at home the quiescent load is circa 10ma and I'm hopeful I can now leave my car for reasonable periods without having the lottery of battery status on return. Figures crossed.
Thanks for all the help.
johnnyBv8 said:
Glad it worked for you.
Apparently the tracker's own battery fails over time, at which point it starts to become a parasitic drain on the main battery. So, there's no fault with the tracker per se - it's something that will just develop when the tracker's battery decides to retire.
I wonder if tracker will come and replace foc if you have contract still with them? Worth a callApparently the tracker's own battery fails over time, at which point it starts to become a parasitic drain on the main battery. So, there's no fault with the tracker per se - it's something that will just develop when the tracker's battery decides to retire.
FYI.
On 5th July 2018, my "Eurowatch" Tracker totally disabled my '13 V8V after "calling home" and getting confused. This is despite the fact that it has NEVER been activated!
I had to get it recovered from home to my local AM garage. There they told me about the problem of the tracker "calling home" and causing massive battery drain and also randomly disabling vehicles. They are going to reflash/reprogramme which will stop these problems. £130 thank you very much!
They also said Aston no longer use Eurowatch because of these problems.
Somebody should have told me about this when I bought the bloody car.
On 5th July 2018, my "Eurowatch" Tracker totally disabled my '13 V8V after "calling home" and getting confused. This is despite the fact that it has NEVER been activated!
I had to get it recovered from home to my local AM garage. There they told me about the problem of the tracker "calling home" and causing massive battery drain and also randomly disabling vehicles. They are going to reflash/reprogramme which will stop these problems. £130 thank you very much!
They also said Aston no longer use Eurowatch because of these problems.
Somebody should have told me about this when I bought the bloody car.
Hi All,
I agree that the Eurowatch Tracker is draining the battery bigtime as you point out but that the early battery death is also caused by the tracker. I have just had my second battery after the first one (Bosch S5013 with 5 Year warranty!) lasted just over 2 years. I was regularly (but not every night) using my C-Tek but it did not prevent serous battery damage. The battery was spending so much of its time in a heavily discharged state which has seriously reduced the battery life.
To be clear, my E-Watch tracker is still fitted until I get it removed/de-installed. I have not been using it for 3 years.
The quicker I can get the tracker removed the better.
I learned today that V8V owners without the E-W tracker are getting >6 years out of their battery!
Phil Collins
I agree that the Eurowatch Tracker is draining the battery bigtime as you point out but that the early battery death is also caused by the tracker. I have just had my second battery after the first one (Bosch S5013 with 5 Year warranty!) lasted just over 2 years. I was regularly (but not every night) using my C-Tek but it did not prevent serous battery damage. The battery was spending so much of its time in a heavily discharged state which has seriously reduced the battery life.
To be clear, my E-Watch tracker is still fitted until I get it removed/de-installed. I have not been using it for 3 years.
The quicker I can get the tracker removed the better.
I learned today that V8V owners without the E-W tracker are getting >6 years out of their battery!
Phil Collins
I have a 2012 Rapide and was having battery issues , I lock car when not in use , have it on charger , replaced battery. Has 300ma to 500ma constant draw . Then one day had a message Alarm system failure. Found info on this and rather then get a new one I took it out , took it apart and it has 2 rechargeable batteries in side , showed 1.7 volts , I soldered up replacement batteries , now measures 3.6 volts . Reinstalled , pressed the lock - unlock buttons a few times , started car and alarm message gone . Then hooked up my meter and watched it for a few days , left windows down and set meter on back console , after first day the draw dropped to slightly under 100ma and stayed there , so older cars with old batteries in sercurity sounder was my issue .
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