Discussion
How much does your garage charge per hour?
I've got my quote from Works Service and they charge £90 per hour plus VAT. So £108 all-in.
For an eight hour day £720 sounds pretty reasonable. In fact I'd go so far as to say that's a rather decent wage.
Yes, I know there are overheads etc. But even still!
Just very pleased it's on matey boys insurance and not my wallet!
I've got my quote from Works Service and they charge £90 per hour plus VAT. So £108 all-in.
For an eight hour day £720 sounds pretty reasonable. In fact I'd go so far as to say that's a rather decent wage.
Yes, I know there are overheads etc. But even still!
Just very pleased it's on matey boys insurance and not my wallet!
Just to be controversial .......is it not ridiculous to be be paying £120 an hour for a " mechanic" to plug in a computer to tell him what's wrong with your car....... My experince in other premium cars such has Mercedes has been disappointing to say the least, the mechanics seem to have no idea how to resolve an issue unless a computer tells what's wrong.......this is not the case with Stratstone's who look after my 9
Vergis said:
You may get someone that charges less but takes an extra hour or 2 to complete the job.
Worth getting quotes of the work to be carried out before committing to a garage.
This is a very salient point. I had poor Rick at DMS quote to work on my car, the job took him 5hrs longer and he worked into the night on it. Didn't charge as he'd already quoted his price. That's Rick though, the world of Aston would be worse place without him (especially as he just came in on his holiday to get my car ready for the Alps this week Worth getting quotes of the work to be carried out before committing to a garage.
)Quinny said:
They're not mechanics anymore, they're fitters.... A mechanic would take a broken part, fix it and refit it
Now days a fitter just fits new parts until the fault goes away..
Probably the most offensivce comment I've read for ages about this business! Some of the faults on these cars you almost need a degree in computer sciences. And I'd like to see a 'fitter' decypher a DB7 I6 wiring diagram...Now days a fitter just fits new parts until the fault goes away..
You need to spend more time at your local dealer! Unless it's them that don't know what they're doing...
The main dealer will not be allowed to use a spurious part that hasn't been tested in the same way as the OE stuff. Someone somewhere has come up with that design to make it cheaper (it may also be made to a lower standard) not the manufacturer. It works that's all well and good but if it wasn't designed by the OE manufacturer then they can't use/stock it. This is nothing to do with dealers and everything to do with manufacturers. And the term Main Stealer is extremely derogatory. You wouldn't pay the watch hospital to service your Rolex would you....
Knights of Aston said:
The main dealer will not be allowed to use a spurious part that hasn't been tested in the same way as the OE stuff. Someone somewhere has come up with that design to make it cheaper (it may also be made to a lower standard) not the manufacturer. It works that's all well and good but if it wasn't designed by the OE manufacturer then they can't use/stock it. This is nothing to do with dealers and everything to do with manufacturers. And the term Main Stealer is extremely derogatory. You wouldn't pay the watch hospital to service your Rolex would you....
Not quiet true!I run a very successful business fitting what you would call "spurious" parts to industrial equipment. None of these parts have ever failed or caused a failure.
Aston do not make oil, air filters, oil filters, o rings etc
They are made for them and badged, a large markup is then applied (I've seen over 400% on some items)
Most of these parts are available direct from the manufacturers outlets at a fraction of the cost. They comply to the same ISO9000 standards and are CE marked for EU use. They just don't have the badge
The term "spurious" is used to describe reverse engineered parts often made outside the EU/USA in plants with little or no quality control. The word spurious was chosen by their competitors as a subtle put down.
Main dealers (of any equipment
) are often stuck with spiralling costs - parts, labour, overheads etc and often cannot see under promising and over delivering would go a long way to mitigating these costs.Not doing that makes it a double win going to the likes of DMS & Bamford Rose.
All IMHO of course
just to fair their is different criteria for establishing labour costs across garages and Dealers,
insurance a standard trade policy does not cover cars such as Aston's normally even for such as road testing, and most trade policies have an upper amount as a limit of value per car, and if under insured can mean no payout at all never mind the legality of driving cars uninsured and in many cases workshops are no aware that they are not insured as they believe a trade policy allows them to drive anything which is not true,
the dealers do not have a choice in the parts they have to stock or tooling in some cases quite a bit of it will never be used ( dealers had to stock I believe three child seats each for the rapide just as an example) also livery and branding is also dictated for by the supplying manufacturer and a dealer has to conform,
as a specialist i can choose what special tools I will need and use and purchase accordingly I am also not constrained by Labour times which a dealer is,if I feel the need to take twice as long and spend more time double checking I have the choice, I can also save a fortune by having some tooling made specifically for me such as subframe trolleys mounting brackets so this reflects in a specialist labour rate,
differences in labour rates are based on overheads and investment in staff and equipment some equipment is generic but specific equipment for a particular brand will also be costly such as AMDS which will only work on the Aston's
Training is also costly and the dealer again has no choice, ( this is one point just because someone has completed all the courses and been shown how to do it, although classed as fully trained it does not make them good, common sense a passion to do well and simple care and attention rate more highly with me everything else can be taught), I can choose my training providers, such as frank massey for diagnostics (classified as one of the best if not the best), as well the standard three year apprenticeship my lads they carry on to do there hnc etc, but again this is my choice and allows labour rates to be lower than a dealer,
reference pay scales different areas pay different wages to the same level of tech
keeping good, well trained and experienced staff is also costly,
that is why labour rates vary greatly, and basically three bandings, your average workshop capable of working on the majority of cars with generic training and equipment, A specialist who has dedicated training and manufacture specific tooling and data, and the Dealer who has a branded forecourt, more tooling and parts than will ever be required, specific uniforms and dictated training,
all have there pros and cons, if the Dealers could match a specialists labour rate they would as the majority of people would still prefer a Dealer stamp over a specialist if it was the same price,
The key point is a good job for a fair price and that is your own assessment as to what that means to you,
one thing I do find difficult to understand is banded labour rates if your car is older the labour rate is cheaper, why? that seems unfair the same staff, premises tooling etc is used, so why should someone with a newer car be penalized, shouldn't a rate in between be used to keep it fair for everyone who uses a particular place,
insurance a standard trade policy does not cover cars such as Aston's normally even for such as road testing, and most trade policies have an upper amount as a limit of value per car, and if under insured can mean no payout at all never mind the legality of driving cars uninsured and in many cases workshops are no aware that they are not insured as they believe a trade policy allows them to drive anything which is not true,
the dealers do not have a choice in the parts they have to stock or tooling in some cases quite a bit of it will never be used ( dealers had to stock I believe three child seats each for the rapide just as an example) also livery and branding is also dictated for by the supplying manufacturer and a dealer has to conform,
as a specialist i can choose what special tools I will need and use and purchase accordingly I am also not constrained by Labour times which a dealer is,if I feel the need to take twice as long and spend more time double checking I have the choice, I can also save a fortune by having some tooling made specifically for me such as subframe trolleys mounting brackets so this reflects in a specialist labour rate,
differences in labour rates are based on overheads and investment in staff and equipment some equipment is generic but specific equipment for a particular brand will also be costly such as AMDS which will only work on the Aston's
Training is also costly and the dealer again has no choice, ( this is one point just because someone has completed all the courses and been shown how to do it, although classed as fully trained it does not make them good, common sense a passion to do well and simple care and attention rate more highly with me everything else can be taught), I can choose my training providers, such as frank massey for diagnostics (classified as one of the best if not the best), as well the standard three year apprenticeship my lads they carry on to do there hnc etc, but again this is my choice and allows labour rates to be lower than a dealer,
reference pay scales different areas pay different wages to the same level of tech
keeping good, well trained and experienced staff is also costly,
that is why labour rates vary greatly, and basically three bandings, your average workshop capable of working on the majority of cars with generic training and equipment, A specialist who has dedicated training and manufacture specific tooling and data, and the Dealer who has a branded forecourt, more tooling and parts than will ever be required, specific uniforms and dictated training,
all have there pros and cons, if the Dealers could match a specialists labour rate they would as the majority of people would still prefer a Dealer stamp over a specialist if it was the same price,
The key point is a good job for a fair price and that is your own assessment as to what that means to you,
one thing I do find difficult to understand is banded labour rates if your car is older the labour rate is cheaper, why? that seems unfair the same staff, premises tooling etc is used, so why should someone with a newer car be penalized, shouldn't a rate in between be used to keep it fair for everyone who uses a particular place,
Edited by rick-derby- on Tuesday 20th September 11:26
Quinny said:
ather not thanks...
Here's a couple of classic examples of what I'm talking about......(I have plenty of others)
Universal CV joint on the front Prop of a Jeep... Main stealer says UJ not available replacement prop £400 ish fitted..
Go on the net, buy a new CV £45..... Takes 1 hour to remove prop, knock off old CV fit new, and replace prop...
Vauxhall Corsa bottom ball joint.... Not available, you have to replace the whole bottom wishbone which includes bushes
Go on the net, buy ball joint £15 again, about an hour to remove old one and fit replacement...
No one wants to strip parts down anymore, and fix the broken bit, they just want to fit complete new assemblies...
So I'll stand by my comments thanks
I think I got you beat!Here's a couple of classic examples of what I'm talking about......(I have plenty of others)
Universal CV joint on the front Prop of a Jeep... Main stealer says UJ not available replacement prop £400 ish fitted..
Go on the net, buy a new CV £45..... Takes 1 hour to remove prop, knock off old CV fit new, and replace prop...
Vauxhall Corsa bottom ball joint.... Not available, you have to replace the whole bottom wishbone which includes bushes
Go on the net, buy ball joint £15 again, about an hour to remove old one and fit replacement...
No one wants to strip parts down anymore, and fix the broken bit, they just want to fit complete new assemblies...
So I'll stand by my comments thanks
On the Esprit, each window mechanism has two white nylon plastic pieces about an inch long. They glide inside the track in a scissors fashion to make the window go up and down. With age, they tend to get brittle and crack. Lotus does not sell the little white pieces individually so the dealer says you have to buy the entire window regulator mechanism with motor. The cost? $950USD plus two hours labor!
I went to an auto glass shop to source the little plastic part. The guy at the shop opens a drawer at his desk where he happens to store about 30 of these. He charges me $0.75! It took me under 10 minutes to install the part.
During the course of the years, all four OEM pieces (2-per door) have failed a total of five times (yes, one failed twice). I have also helped replace several for other friend's cars. Can you imagine if I had the dealer replace the entire window motor/regulator every time one of these failed?
Knights of Aston said:
The main dealer will not be allowed to use a spurious part that hasn't been tested in the same way as the OE stuff. Someone somewhere has come up with that design to make it cheaper (it may also be made to a lower standard) not the manufacturer. It works that's all well and good but if it wasn't designed by the OE manufacturer then they can't use/stock it. This is nothing to do with dealers and everything to do with manufacturers.
My dealer will install aftermarket parts such as exhausts, wheel spacers, air filters, aero kits, etc that the customer brings in and they sell some of them as well. Are these not "spurious" then? I'm sure the vendors have not tested these to the extent that AM would have.Gassing Station | Aston Martin | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff