Monaro refresh pics
Discussion
It's been quiet here recently...so here's a few pics of some ongoing work. I've had my monaro 4-5 years and with a slow oil leak (and suspected slow water leak) I was beginning to lose faith in a car which is simple enough that it should be reliable. That's the excuse, but I'm not as far as fixing those bits yet...
...enough bits wanted doing that it seemed easiest to pull the engine and gearbox. Thanks Craig of dynotorque for the lifting bracket.
A hole, with new brake/clutch/PAS hard lines going in.
Heads off, not too stty.
fk you Proform, trying to grenade my engine
fk you Summit and your stty trunnions (wearing after a few thousand miles, pulled because I've seen what other people's have done...Comp upgraded trunnions are as bad/worse).
Replaced with Straub bronze bushings.
Livernois heads going on - evidently beware of swarf in CNC heads that see the inlet rocker bolt go clean through the inlet tract...
...Straub can supply shorter rocker bolts which don't protrude into the inlet tract, and Permatex thread sealant is recommended.
Heads on. Livernois double valve springs replaced with more girly PAC 1219x.
fk Crane and the cheesy imperial stud on their valve spring tool.
I retapped it as M10 and it got the job finished.
Rockers on...but wrong. Shorter pushrods incoming.
Helping to clear G's shed.
Hinson poly engine mounts on...I added the exhaust wrap because I'm paranoid about the low melting temperature of poly. Also got a gearbox mount - cheers again G!
Prop centre shagged so replaced. Guibos look ok.
Moral of the story: fk the aftermarket!
...enough bits wanted doing that it seemed easiest to pull the engine and gearbox. Thanks Craig of dynotorque for the lifting bracket.
A hole, with new brake/clutch/PAS hard lines going in.
Heads off, not too stty.
fk you Proform, trying to grenade my engine
fk you Summit and your stty trunnions (wearing after a few thousand miles, pulled because I've seen what other people's have done...Comp upgraded trunnions are as bad/worse).
Replaced with Straub bronze bushings.
Livernois heads going on - evidently beware of swarf in CNC heads that see the inlet rocker bolt go clean through the inlet tract...
...Straub can supply shorter rocker bolts which don't protrude into the inlet tract, and Permatex thread sealant is recommended.
Heads on. Livernois double valve springs replaced with more girly PAC 1219x.
fk Crane and the cheesy imperial stud on their valve spring tool.
I retapped it as M10 and it got the job finished.
Rockers on...but wrong. Shorter pushrods incoming.
Helping to clear G's shed.
Hinson poly engine mounts on...I added the exhaust wrap because I'm paranoid about the low melting temperature of poly. Also got a gearbox mount - cheers again G!
Prop centre shagged so replaced. Guibos look ok.
Moral of the story: fk the aftermarket!
mikeyb1987 said:
Nice work Ben! How come you've decided against fitting dual springs again? Genuine question as I have duals.
The beehives just seem a better fit for my valvetrain - the rockers are standard and I like the 243 heads and modest cam lift (.60x) to not have to consider the geometry too much (and I didn't really want powdered metal valve guides). The beehives are lighter (even with standard heavy retainers and locks), a bit less spring rate, and I'm miles off coil bind with the 0.690" livernois springs (spring surge a possibility). ArnieVXR said:
What's wrong with the rocker covers?
Two of the bolts dropped out of the PCV baffle and into the cylinder head. Thankfully they seemed to be happy there and went no further!Are bushes considered a good long term replacement vs needle rollers ? Seems like a step backwards ?
And never assume nuts/bolts etc are tight, always check them and if there are concerns about them coming loose, thread lock them.
And virtually all ported heads break through the inlet bolt hole, again new or not it's always up to final assembler to ensure all parts are clean etc. Just cut a few threads off the bolt as required and loctite them.
And never assume nuts/bolts etc are tight, always check them and if there are concerns about them coming loose, thread lock them.
And virtually all ported heads break through the inlet bolt hole, again new or not it's always up to final assembler to ensure all parts are clean etc. Just cut a few threads off the bolt as required and loctite them.
stevieturbo said:
Are bushes considered a good long term replacement vs needle rollers ? Seems like a step backwards ?
And never assume nuts/bolts etc are tight, always check them and if there are concerns about them coming loose, thread lock them.
And virtually all ported heads break through the inlet bolt hole, again new or not it's always up to final assembler to ensure all parts are clean etc. Just cut a few threads off the bolt as required and loctite them.
The bronze bushings have been used on a bunch of track cars that have racked up big mileages and seem sound enough...should be quiet too. If they wear and get noisy they'll get replaced...hopefully a bit more gracefully than these Comp ones:And never assume nuts/bolts etc are tight, always check them and if there are concerns about them coming loose, thread lock them.
And virtually all ported heads break through the inlet bolt hole, again new or not it's always up to final assembler to ensure all parts are clean etc. Just cut a few threads off the bolt as required and loctite them.
The standard trunnion/bearings seem to have a low failure rate, but are pretty terrible when they go. The Comp/Summit/BTR trunnion upgrade seems to wear quickly, and so is really a downgrade. It was a choice between returning to standard or trying the bushings, so I'll continue to hatefk the aftermarket
Yes, you're right about the bolts on the valve covers and swarf/burrs in the heads, meant partially in jest...
Janosh said:
WOW - thanks for sharing Mud_, keep the updates and pictures coming, they're eyeopening and provide extremely valuable feedback!
Will you be running the new and improved LS1 at TR this year?
I've been taking some pictures of the bits I do, but things like the hydraulic hard lines and prop bearing I'm happy for my local garage to handle. I only get an hour or so after each day at work to advance the engine bits, so it's taking a while. Will you be running the new and improved LS1 at TR this year?
I'm gutted to be out of the country for TR this year, please Dougie we need a TR2017
It's back together
The clutch was a sod to bleed (new hard lines), but keeping it depressed overnight worked a treat. Applying that much force (20-40kgs?) to the clutch wasn't easy (I struggled to find things to anchor against), here was my solution - I carefully put a breezeblock wrapped in synthetic cloth (pond filter stuff) in the footwell, put the chair all the way forward, and wedged a rubber mallet on the pedal. I was half expecting to find a smashed carbon seat or window in the morning!
The reason for the Holley valve covers with their LS2 coil pack bosses is they're a halfway house to fitting these...
...as I want a way of fitting airboxes (I insist on clean, cold air!). Space isn't as tight as when they lived in Bimble's mad RX7, but the monaro isn't exactly capacious either...
The bulkhead clears (just), but the hard fuel lines when replaced will probably be terminated lower down.
I have a few valve covers at this point, not all of which are options...
The modified LS1 valve covers were actually off my car, went to Bimble, then to a third party, and found their way back to me with the ITBs...took me a while to realise they were once mine.
After several months of the monaro being in bits I'm in no major hurry to fit the ITBs, but I'm slowly making up bits like the IAC housing and airboxes. Also sorting things like a preliminary TP VE table for an alpha-n tune.
The clutch was a sod to bleed (new hard lines), but keeping it depressed overnight worked a treat. Applying that much force (20-40kgs?) to the clutch wasn't easy (I struggled to find things to anchor against), here was my solution - I carefully put a breezeblock wrapped in synthetic cloth (pond filter stuff) in the footwell, put the chair all the way forward, and wedged a rubber mallet on the pedal. I was half expecting to find a smashed carbon seat or window in the morning!
The reason for the Holley valve covers with their LS2 coil pack bosses is they're a halfway house to fitting these...
...as I want a way of fitting airboxes (I insist on clean, cold air!). Space isn't as tight as when they lived in Bimble's mad RX7, but the monaro isn't exactly capacious either...
The bulkhead clears (just), but the hard fuel lines when replaced will probably be terminated lower down.
I have a few valve covers at this point, not all of which are options...
The modified LS1 valve covers were actually off my car, went to Bimble, then to a third party, and found their way back to me with the ITBs...took me a while to realise they were once mine.
After several months of the monaro being in bits I'm in no major hurry to fit the ITBs, but I'm slowly making up bits like the IAC housing and airboxes. Also sorting things like a preliminary TP VE table for an alpha-n tune.
ArnieVXR said:
That'll go well
We need to talk about those lovely orange valve covers...
They'd be cheap as they'd need some attention...the covers themselves are ok (if the baffle screws get loctite'd in properly), but the fitting bits were made of case-hardened cheese and a few bits broke (dodgy grub screws with hex-stock risers then a short bolt through the valve cover). I would find long bolts and bypass that nonsense. Also note the coil pack holder brackets are extra, look naff, and make the HT leads a bit stretched. I gave the brackets to leatherman. There's also a bolt that broke off in them and needs extracting (part of the coil pack bracket kit, again crappy metals so should at least be an easy extraction!). I figured those covers would end up on my wall, but if you're still keen...We need to talk about those lovely orange valve covers...
Mud_ said:
They'd be cheap as they'd need some attention...the covers themselves are ok (if the baffle screws get loctite'd in properly), but the fitting bits were made of case-hardened cheese and a few bits broke (dodgy grub screws with hex-stock risers then a short bolt through the valve cover). I would find long bolts and bypass that nonsense. Also note the coil pack holder brackets are extra, look naff, and make the HT leads a bit stretched. I gave the brackets to leatherman. There's also a bolt that broke off in them and needs extracting (part of the coil pack bracket kit, again crappy metals so should at least be an easy extraction!). I figured those covers would end up on my wall, but if you're still keen...
The long hex bolt spacers etc all work fine, and well. Been on my car for 2 years now without issue.Long bolts unless there was a spacer below the cover would not work, as you would not want to be pulling down on the cover without it actually tightening against something.
Only crappy bit about them was the little plastic washer for a seal under the bolt, I replaced these with dowty seals. Just replace as needed if/when you remove/refit the covers.
Coil bracket setup is a bit iffy though, although I never used it and longer leads would be needed.
stevieturbo said:
The long hex bolt spacers etc all work fine, and well. Been on my car for 2 years now without issue.
Long bolts unless there was a spacer below the cover would not work, as you would not want to be pulling down on the cover without it actually tightening against something.
Only crappy bit about them was the little plastic washer for a seal under the bolt, I replaced these with dowty seals. Just replace as needed if/when you remove/refit the covers.
Coil bracket setup is a bit iffy though, although I never used it and longer leads would be needed.
I was running one of the grub screws in by hand and it snapped, I don't know WTF was wrong with them! Long bolts unless there was a spacer below the cover would not work, as you would not want to be pulling down on the cover without it actually tightening against something.
Only crappy bit about them was the little plastic washer for a seal under the bolt, I replaced these with dowty seals. Just replace as needed if/when you remove/refit the covers.
Coil bracket setup is a bit iffy though, although I never used it and longer leads would be needed.
e: checked back through my pics to when I used the Proform coil pack brackets and you're right, the OE-length HT leads may not fit at all, I was using custom leads. It also reminded me how quickly the bolts on the coil pack brackets went rusty! Sorry, you clearly like yours but I just don't rate them (pretty though).
Edited by Mud_ on Saturday 10th September 22:39
Mnchsv said:
How are you getting mapping the itb intake?
I'm currently remapping for the current setup with the FAST LSXR to correct for the new heads using a standard speed density tune (still on EFI live LS1B COS3), and from that I will log the PID VETABLE_DM to build an initial TPS VE table for COS5 to then apply usual BENs to. I could've been bold and dived in, but I still have bits to make before I fit the ITBs properly. I'll see how TPS VE goes with CL, and from there either 1) stick with it, 2) get annoyed and put the LSXR back on, 3) get an aftermarket ECU that allows me to use the MAP sensor for the low throttle positions, as unfortunately COS5 can only do that the wrong way around (meant for massive cams with no vacuum at idle I guess).Gassing Station | HSV & Monaro | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff