Questions for engine Builders.
Discussion
I have always enjoyed working on engines and maintaining cars,my present car ive maintained for nigh on 370,000 miles with no problems except for the odd head gasket,engine,gearbox and rear axle swap,believe me when you run a mini cab these are invitable and minor issues :)
With all my mechanical interest ive never built an engine but would like to learn as a hobby,i have a wide range of quality tools that i update all the time plus workshop manuals and videos,plus i have a passion to learn.
Three questions i would like to ask wether you build engines for a living or just a hobby are,
What assembly lubes do you advise?
What would be the best tips you could offer?
what would be the best tool to have by your side?
Thanks.
With all my mechanical interest ive never built an engine but would like to learn as a hobby,i have a wide range of quality tools that i update all the time plus workshop manuals and videos,plus i have a passion to learn.
Three questions i would like to ask wether you build engines for a living or just a hobby are,
What assembly lubes do you advise?
What would be the best tips you could offer?
what would be the best tool to have by your side?
Thanks.
ZR1cliff said:
What assembly lubes do you advise?
I always just use lots of engine oil... but it has to be said that my own engines are generally pretty old and other peoples' engines I've worked on have mostly been industrial designs with single-digit bhp figures; it may be that others would advise something "stickier" for a modern design.
ZR1cliff said:
What would be the best tips you could offer?
Read all about your engine first, take your time, put all the duplicated bits back in their original positions (ie. don't swap conrods around and stuff), measure everything you've got a measurement for, check that everything moves freely after each operation so if you find it goes stiff (fnarr fnarr) you've got a good idea of what made that happen.
ZR1cliff said:
what would be the best tool to have by your side?
Torque wrench and distance-measuring instruments - feeler gauges and vernier calipers have the widest application, though a micrometer is more suitable for things like checking crankpin diameter and ovality - you'll need a big one though. Other very useful things are plenty of clean rags, and a bucket of diesel and an old toothbrush.
ZR1cliff said:
I have always enjoyed working on engines and maintaining cars,my present car ive maintained for nigh on 370,000 miles with no problems except for the odd head gasket,engine,gearbox and rear axle swap,believe me when you run a mini cab these are invitable and minor issues 
With all my mechanical interest ive never built an engine but would like to learn as a hobby,i have a wide range of quality tools that i update all the time plus workshop manuals and videos,plus i have a passion to learn.
Three questions i would like to ask wether you build engines for a living or just a hobby are,
What assembly lubes do you advise?
What would be the best tips you could offer?
what would be the best tool to have by your side?
Thanks.
Assembly lube's-oil,
the best tip's BE CLEAN WASH ALL COMOPNENTS AND HOT PRESSURE WASH OFF,THEN HOT DRY AND PACK AND STORE FOR ASSEMBLY and alway's bin the core plugs:-)
best tool is a clean work area.
Pigeons covered most of it.
Keep things clean and organised, check you understand what you are doing. Read the manual at every stage. Buy a couple of different torque wrenches and check things rotate properly and that nothing collides or fouls at each stage of the build. Read all the tuning and building books you can find
Get yourself a decent 3/8th drive socket set
Boosted.
Keep things clean and organised, check you understand what you are doing. Read the manual at every stage. Buy a couple of different torque wrenches and check things rotate properly and that nothing collides or fouls at each stage of the build. Read all the tuning and building books you can find
Get yourself a decent 3/8th drive socket set
Boosted.
thong said:
the best tip's BE CLEAN WASH ALL COMOPNENTS AND HOT PRESSURE WASH OFF,THEN HOT DRY AND PACK AND STORE FOR ASSEMBLY and alway's bin the core plugs:-)
best tool is a clean work area.
Thanks all for the advice,as for cleaning is there any machines i can buy for this,i would imagine there are large machines for industrial use but are there smaller versions for home use,and why a 3/8 set is this better suited for torquing without over tightening?
Yes, you can buy DIY parts washers from places like www.toolsnstuff.co.uk (run by a PHer). They're basically a sink with a mesh floor and a solvent tank underneath, with a pump providing a continuous flow of filtered solvent through a brush. Not very expensive and rather nicer to use than a bucket of diesel.
They are not a complete solution, though, as the filters are not perfect. If you use one to clean, for example, the parts of a Stihl saw which is clagged up with brick dust, the particles of dust are fine enough to pass through the filter and you end up "painting" a layer of fine grit over everything, which cannot be seen but can be felt... so the idea of using a hot pressure washer for the next stage is a good one.
The cheap alternative to hot pressure washing is to scrub parts in frequently-changed hot water with washing machine detergent (careful with ally parts; washing up liquid is safer) followed by hot water rinsing.
Obviously, once things have been in water get them thoroughly dry ASAP
They are not a complete solution, though, as the filters are not perfect. If you use one to clean, for example, the parts of a Stihl saw which is clagged up with brick dust, the particles of dust are fine enough to pass through the filter and you end up "painting" a layer of fine grit over everything, which cannot be seen but can be felt... so the idea of using a hot pressure washer for the next stage is a good one.
The cheap alternative to hot pressure washing is to scrub parts in frequently-changed hot water with washing machine detergent (careful with ally parts; washing up liquid is safer) followed by hot water rinsing.
Obviously, once things have been in water get them thoroughly dry ASAP
Pigeon said:
........The cheap alternative to hot pressure washing is to scrub parts in frequently-changed hot water with washing machine detergent (careful with ally parts; washing up liquid is safer) followed by hot water rinsing.....
It's called a 'dishwasher'. But can only be used when the 'management' is not looking.
My tool offering would be an engine stand.
For standard engine rebuild just use plenty of oil for the lube. Performance engines will need special cam lubes as a minimum.
Steve
Baking tins are the go, lots of brand new clean ones.
Get some acetone as well as cellulose thinners for de-glazing the block and bits. Got to have your proper chemicals for the job.
Chainsaw oil is a good build lubricant, it sticks around enough whilst it waits for you to finish the job.
Loads of industrial "bog roll".
Clean worksurface, preferably a nice stainless topped workbench.
Nice big table to spread your tools on.
That's it.
Get some acetone as well as cellulose thinners for de-glazing the block and bits. Got to have your proper chemicals for the job.
Chainsaw oil is a good build lubricant, it sticks around enough whilst it waits for you to finish the job.
Loads of industrial "bog roll".
Clean worksurface, preferably a nice stainless topped workbench.
Nice big table to spread your tools on.
That's it.
love machine said:
Baking tins are the go, lots of brand new clean ones.
Get some acetone as well as cellulose thinners for de-glazing the block and bits. Got to have your proper chemicals for the job.
Chainsaw oil is a good build lubricant, it sticks around enough whilst it waits for you to finish the job.
Loads of industrial "bog roll".
Clean worksurface, preferably a nice stainless topped workbench.
Nice big table to spread your tools on.
That's it.
More good advice ,thanks,i have a new unused block here what should i use to degrease it?
I have a small parts washer which works quite well. So far I've only used the recommended water based detergent cleaner. Are there any better cleaning solutions?
In the manual it says NOT to use flammable liquids/solvents but is that just covering themselves? If it's not ment to hold solvent then why have they put a fusable solder link in, so that it closes automatically when it all goes poof?
I have thought of using parafin. Is this any good at cleaning?
Leo
In the manual it says NOT to use flammable liquids/solvents but is that just covering themselves? If it's not ment to hold solvent then why have they put a fusable solder link in, so that it closes automatically when it all goes poof?
I have thought of using parafin. Is this any good at cleaning?
Leo
,nice job quinny,how did you get the piston so clean or is that a new one?
Start with japanese - motorcycles are ideal!
If you have to replace bits and pieces it all just fits...as if by magic. I never had a vernier gauge, or flat edges and whatever else until I started messing with Chevys! All you need is a feeler gauge for the valves and everything else goes together like lego (assuming it's not totally shot and you're looking at rebores and reground bearings).
Plus, it's all metric so half a dozen spanners and allen keys and bob's your uncle. No messing with obscure imperial sizes.
And the plus-side of motorcycle engines is they're all do-able single handedly. You can pick then up and move then without a hoist (even 1000cc+ fours), plus the parts are small enough to put on a normal sized bench.
....and the kosher workshop manual will usually advise the oil/lube required for that engine.
WB
If you have to replace bits and pieces it all just fits...as if by magic. I never had a vernier gauge, or flat edges and whatever else until I started messing with Chevys! All you need is a feeler gauge for the valves and everything else goes together like lego (assuming it's not totally shot and you're looking at rebores and reground bearings).
Plus, it's all metric so half a dozen spanners and allen keys and bob's your uncle. No messing with obscure imperial sizes.
And the plus-side of motorcycle engines is they're all do-able single handedly. You can pick then up and move then without a hoist (even 1000cc+ fours), plus the parts are small enough to put on a normal sized bench.
....and the kosher workshop manual will usually advise the oil/lube required for that engine.
WB
ZR1cliff said:
Is it true that car engines are easier to build that motorcycle engines?,ive heard this comment a few times.
Got to disagree. However, when you're talking about a bike engine, and major work where you spilt the crankcases means you naturally have the gearbox 'apart' too. On a car engine, you've just got the engine to worry about.
So yes, there are more parts in a bike engine, but I far prefer working on them.
For like-for-like comparisons, I can get the engine out (or in) to the bike single handed in about an hour (and its an 1100). The car engine probable take half a day with a hoist.
Valve setup on the car is probably quicker as a) it usually has less of them, and b) they're often tappets and not bucket-and-shims. Still, cams out valves reset (not an engine-out-job) in not too much longer than a car (and a lot less time than a TVR AJP motor!).
Pistons out on a bike is a doddle if it's got separate barrels (so all air cooled, and a few water cooled) - just lift the barrells off and there's the pistons. So way quicker/easier than having to take the crank our as per most cars.
Clutch? 20 minutes on most bikes, engine in situ. Cars? 1/2 a day minumum.
I had a gear problem on a fireblade-engined car I had. Got a new set of shafts off the breakers and it toom less than an hour to get the engine out and on the deck upside down. Maybe 1/2 an hour to split the cases and get the clutch and box apart, an hour to put it back together and the same to get it all back in the car. Basically, started after lunch and finished by tea-time.
....jeez I'm waffling here. Summary - bike=more parts, but smaller easier to handle parts, and they all fit! Car=less parts, but not necessarily easier.
WB
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