Oil sample analysis

[E90_M3Ross]

Has anyone ever done an oil sample analysis, and if so do you think it was useful and who did you use?

I'm half tempted to do one at my next oil change.

Cheers.

[Hoofy]

A friend does this every year for his Porsche Boxster to check for metal from the IMS bearing.

[E90_M3Ross]

Hoofy said:

A friend does this every year for his Porsche Boxster to check for metal from the IMS bearing.

Who does he use? If you could find out I'd be very grateful. It's only just had an oil change but I would like to do it next time around.

[ian332isport]

I get mine done periodically. I use Millers oils for the analysis.

https://www.millersoils-shop.co.uk/oil-analysis-ki...

[guards red]

Had mine carried out by Millers too.

Very useful to know what fine metals are in the oil, the composition and quantity can tell you what part of the engine is wearing, excessive amounts might give one a chance to deal with issues before they become terminal.

Can also give one an opportunity to change the type of oil being used and know how well the combustion process is happening in the engine.

Like a blood test I guess.

[E90_M3Ross]

ian332isport said:

I get mine done periodically. I use Millers oils for the analysis.

https://www.millersoils-shop.co.uk/oil-analysis-ki...

Thanks. They do race/high performance or passenger vehicle, I assume I'd go passenger, or would it be worthwhile to do the race/high performance one?

I can't find a sample analysis report on their site, don't suppose you have one or know exactly what it checks for?

Many thanks

[charltjr]

Apparently doing it regularly to check for changes is the key thing, Redish have a page on it and a YT video and given the amount of rod bearings they do I guess they’d know

http://www.redish-motorsport.com/BMWE63E64MEngineO...

[Panamax]

I don't see the point of it. Engines are generally either working or not working. Very rarely does early warning of wear make any difference to the eventual outcome.

....unless you plan to unload the car onto another unfortunate punter before the problem gets worse.

[Smint]

I once had an analysis done by Millers.
It was mainly to check for possible fuel contamination.

In the report they didn't go into too much technical detail, which would have been gibberish to me anyway, but they added a summary explanation in laymans terms which put my mind at rest.
As i was a regular Millers Oil user, presumably Millers products showed up during testing to confirm, they waived the charge.

[E90_M3Ross]

Smint said:

I once had an analysis done by Millers.
It was mainly to check for possible fuel contamination.

In the report they didn't go into too much technical detail, which would have been gibberish to me anyway, but they added a summary explanation in laymans terms which put my mind at rest.
As i was a regular Millers Oil user, presumably Millers products showed up during testing to confirm, they waived the charge.

If you still have that report could you share it please? I'd be interested in seeing.

[Smint]

E90_M3Ross said:

If you still have that report could you share it please? I'd be interested in seeing.

14 years ago, i can't find my glasses or phone from one minute to the next let alone have the foggiest idea where that report might be.

[Hoofy]

E90_M3Ross said:

Hoofy said:

A friend does this every year for his Porsche Boxster to check for metal from the IMS bearing.

Who does he use? If you could find out I'd be very grateful. It's only just had an oil change but I would like to do it next time around.

https://www.millersoils.co.uk/oil-analysis/

[Hoofy]

Panamax said:

I don't see the point of it. Engines are generally either working or not working. Very rarely does early warning of wear make any difference to the eventual outcome.

....unless you plan to unload the car onto another unfortunate punter before the problem gets worse.

Well, if I had a 996 or Boxster of that era, and it showed up metal fragments, I'd stop driving it and book the car in to have the IMS bearings replaced. It's only a £2k bill which would save the engine from going bang, and it is also a selling point that you've had it done.

[Panamax]

Hoofy said:

Well, if I had a 996 or Boxster of that era, and it showed up metal fragments, I'd stop driving it and book the car in to have the IMS bearings replaced. It's only a £2k bill which would save the engine from going bang, and it is also a selling point that you've had it done.

That's an interesting point that seems particularly relevant for certain Porsche cars 2002-2005. This from Design 911 website,
"A simple and reliable check can be made each time that you change the oil & filter. If you find metallic parts in the oil filter or used oil it has quite literally come from the balls within the bearing. If you find bits of black plastic then it may have come from the IMS Bearing seal. Both are signs that the IMS Bearing is starting to fail. At this point, you need to get your car in for a full inspection & repair, if determined to be necessary. So if you have a Porsche which is more vulnerable to IMS failure, maybe it would benefit you to have your oil checked more often. IMPORTANT: If you think that you Porsche’s IMS Bearing is showing symptoms of failing, you shouldn’t drive it! Instead, have it recovered!"

[catfood12]

I regularly sample oil from engines & gearboxes. It's most valuable during running in to see what's bedding in, I.e. rings or shells, and every oil change on Euro 6 diesels, as they have a habit of fuel dilution into the oil, pointing to issues with the wider emissions systems. They're best used to see trends between samples, to see if anything has changed significantly since the last test.

I normally use The Oil Lab, as their reports suit what I want. I occasionally check against Millers' but they never seem to have the right content in their reports for me. See below a couple of typical reports.

The oil lab on a new BMW G8X at 1300 miles just prior to the running in service;




Pesky T6 with troublesome engine;





Millers report for comparison, same BMW S62 as the first report above, now after 10K miles;

[E90_M3Ross]

Thanks for that, Catfood12, very informative.

[Hoofy]

Panamax said:

Hoofy said:

Well, if I had a 996 or Boxster of that era, and it showed up metal fragments, I'd stop driving it and book the car in to have the IMS bearings replaced. It's only a £2k bill which would save the engine from going bang, and it is also a selling point that you've had it done.

That's an interesting point that seems particularly relevant for certain Porsche cars 2002-2005. This from Design 911 website,
"A simple and reliable check can be made each time that you change the oil & filter. If you find metallic parts in the oil filter or used oil it has quite literally come from the balls within the bearing. If you find bits of black plastic then it may have come from the IMS Bearing seal. Both are signs that the IMS Bearing is starting to fail. At this point, you need to get your car in for a full inspection & repair, if determined to be necessary. So if you have a Porsche which is more vulnerable to IMS failure, maybe it would benefit you to have your oil checked more often. IMPORTANT: If you think that you Porsche’s IMS Bearing is showing symptoms of failing, you shouldn’t drive it! Instead, have it recovered!"

Thanks, so it ties in with my thoughts.

TBH I'd just get it and the RMS sorted without any check if I were planning on keeping the car for more than a month. The risk is massive even if the probability is tiny: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLgKE3cVsF8

[HJG]

I use oil analysis a lot in my line of work.
It can be really useful if you know what to look for and if you are looking for something specific.
A lot of the time, it is much more useful to plots trends over time and oil changes.

Get a sample done and post the results here and we can discuss.

Fuel content is not always included but is one of the most useful tests. The oil viscosity will drop around one SAE viscosity grade per 3 to 5 % fuel dilution.

[Panamax]

HJG said:

Fuel content is not always included but is one of the most useful tests. The oil viscosity will drop around one SAE viscosity grade per 3 to 5 % fuel dilution.

Your point is well made.

"My car never uses any oil."
"Well maybe, or perhaps your oil is filling up with fuel from all those cold starts".

At the end of the day who cares about a bit of fuel in the oil, so long as it doesn't go too far. Get some heat into the engine reasonably regularly and the fuel should evaporate off (as should water condensation), helpfully recirculated through your CCV system. It's mainly a problem for short distance commuter cars that never get hot.

[E90_M3Ross]

Panamax said:

HJG said:

Fuel content is not always included but is one of the most useful tests. The oil viscosity will drop around one SAE viscosity grade per 3 to 5 % fuel dilution.

Your point is well made.

"My car never uses any oil."
"Well maybe, or perhaps your oil is filling up with fuel from all those cold starts".

At the end of the day who cares about a bit of fuel in the oil, so long as it doesn't go too far. Get some heat into the engine reasonably regularly and the fuel should evaporate off (as should water condensation), helpfully recirculated through your CCV system. It's mainly a problem for short distance commuter cars that never get hot.

Thanks. The car has been taken out of being used for commuting which was short trips, it's only used for trips of at least 15 miles now, but can go 1-2 weeks without being used so it always gets up to temperature. On the days I do use it it often does a 15-20 mile drive, and the same back before it fully cools down anyway.

Cheers.