Citroen Berlingo Broken Cam Belt Repair

[Matt410]

My 2015 Citroen Berlingo Multispace has a broken cam belt, which has destroyed many rockers. It's currently in one  (lets call it garage A) who quoted me about £2300 to repair. After taking it apart they said it's the worst damage to rockers they have ever seen, and reckon that the pins from the rockers have got into the oil system, meaning that even if they did all those repairs there would be a high chance it would still not work and need the engine replacing at that point. The mechanic offered to buy it as it is for not very much money at all, as I can't be risking that much money on a repair which might end up in the same position as before. 
I wanted another opinion, so sent a photo of the damaged rockers and an explanation to another garage (Garage B) who said that it's very standard damage one these engines and they're highly confident they can repair it with no issues afterwards. I've attached the same photos for reference. 

Basically, I'd love to know what anybody thinks about which garage is giving me the right level of risk! Any insight you're able to give would be very much appreciated. Thanks!

[Dynion Araf Uchaf]

buy a 2nd hand engine. Do a little preventative maintenance on it like change the cambelt and seals, and throw it the car for probably a grand. Maybe £1200 if your paying someone.

[Matt410]

Thanks! The second garage is proposing this:

"I'd be taking the cylinder head of the engine and replacing valves gaskets etc that was also included with the price quoted

Remove cylinder head from the engine overhaul the cylinder head and refit using the parts listed below

4x exhaust valves
4x intake valves
Head gasket
Head set
Head bolts
8x rockers
8x lifters
Oil
Oil filter
Antifreeze
Cam belt kit
Water pump

I'm quite confident that should cover everything and get you up and running again"

Does that sound sensible, or do you think it's risky like the original garage said?

[stevieturbo]

None of the above really addresses the potential debris in the engine..

So I'd say you're somewhere in the middle.

A good complete second hand head would be an option, and at a minimum remove the sump and thoroughly clean everything in and around there.

Simply repairing/replacing the head alone, does not deal with the debris inside the engine. And from the photo, potentially there could be a decent amount.

And hopefully when the head is off make some sort of determination as to whether there is piston damage or not.

[Polly Grigora]

Dynion Araf Uchaf said:

buy a 2nd hand engine. Do a little preventative maintenance on it like change the cambelt and seals, and throw it the car for probably a grand. Maybe £1200 if your paying someone.

This

[JONATHAN_11_80]

Hi,

On the dv6 engine the rockers are designed to snap when the cambelt breaks to avoid damaging the valves. The camshaft will also need to be replaced as the lobes are designed to spin again helping avoid valve and valve guide damage. In regards to the rollers personally these should still be in the head or worse dropped into the sump. I would drop the sump and check this. Its rare for these engine to suffer valve damage. Personally I would replace the camshaft, rockers, cambelt, waterpump etc and drop the sump and clean it and the oil pump strainer out and run it.

[SystemOfAFrown]

JONATHAN_11_80 said:

Hi,
the lobes are designed to spin again helping avoid valve and valve guide damage

They aren't explicitly designed to do this, it's just a consequence of the hollow steel tube pressed construction of many modern cams compared to the more conventional cast iron camshafts.

[Zener]

SystemOfAFrown said:

JONATHAN_11_80 said:

Hi,
the lobes are designed to spin again helping avoid valve and valve guide damage

They aren't explicitly designed to do this, it's just a consequence of the hollow steel tube pressed construction of many modern cams compared to the more conventional cast iron camshafts.

This ^ inc the rocker arms not designed to grenade either on valve interference , my advice like suggested already replace the engine and fit cam-belt kit and water pump to the replacement eng whilst out of the vehicle

[JONATHAN_11_80]

I disagree personally I would do a leak down test to check for valve damage then if all ok replace the the damaged topend components e.g. camshaft and rockers.

[ComStrike]

Typical internet thread, answered by keyboard specialists.
Its a simple repair, cam, rockers, cam seal, belt kit, water pump. Valves dont bend they crush. Head off & replacement valves are a 1 in 10, Dropping a valve is a 1 in a 100
£1500 would cover it or thereby if its just cam repair. Parts & Labour cost money.
But hell yeah buy a second hand engine & pay the numpty up the street £400 to fit it. I'm sure he'll declare that income as well.
Head off will be what the lad has quoted you to repair.

Edited by ComStrike on Wednesday 19th October 13:07

[DVandrews]

ComStrike said:

Typical internet thread, answered by keyboard specialists.
Its a simple repair, cam, rockers, cam seal, belt kit, water pump. Valves dont bend they crush. Head off & replacement valves are a 1 in 10, Dropping a valve is a 1 in a 100
£1500 would cover it or thereby if its just cam repair. Parts & Labour cost money.
But hell yeah buy a second hand engine & pay the numpty up the street £400 to fit it. I'm sure he'll declare that income as well.
Head off will be what the lad has quoted you to repair.

Edited by ComStrike on Wednesday 19th October 13:07

Err.. with respect.. valves bend readily, I have seen and replaced hundreds of bent valves. If the valves are perpendicular to the piston crowns they take a straight hammer blow but this can easily bend the stems or the head especially if there is play in the guides or uneven carbon build up on the piston.

The debris introduced when the rockers failed may well be confined to the oil delivery galleries in the head which is coming off and will undoubtedly be machine washed as part of the repair.

Anything dropped into the engine void will end up in the sump where it can be retrieved by dropping the sump and cleaning.

Dave

Edited by DVandrews on Thursday 20th October 12:23

[gazza285]

ComStrike said:

Typical internet thread, answered by keyboard specialists.
...Valves dont bend they crush...

That shows what you know.