Eric Turner Garage experiences? Who to rebuild GEMS Rover V8

[Sazwerk]

Hi all,

I am looking for an engine rebuild on my TVE Chimaera 450 (4.6 Rover V8) . The only thing is it is running on a GEMS ECU which I have now found out the TVR garage world does not seem to play ball with very much. Its already been with Mark Adams for a issue but now I have a 40% leak down on cylinder 5 so needs stripping and likely rebuilding, currently at TVR power but I can't afford the prices of a rebuild there. Most TVR mechanics aren't really happy rebuilding it with the GEMS as they don't understand the system or how to map it.

As such I have actually been looking into Range Rover specialists / P38 specialists as they use GEMS software and came across Eric Tuner.

https://www.turners-garage.com/

https://www.turnerperformance.co.uk/

https://www.turners-garage.com/range-rover/wolds-l...

I spoke with him yesterday, he seemed very confident in being able to rebuild my engine, bore it it a 4.8 etc if wanted and map GEMS ECU on rolling road once rebuilt. He said he has a lot of experience working in electricals and has a engineering degree. Sounds great, the man for the job.

However hardly anyone I have spoken to who have been in the industry for decades has heard of him? I would suspect most Rover V8 engineers would have heard of him or experience with him if he was that well established?

Are there any users of this forum who have had experience with this garage? Any tips how to investigate the garage further? Or any users who can direct me to an appropriate engineer confident in rebuilding and GEMS ECU's?

This is a big job that I am entrusting a garage with and therefore it is imperative I choose the right one!

Thanks

[ingenieur]

There seems to be two elements to this project.

Firstly, rebuilding the engine. Any engine builder should be able to take that on.

Secondly the ECU. I had a look on the GEMS website... I have heard of them before but just had a refresh... it's a basic aftermarket ECU so any rolling road worth dealing with shouldn't have any problem tuning your car if it has a GEMS ECU.

I'm not seeing how the first and second task are connected?

[Krikkit]

ingenieur said:

There seems to be two elements to this project.

Firstly, rebuilding the engine. Any engine builder should be able to take that on.

Secondly the ECU. I had a look on the GEMS website... I have heard of them before but just had a refresh... it's a basic aftermarket ECU so any rolling road worth dealing with shouldn't have any problem tuning your car if it has a GEMS ECU.

I'm not seeing how the first and second task are connected?

This, 100%!

GEMS ECUs are quite common in the Japanese scene, and there's quite a few tuners about.

You could also take the opportunity to switch to something more modern and have it mapped by someone local to you who knows their onions, or a marque specialist.

[EllipticSwerve]

The GEMS isn’t an aftermarket ECU (in the Emerald/canes/syvecs/mega squirt sense), it’s a Lucas-sagem ECU used (as OEM equipment) by Land Rover in certain discovery/range rovers, and Lotus in the Elise.

Personally I would get any reputable builder to build you a new v8, then get mark Adams to map it.

This may be informative:

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Edited by EllipticSwerve on Tuesday 16th August 17:41

Edited by EllipticSwerve on Tuesday 16th August 17:43

[ollie plymsoles]

I've had gems for around 20 years in my Jap evo and it's been fine.it was in a rally evo 6. Mine is a pretty basic standalone but has anti lag and launch control etc. I think there are much better ecus around nowadays.
I would settle on the ecu that the guy recommends and if it can be mapped near home then great stuff. My mapper is only 45 mins away in the lakes so I chose him and the gems.

[ingenieur]

EllipticSwerve said:

The GEMS isn’t an aftermarket ECU (in the Emerald/canes/syvecs/mega squirt sense), it’s a Lucas-sagem ECU used (as OEM equipment) by Land Rover in certain discovery/range rovers, and Lotus in the Elise.

Personally I would get any reputable builder to build you a new v8, then get mark Adams to map it.

This may be informative:

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Edited by EllipticSwerve on Tuesday 16th August 17:41

Edited by EllipticSwerve on Tuesday 16th August 17:43

They describe themselves as providing electronics to the motorsport industry.

But the main point is they offer their configuration software for download from their website so any tuner can load it up and work with it.

[stevieturbo]

EllipticSwerve said:

The GEMS isn’t an aftermarket ECU (in the Emerald/canes/syvecs/mega squirt sense), it’s a Lucas-sagem ECU used (as OEM equipment) by Land Rover in certain discovery/range rovers, and Lotus in the Elise.

Personally I would get any reputable builder to build you a new v8, then get mark Adams to map it.

This may be informative:

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Edited by EllipticSwerve on Tuesday 16th August 17:41

Edited by EllipticSwerve on Tuesday 16th August 17:43

GEMS is both, one name, two totally different systems

And one has arguably some of the worst tuning software ever developed. And that isn't the Rover one lol

[Zener]

The GEMS OEM RV8 ECU is a very advanced & smart for its era ECU and still is , basic/simple its not as far as rebuilding the RV8 speak to V8 DEvelopments or John Eales Engineering

[Belle427]

As above.
I thought the gems system was self learning anyway and didn’t need mapping?

[Zener]

Belle427 said:

As above.
I thought the gems system was self learning anyway and didn’t need mapping?

Self adapting not mapping often misquoted about the GEMS capabilities

[stevieturbo]

Belle427 said:

As above.
I thought the gems system was self learning anyway and didn’t need mapping?

No such thing, although many people have different interpretations of such things ( and expectations )