Fitting a mini cooper supercharger to a 2cv
Discussion
Jules100 said:
Hi just wondering if anyone could help me. I'd like to fit a supercharger to my 2cv (dont ask why!) would the mini cooper model fit? if so how fast would it need to be spinning when the engine is ticking over to work effectively when accelerating?
Many Thanks
The M45 puts out 45 cubic inches (roughly 700cc) per revolution. So you need to know the engine capacity and amount of boost you are aiming for, and from that you can work out what gearing you need.
There are several decisions to be made. The most obvious one is how much boost do you want, this will determine the extent of changes to the engine, fuel and ignition systems. It will also determine the size and type of blower that you need.
The obvious one is where can the blower go and are you willing and able to do the work required to install it there.
Sorting out the gearing is relatively trivial compared to the other things you need to sort out. However, when you come to do it don't forget that with a 4-stroke engine you have to halve the capacity because each cylinder only fires on every other crank rotation. For example with a 600cc 4-stroke geared 1:1 to a 700cc M45 blower you will have a compression ratio of about 2.3:1, which is way over the top.
I would say that 600cc is so small that you are going to need some pretty extreme engineering to get any significant power out of it. It would take far less engineering to drop in a bigger engine. If you do particularly want to stick with that engine, it might be small enough for these electric fan superchargers to actually do some good? Mind you, 5% improvement on a 600cc engine is hardly going to make much difference in the traffic light stakes.
The obvious one is where can the blower go and are you willing and able to do the work required to install it there.
Sorting out the gearing is relatively trivial compared to the other things you need to sort out. However, when you come to do it don't forget that with a 4-stroke engine you have to halve the capacity because each cylinder only fires on every other crank rotation. For example with a 600cc 4-stroke geared 1:1 to a 700cc M45 blower you will have a compression ratio of about 2.3:1, which is way over the top.
I would say that 600cc is so small that you are going to need some pretty extreme engineering to get any significant power out of it. It would take far less engineering to drop in a bigger engine. If you do particularly want to stick with that engine, it might be small enough for these electric fan superchargers to actually do some good? Mind you, 5% improvement on a 600cc engine is hardly going to make much difference in the traffic light stakes.
I think hydrazine/hydrogen peroxide injection is a much better idea.
A few questions, why don't you fit an Ami engine?
How about making a Twinny, put another 2CV no,
it, Ami engine in the back.
In fact what the are you thinking of?
I don't think the benefits would be worth it. (Having gone through the conversion process in great detail with an M45 and an old mini, I can tell you that it's quite an involved process.)
Stu
A few questions, why don't you fit an Ami engine?
How about making a Twinny, put another 2CV no,
it, Ami engine in the back. In fact what the
are you thinking of? I don't think the benefits would be worth it. (Having gone through the conversion process in great detail with an M45 and an old mini, I can tell you that it's quite an involved process.)
Stu
Mutant Rat said:
I think hydrazine/hydrogen peroxide injection is a much better idea.
It would be if you could still get the stuff.
I've tried. You can't - not in Europe, anyway.
I thought LM was a chemist, he should be able to make his own.
Anyway H2O2 is available in 35% soln in the UK, I presume you're talking about the hydrazine? Presumably peroxide and any other fuel would also do the trick, I thought hydrazine was good because it will burn in air with only a platinum catalyst required to initiate the reaction.
Petrol and H2O2 would surely be as equally rocket-worthy?
Then again for this sort of application it'd probably make more sense to follow the herd and fit nitrous.cyberface said:
Anyway H2O2 is available in 35% soln in the UK, I presume you're talking about the hydrazine?
No, I'm talking about peroxide. 35% solution is bugger all use as rocket fuel - you need 90%+ concentration.
As you say, just about any fuel can be burnt with the peroxide (or the peroxide can be used on its own, with a catalyst), but the specific impulse of peroxide/hydrazine combination is particularly good.
^^ yep. I'm not sure how useful this would be in a 2CV without bolting the back end of a rocket motor to it 
I was thinking even sillier - injecting the rocket fuel and oxidiser as a bit of 'extras' into the existing 2CV engine. Like nitrous on, errr, nitrous for example.
How do the amateur rocketeers do peroxide engines in Europe then? I thought there were a few clubs in the UK that have this type of rocket. Could be very wrong though
I was thinking even sillier - injecting the rocket fuel and oxidiser as a bit of 'extras' into the existing 2CV engine. Like nitrous on, errr, nitrous for example.
How do the amateur rocketeers do peroxide engines in Europe then? I thought there were a few clubs in the UK that have this type of rocket. Could be very wrong though
Hmmm...injecting concentrated hydrogen peroxide into a alloy engine might not be a good idea. I thing you would find that the engine would dissolve, rather quickly! Dunno about amateur rocketeers using peroxide - I thought they were mainly using solid fuel, with a handful of LOX/oxidant motors at the very serious end of things.
Perhaps they use 35% concentrate? I would work - it just wouldn't give a very good specific impulse.
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