A DPF thread. New DPF fitted, car will not recognise it.
Discussion
Hi and thanks for reading.
UK. Honda CRV, 2013 2.2 iDTEC diesel. 93,500 miles. I want to sell the otherwise excellent car but the codes are causing problems. Right now, I have two warning lights showing on the dash of the car.
1. Diesel Particulate Filter blocked.
2. PGM-FI (Glow plug warning).
The DDPF warning has been appearing for over a year. It's been to several garages and now a Honda main dealer and no one has managed to permanently get rid of the warning light. Early in the year they got rid of it for a while by cleaning in various ways but it kept coming back. Now the car has a new DPF and it still won't clear.
Scanning the system with a basic OBD2 plug in reader and the Torque app on my phone shows NO fault codes. (In fact the PGMFI light wasn't showing until I DID a scan for faults. THEN it came on!)
The filter is NOT blocked. The car has a new Honda OEM DPF fitted by a Honda main dealer and only has a couple of miles on it. It also has a new Front Exhaust Temperature Sensor (37810R3LG01) and a replacement USED pressure sensor (37861R3LG00). The connecting pipe has been soaked in EGR cleaner internally and blown out with high pressure air and does not appear to be blocked.
Despite all this the computer KEEPS SHOWING the blocked DPF light and putting the car into limp mode. This means it will not pass it's MOT on emissions and will become not legal to drive. Therefore scrap metal.
PLEASE, what could be telling the ECU that there is a fault? The only other sensor is the Air/Fuel ratio sensor but that doesn't have any relation to DPF blockages does it? I wondered about a wiring fault but if a wire was broken to one of the sensors the sensor would show up as a fault on the scans. Is anyone aware of wiring faults that occur?
EGR valves and crap in the manifolds are a possible cause of a DPF actually getting blocked but shouldn't be an issue here, especially as a garage was supposed to have cleaned them recently.
Any ideas please? Thank you.
UK. Honda CRV, 2013 2.2 iDTEC diesel. 93,500 miles. I want to sell the otherwise excellent car but the codes are causing problems. Right now, I have two warning lights showing on the dash of the car.
1. Diesel Particulate Filter blocked.
2. PGM-FI (Glow plug warning).
The DDPF warning has been appearing for over a year. It's been to several garages and now a Honda main dealer and no one has managed to permanently get rid of the warning light. Early in the year they got rid of it for a while by cleaning in various ways but it kept coming back. Now the car has a new DPF and it still won't clear.
Scanning the system with a basic OBD2 plug in reader and the Torque app on my phone shows NO fault codes. (In fact the PGMFI light wasn't showing until I DID a scan for faults. THEN it came on!)
The filter is NOT blocked. The car has a new Honda OEM DPF fitted by a Honda main dealer and only has a couple of miles on it. It also has a new Front Exhaust Temperature Sensor (37810R3LG01) and a replacement USED pressure sensor (37861R3LG00). The connecting pipe has been soaked in EGR cleaner internally and blown out with high pressure air and does not appear to be blocked.
Despite all this the computer KEEPS SHOWING the blocked DPF light and putting the car into limp mode. This means it will not pass it's MOT on emissions and will become not legal to drive. Therefore scrap metal.
PLEASE, what could be telling the ECU that there is a fault? The only other sensor is the Air/Fuel ratio sensor but that doesn't have any relation to DPF blockages does it? I wondered about a wiring fault but if a wire was broken to one of the sensors the sensor would show up as a fault on the scans. Is anyone aware of wiring faults that occur?
EGR valves and crap in the manifolds are a possible cause of a DPF actually getting blocked but shouldn't be an issue here, especially as a garage was supposed to have cleaned them recently.
Any ideas please? Thank you.
Was the DPF actually blocked ?
when was the last time the car was serviced, on some (mazdas) you need to rest the service light and the oil quality light otherwise they won't regen. The faukt codes for the glowplug, have they been looked at, have the glowplugs been checked ? again the car won't regen if there is a fault on the glowplug system.
when was the last time the car was serviced, on some (mazdas) you need to rest the service light and the oil quality light otherwise they won't regen. The faukt codes for the glowplug, have they been looked at, have the glowplugs been checked ? again the car won't regen if there is a fault on the glowplug system.
Evening, thanks for the replies.
As always, there is a much longer story behind this, but I didn't want to bore you. I purchased the car on Saturday the 14th of March, 2020. It was clean and drove well and I was happy with the purchase. However, during the subsequent year of ownership one fault code kept recurring and despite taking it to three separate garages, no one was able to fix it. The DPF warning light kept coming on saying the filter was blocked. At first I assumed it was my short distance driving.
On the 21st September 2020 the DPF warning light shows for the first time. I take it to the Honda main dealer. They do a Forced Regeneration on the system and it clears the fault.
On the 11th March 2021 the DPF warning light shows again. I take it to a local independent garage this time who clean the DPF with chemicals and clean the entire emissions system with a ‘Hydrogen Clean”. I still don't know if this is snake oil or a useful action. Again, it clears the fault.
Now on the 12th April, the DPF warning appears for the third time. Getting fed up with this I research for a DPF specialist and go to a company about 20 miles away. They do a diagnosis and advise that the filter is likely blocked up with ash and that they can wash it out with a specialist machine, a DCS-20 DPF Cleaning System. It's on You Tube. This will bring the filter back to as new with almost no ash left inside it. I agreed and they washed it out on the 21st April. However, the fault code did not clear this time. As they could not clear the fault they did not charge me. They advised it would appear that a new DPF was necessary. However an after market filter is unavailable for this car.
I decided that if a new filter was to be fitted, I would get it fitted by an expert and get a good warranty so I contacted the Honda main dealer again and arranged for the new DPF to be fitted. On the 11th of May it went into Honda’s. They had it for 5 days and even after fitting a new DPF, new sensor they couldn't get the ECU to clear the fault. Honda UK at Bracknell told them to do a compression test. I agreed and that is when the PGMFI light came on, they started to remove a glow plug to do a test and couldn't without it breaking. An independent garage has since looked and said they can see no damage to the plugs but that plug 2 is showing an open circuit.
I am currently talking to my home insurance about possible legal action.
After receiving the car back with the warning STILL on, I took matters into my own hands at last. If the cars computer thinks the filter is blocked it must be getting the message from somewhere. There is a sensor on the car that is connected to the filter by a rubber and metal pipe. The sensor and wiring were undamaged. I blew the connecting pipe out with compressed air. After reconnecting the sensor, THE FAULT CLEARED! But after just about 2 miles it has come back on again. Since then I replaced the pressure sensor with a used one from a breakers but that made no difference. And, of course, I have blown the pipe out again numerous times and cleaned the sensor contacts with electrical contact cleaner.
SO, I said it was a long back story. Anyhow, WHAT can be causing the filter to show blocked still? Please?
As always, there is a much longer story behind this, but I didn't want to bore you. I purchased the car on Saturday the 14th of March, 2020. It was clean and drove well and I was happy with the purchase. However, during the subsequent year of ownership one fault code kept recurring and despite taking it to three separate garages, no one was able to fix it. The DPF warning light kept coming on saying the filter was blocked. At first I assumed it was my short distance driving.
On the 21st September 2020 the DPF warning light shows for the first time. I take it to the Honda main dealer. They do a Forced Regeneration on the system and it clears the fault.
On the 11th March 2021 the DPF warning light shows again. I take it to a local independent garage this time who clean the DPF with chemicals and clean the entire emissions system with a ‘Hydrogen Clean”. I still don't know if this is snake oil or a useful action. Again, it clears the fault.
Now on the 12th April, the DPF warning appears for the third time. Getting fed up with this I research for a DPF specialist and go to a company about 20 miles away. They do a diagnosis and advise that the filter is likely blocked up with ash and that they can wash it out with a specialist machine, a DCS-20 DPF Cleaning System. It's on You Tube. This will bring the filter back to as new with almost no ash left inside it. I agreed and they washed it out on the 21st April. However, the fault code did not clear this time. As they could not clear the fault they did not charge me. They advised it would appear that a new DPF was necessary. However an after market filter is unavailable for this car.
I decided that if a new filter was to be fitted, I would get it fitted by an expert and get a good warranty so I contacted the Honda main dealer again and arranged for the new DPF to be fitted. On the 11th of May it went into Honda’s. They had it for 5 days and even after fitting a new DPF, new sensor they couldn't get the ECU to clear the fault. Honda UK at Bracknell told them to do a compression test. I agreed and that is when the PGMFI light came on, they started to remove a glow plug to do a test and couldn't without it breaking. An independent garage has since looked and said they can see no damage to the plugs but that plug 2 is showing an open circuit.
I am currently talking to my home insurance about possible legal action.
After receiving the car back with the warning STILL on, I took matters into my own hands at last. If the cars computer thinks the filter is blocked it must be getting the message from somewhere. There is a sensor on the car that is connected to the filter by a rubber and metal pipe. The sensor and wiring were undamaged. I blew the connecting pipe out with compressed air. After reconnecting the sensor, THE FAULT CLEARED! But after just about 2 miles it has come back on again. Since then I replaced the pressure sensor with a used one from a breakers but that made no difference. And, of course, I have blown the pipe out again numerous times and cleaned the sensor contacts with electrical contact cleaner.
SO, I said it was a long back story. Anyhow, WHAT can be causing the filter to show blocked still? Please?
Did it really need another thread ?
So you're now saying it is not fixed ?
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Find a competent garage..
The primary way the ecu will determine whether the DPF is blocked is via the pressure readings across it from the pressure sensor. So what is it saying ?
So you're now saying it is not fixed ?
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Find a competent garage..
The primary way the ecu will determine whether the DPF is blocked is via the pressure readings across it from the pressure sensor. So what is it saying ?
Unless you’ve got a decent diagnostic tester that can show live data readings for dpf pressure and soot / ash content you will be playing parts darts and get nowhere.
Did the Honda dealer reset the ecu and tell it a new filter has been fitted? Just fitting a dpf may not be enough.
DPFs fill up with soot which gets burned off in a regeneration, and ash, which does not.
The ecu calculates ash accumulation and when it thinks it’s full the light comes on.
You need to tell it a new dpf is fitted to reset the counter.
Get some decent Honda diagnostics and look at the data! It may be the ecu is over reading a valid pressure sensor reading.
Did the Honda dealer reset the ecu and tell it a new filter has been fitted? Just fitting a dpf may not be enough.
DPFs fill up with soot which gets burned off in a regeneration, and ash, which does not.
The ecu calculates ash accumulation and when it thinks it’s full the light comes on.
You need to tell it a new dpf is fitted to reset the counter.
Get some decent Honda diagnostics and look at the data! It may be the ecu is over reading a valid pressure sensor reading.
stevieturbo said:
Did it really need another thread ?
Yes, who reads the tail ends of old threads? What's up, running out of threads? stevieturbo said:
Correct. I parked it, no lights. Started it another day, lights. Swore a little...stevieturbo said:
Find a competent garage..
Eeny meeny miny moe...stevieturbo said:
The primary way the ecu will determine whether the DPF is blocked is via the pressure readings across it from the pressure sensor. So what is it saying ?
I only have an android Torque app which doesn't show it. Every time I want someone with a good meter to look it'll be a minimum hours labour. Cost has already piled up beyond what's reasonable. If you have the tools wanna buy it? :/stevemcs said:
Has no2 glow plug been replaced yet
No one wants to touch it just now. 2 garages, Honda dealer and an independent both say they feel it will break if attempted to be removed. Then it's head off to retrieve the bits, mega money, for me, and too much spent already. Cheaper to get a used engine. Or just flog it for repair to someone with the tools and experience.LordLoveLength said:
Unless you’ve got a decent diagnostic tester that can show live data readings for dpf pressure and soot / ash content you will be playing parts darts and get nowhere.
That's where I am, sadly.LordLoveLength said:
Did the Honda dealer reset the ecu and tell it a new filter has been fitted? Just fitting a dpf may not be enough.
They say they did, and updated the ecu software to the latest version. Their MASTER Technician even consulted with Honda UK. This is where I am.LordLoveLength said:
DPFs fill up with soot which gets burned off in a regeneration, and ash, which does not.
The ecu calculates ash accumulation and when it thinks it’s full the light comes on.
You need to tell it a new dpf is fitted to reset the counter.
I understand this. I have no tools to talk to the ecu. Technicians cost £90 a pop. The ecu calculates ash accumulation and when it thinks it’s full the light comes on.
You need to tell it a new dpf is fitted to reset the counter.
LordLoveLength said:
Get some decent Honda diagnostics and look at the data! It may be the ecu is over reading a valid pressure sensor reading.
Please, point me to something I should look at. What's affordable? Honda don't even release the workshop manual to us in the public let alone affordable diagnostic tools. And for a one off use, I don't own a garage to use it on anything else afterwards. What do you think would help me in this?Thanks.
Think I’d be joining any online user groups and seeing who has got diagnostics- usually find members with access to something. Same for workshop manuals.
Also have a hunt on Facebook marketplace
ETA just saw a post on a civic forum with same issue - was resolved by clearing pm value with Autel Maxisys diagnostic tool. They’re common enough.
Also have a hunt on Facebook marketplace
ETA just saw a post on a civic forum with same issue - was resolved by clearing pm value with Autel Maxisys diagnostic tool. They’re common enough.
Edited by LordLoveLength on Thursday 1st July 07:23
With all other manufactures if there is a fault on the glow plugs then the dpf won’t carry out a regen and will block.
Have a look for an injector specialist, we used one on a vivaro they drilled 2 out in our car park. They will usually tackle glow plugs.I have seen someone bolt a glowplug to the block and connect it up just to remove a code.
Most garage diagnostics will show live data, some will allow you to carry out a forced regen, some allow you to do it passive. I know our snap on and autel give the information
Have a look for an injector specialist, we used one on a vivaro they drilled 2 out in our car park. They will usually tackle glow plugs.I have seen someone bolt a glowplug to the block and connect it up just to remove a code.
Most garage diagnostics will show live data, some will allow you to carry out a forced regen, some allow you to do it passive. I know our snap on and autel give the information
Smurfsarepeopletoo said:
Couple of options.
If you still have the old cat, get the internals knocked out of it, and then take it somewhere to have the DPF mapped out.
Or have the internals of the current cat knocked out, and then get it mapped out.
Would save alot of time and hassle.
Until MOT time .....If you still have the old cat, get the internals knocked out of it, and then take it somewhere to have the DPF mapped out.
Or have the internals of the current cat knocked out, and then get it mapped out.
Would save alot of time and hassle.
stevemcs said:
Until MOT time .....
Not really, as long as its only the internals knocked out, they shouldnt notice, and a diesel isnt emissions, its only a smoke test, so as long as its not pouring smoke out, it should be fine.Also, if he has still got the old DPF, then he can just swap them come MOT.
Muldoonsghost said:
No one wants to touch it just now. 2 garages, Honda dealer and an independent both say they feel it will break if attempted to be removed. Then it's head off to retrieve the bits, mega money, for me, and too much spent already. Cheaper to get a used engine. Or just flog it for repair to someone with the tools and experience.
b
ks. There are plenty of guys who specialise in removing such items. And buying a used engine is a whole other minefield and huge expense, just to go round in circles.You need to be searching for a competent garage, maybe even tell people what part of the planet you're from and they might be able to reccommend.
It seems, as said from the start and as so many threads go....you've been attacked by utterly incompetent garages and for the most part main dealers. Which is beyond disgraceful.
Or just cut your losses and sell it.
Chris32345 said:
Has the ECU been told da new dog was fitted?
I prefer this version of your posts. Hi and thanks for the response. Honda say they have done so, and have also put the latest version of the cars software on. I cannot think that even the most illiterate Tech would fail to do that, especially as they involved Bracknell.
stevieturbo said:
Muldoonsghost said:
No one wants to touch it just now. 2 garages, Honda dealer and an independent both say they feel it will break if attempted to be removed. Then it's head off to retrieve the bits, mega money, for me, and too much spent already. Cheaper to get a used engine. Or just flog it for repair to someone with the tools and experience.
bks. There are plenty of guys who specialise in removing such items. And buying a used engine is a whole other minefield and huge expense, just to go round in circles.You need to be searching for a competent garage, maybe even tell people what part of the planet you're from and they might be able to reccommend.
It seems, as said from the start and as so many threads go....you've been attacked by utterly incompetent garages and for the most part main dealers. Which is beyond disgraceful.
Or just cut your losses and sell it.
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