Will this automotive climate affect supercar ownership?
Discussion
As a former Lamborghini owner, having sold my car about 9 years ago, I feel I am ready to start considering another. However the market and indeed automotive climate in the UK has made me rather anxious about making the decision. I was wondering if anyone had any opinions on the following:
Will these cars be banned from cities and towns in the near future? The starting point is this ULEZ scheme, but where could it end?
Will the demonisation of petrol and diesel cars in favour of hybrid and electric bring about the reduction of actual petrol stations, thus heightening prices etc?
Is it outside the realms of possibility that the government could amend the law in order to enforce retro-fitted speed limiters into older cars, in keeping with this new concept to have them fitted in all new cars from 2022.
Could the government keep raising the road tax on these cars to a point where it could seriously affect the supercar market?
Whilst my questions may seem overly paranoid and silly, seeing how the internet is now being so censored and manipulated, anything is possible. I remember the care-free days of supercar ownership - this all seems very different to me.
I would love to hear your thoughts on the above, and any other relevant points.
Will these cars be banned from cities and towns in the near future? The starting point is this ULEZ scheme, but where could it end?
Will the demonisation of petrol and diesel cars in favour of hybrid and electric bring about the reduction of actual petrol stations, thus heightening prices etc?
Is it outside the realms of possibility that the government could amend the law in order to enforce retro-fitted speed limiters into older cars, in keeping with this new concept to have them fitted in all new cars from 2022.
Could the government keep raising the road tax on these cars to a point where it could seriously affect the supercar market?
Whilst my questions may seem overly paranoid and silly, seeing how the internet is now being so censored and manipulated, anything is possible. I remember the care-free days of supercar ownership - this all seems very different to me.
I would love to hear your thoughts on the above, and any other relevant points.
I think the OP’s concerns are well founded.
Look at what is happening around us.
I think that older internal combustion engined vehicles will be taxed off the roads. All cars need to go electric/hybrid.
Just my opinion
Ps most people who buy new cars lease them, so not such a problem to switch
Look at what is happening around us.
I think that older internal combustion engined vehicles will be taxed off the roads. All cars need to go electric/hybrid.
Just my opinion
Ps most people who buy new cars lease them, so not such a problem to switch
Edited by Hurri360 on Wednesday 17th April 08:23
The issues you raise are not silly or paranoid .
Ignore the one word answers , and consider the real world pressures on government to act .
Climate change activists , Mumsnet , and general dogooders (NB- some of them with very good , and with very strong cases ) , have , and will continue to lobby very actively .
As Ferruccio says , motorists need to mount a response , but we have a less strong case , and are not as united .
All those threats that you highlight in your OP may well happen , to a greater or lesser extent , over the years .
So there is a lot of sense in those posts that say ''Do it while you still can ''
I have stopped using my cars except between 5AM and 6.30 AM in the Summer --- where is the joy in driving at other times .
A great shame that I am choosing to use them so much less than previously , but I want to really enjoy every fraction of a mile that I drive in them ( otherwise you might as well just sit in them in the garage , and make vroom , vroom noises )--- surely that's the least respect that we can show to these gems .
Traffic and unmarked cars are the real killjoys.
Last year I drove more in Continental Europe than I did in the UK , and it is only a little better there ---- the days of real fun are very definitely over .
This makes the case for track days , but why not get ( or hire ) the appropriate tool for the job -- a light-weight track car rather than a supercar .
There are many other ways of enjoying a supercar , so exploit those too --- just gazing at them , washing them , writing about them , talking about them
Finally , if you are worried about the financial aspect of supercar ownership ( and you would be crazy not to ) , then make allowances for a steep drop in the value of your car when you come to sell .
On the other hand if you buy something that you really want you will not want to sell it , so this consideration does not come into play .
I believe that we need to be prepared for a steep drop in the price of supercars , bar those of genuine historic value
Ignore the one word answers , and consider the real world pressures on government to act .
Climate change activists , Mumsnet , and general dogooders (NB- some of them with very good , and with very strong cases ) , have , and will continue to lobby very actively .
As Ferruccio says , motorists need to mount a response , but we have a less strong case , and are not as united .
All those threats that you highlight in your OP may well happen , to a greater or lesser extent , over the years .
So there is a lot of sense in those posts that say ''Do it while you still can ''
I have stopped using my cars except between 5AM and 6.30 AM in the Summer --- where is the joy in driving at other times .
A great shame that I am choosing to use them so much less than previously , but I want to really enjoy every fraction of a mile that I drive in them ( otherwise you might as well just sit in them in the garage , and make vroom , vroom noises )--- surely that's the least respect that we can show to these gems .
Traffic and unmarked cars are the real killjoys.
Last year I drove more in Continental Europe than I did in the UK , and it is only a little better there ---- the days of real fun are very definitely over .
This makes the case for track days , but why not get ( or hire ) the appropriate tool for the job -- a light-weight track car rather than a supercar .
There are many other ways of enjoying a supercar , so exploit those too --- just gazing at them , washing them , writing about them , talking about them
Finally , if you are worried about the financial aspect of supercar ownership ( and you would be crazy not to ) , then make allowances for a steep drop in the value of your car when you come to sell .
On the other hand if you buy something that you really want you will not want to sell it , so this consideration does not come into play .
I believe that we need to be prepared for a steep drop in the price of supercars , bar those of genuine historic value
I think all your concerns are within the realms of possibility, but none of them should be of great concern for a while yet (think 10+ years).
Cars being banned from city centres?
Quite possibly from large cities (London, Manchester, etc), but unlikely in the near term in smaller cities and towns, just from a logistical standpoint. The infrastructure to enforce such a bad is expensive to install and maintain, so only makes sense in larger population centres. But I'm not sure I'd want a supercar in central London anyway.
Removal of petrol stations?
We could see the number of stations gradually reducing, but petrol prices aren't driven by the number of stations, but by oil prices and taxation. And if petrol prices of £2 a litre are a problem for someone then I don't think a supercar is a good idea anyway.
Retro-fitting speed limiters?
Highly, highly unlikely. Not politically, I'm sure there would be the political will for it, but economically and logistically. The system uses a combination of GPS, road sign recognition, an on-board speed limit database and an electronic throttle control, all tied into a central computer system. Retro fitting it would cost many thousands per car, tens of billions of pounds in total, and effectively write-off a huge proportion of privately owned cars. Far better just to continue encouraging the replacement of existing cars.
Taxing supercars much more heavily?
Maybe, but this would also happen slowly, and as with petrol prices if you can really afford a supercar it shouldn't worry you too much. Also supercars have an international market, so unless every country around the world did this the export market would prop up prices to some extent.
I'm preparing to buy my first Ferrari next year and none of these things put me off one iota. Sure the value might drop if the Government does something extreme, or it might not. I might get hit by a bus tomorrow, or I might not. I'm not going to limit my life just in case the worst case scenario happens and it ends up being the wrong decision.
Cars being banned from city centres?
Quite possibly from large cities (London, Manchester, etc), but unlikely in the near term in smaller cities and towns, just from a logistical standpoint. The infrastructure to enforce such a bad is expensive to install and maintain, so only makes sense in larger population centres. But I'm not sure I'd want a supercar in central London anyway.
Removal of petrol stations?
We could see the number of stations gradually reducing, but petrol prices aren't driven by the number of stations, but by oil prices and taxation. And if petrol prices of £2 a litre are a problem for someone then I don't think a supercar is a good idea anyway.
Retro-fitting speed limiters?
Highly, highly unlikely. Not politically, I'm sure there would be the political will for it, but economically and logistically. The system uses a combination of GPS, road sign recognition, an on-board speed limit database and an electronic throttle control, all tied into a central computer system. Retro fitting it would cost many thousands per car, tens of billions of pounds in total, and effectively write-off a huge proportion of privately owned cars. Far better just to continue encouraging the replacement of existing cars.
Taxing supercars much more heavily?
Maybe, but this would also happen slowly, and as with petrol prices if you can really afford a supercar it shouldn't worry you too much. Also supercars have an international market, so unless every country around the world did this the export market would prop up prices to some extent.
I'm preparing to buy my first Ferrari next year and none of these things put me off one iota. Sure the value might drop if the Government does something extreme, or it might not. I might get hit by a bus tomorrow, or I might not. I'm not going to limit my life just in case the worst case scenario happens and it ends up being the wrong decision.
Still think they will be around for fun days and we will pay more as they do in many other countries . I have a X for town use and family car and after 2 years I see the logic sadly . They are so good and cheap to run in town faster as well .
But I still like a good drive getting 8mpg in a V12 or Flat 6
But I still like a good drive getting 8mpg in a V12 or Flat 6
carspath said:
I have stopped using my cars except between 5AM and 6.30 AM in the Summer --- where is the joy in driving at other times .
Surely this is a wind-up comment? Can only imagine you spend your life in central London?Enjoyed a few spirited drives up here in north east England this week with school hols. Roads are virtually deserted, even during morning rush hour. Ok roads are getting busier but I don’t agree that many in the UK have to get up in the middle of the night to have a bit of fun.
dlmuk said:
Will the demonisation of petrol and diesel cars in favour of hybrid and electric bring about the reduction of actual petrol stations, thus heightening prices etc?
In cities the Government's demonization of Diesel can be justified.Modern petrol cars however are pretty clean.
Currently there's a huge top-down marketing push by lobbyist EV manufacturers and the authorities are playing ball. But, just wait, once EV's have sold enough units the carrots of free parking and charging points will rapidly turn into plug and pay £££.
garystoybox said:
carspath said:
I have stopped using my cars except between 5AM and 6.30 AM in the Summer --- where is the joy in driving at other times .
Surely this is a wind-up comment? Can only imagine you spend your life in central London?Enjoyed a few spirited drives up here in north east England this week with school hols. Roads are virtually deserted, even during morning rush hour. Ok roads are getting busier but I don’t agree that many in the UK have to get up in the middle of the night to have a bit of fun.
Great drive down to the aero cafe at Goodwood early on a Sunday morning to have breakfast with Jason, Martin and others only to be stuck in so much traffic coming back it wasn’t worth overtaking.
A friend said it’s just as bad in the West Country
Personally I see the exact opposite! Yes all new cars will be battery/hybrid powered and automatics. But there are way too many petrol cars in the world to start banning them in the next few years. It will be a natural cull as in older cars are scrapped and combustion ones will not replace them. I believe anyone with a nice condition low mileage manual naturally aspirated car will actually be quids in as the years roll by. Yes legislation will change and eventually I honestly believe humans will not be allowed to drive it will be all atonymous vehicles only and deaths on the roads will plummet. But not in our lifetime (well def not mine) so short term as in the next 20 years I would think the supercars with the criteria I mentioned will increase significantly before they become museum pieces. Hey we will see.... Or you young ones should!
Adz man said:
I used the ulez plate checker and the car I wanted came up ok exempt
I've not shown any interest in this ULEZ thing as I make a point of not visiting London in any form of transport but seeing you mention it inspired me to check a few of my cars. This made me laugh.F12 6300cc V12 - exempt
1967 Abarth 595cc - not exempt
Hahaha.
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