high mileage AJP8's
Discussion
Who has the highest mileage AJP8?
What are the intervals for replacing internal parts?
I know that the Rover V8 suffers from cam wear from 80,000 miles +
I am just interested in the life span of TVR's own. I assume it being a fairly high strung race engine will mean its not as long lasting as the Rover?
I searched the forums, but maybe my selection of keywords is poor as it just dug up the typical 'My AJP8 went pop' thread.
Thanks,
Ston
What are the intervals for replacing internal parts?
I know that the Rover V8 suffers from cam wear from 80,000 miles +
I am just interested in the life span of TVR's own. I assume it being a fairly high strung race engine will mean its not as long lasting as the Rover?
I searched the forums, but maybe my selection of keywords is poor as it just dug up the typical 'My AJP8 went pop' thread.
Thanks,
Ston
I think "My AJP went pop" coming out all the time says it all.
The trouble with race or race derived engines is that they are not conceived with the idea of driving to the supermarket. Most of them are stripped and rebuilt frequently but still have a propensity to throw themselves apart despite careful warming up usually in the hands of somebody who fully understands the care required, and has the ability to notice problems at the first sign.
Unfortunately I rather doubt that many AJP owners/users are entirely conversant with just how finicky race engines are and imagine it to be like a high performance Rover.
Personally, while I applaud TVR for their own engines, I feel the concept is fundamentally flawed for use in a road car and believe it will bring them to their knees shortly if they don't develop it or abandon them very quickly.
It may sound like I am just another moaning anorak, but I do still own and love a TVR, despite my misgivings on the AJP8.
The trouble with race or race derived engines is that they are not conceived with the idea of driving to the supermarket. Most of them are stripped and rebuilt frequently but still have a propensity to throw themselves apart despite careful warming up usually in the hands of somebody who fully understands the care required, and has the ability to notice problems at the first sign.
Unfortunately I rather doubt that many AJP owners/users are entirely conversant with just how finicky race engines are and imagine it to be like a high performance Rover.
Personally, while I applaud TVR for their own engines, I feel the concept is fundamentally flawed for use in a road car and believe it will bring them to their knees shortly if they don't develop it or abandon them very quickly.
It may sound like I am just another moaning anorak, but I do still own and love a TVR, despite my misgivings on the AJP8.
I think you are being a bit unfair on the AJP it is a cracking engine, i just took the time to let in warm up and then they seem ok.
I look at the Cerb as a racing car for the road and in fairness neither car actually let me down, the only reason for the rebuild is that £10 worth of mobil 1 every 250 miles was stretching my finances!
I understand the AJP to have been designed by al melling and as such most dealers are happy to reccomend it, one anonomous dealer did say AJP is ten times as reliable as the S6 and that he would not touch a S6 Cerb if he were buying!
I know of owners of S6 engined cars whom have many more problems, both rebuild wise, but also the car going out of tune 1,500-2,000 miles after a service. In credit to the AJP mine never felt out of tune!
Bennno
quote:
I understand the AJP to have been designed by al melling and as such most dealers are happy to reccomend it, one anonomous dealer did say AJP is ten times as reliable as the S6
But then Al Melling outlined the Speed Six before John Ravenscroft took over the development as with the AJP V8, so it's hard to imagine that this is the sole origin of the problems.
Has anyone tried taking the V8 or S6 to a decent engine builder when they had problems ? What did they have to say about it ?
Yours, Jon Dokic
Bennno,
I think you partially misunderstand me. I do not think the AJP is neccessarily a bad engine, I simply feel it is not suitable for a road car where a fair percentage of the customers have little grasp of the realities of running this type of engine. On the secondhand market it is more of a liability as you do not know how understanding the former owner was.
£10 of oil in 250mls!! - would suggest to me that if you had not chosen to rebuild it, the choice may shortly have been made for you!
On the AJP being 10 times more reliable - 10 x zero is still zero .
Seriously though, put the AJP in a racing car where expensive rebuilds, blowups and big bills are par for the course and I am sure it is as good as any other , but in a road car??
Some years ago I had a Porsche 928 GT which was a 5 ltr
V8 putting out 320 bhp. It was utterly reliable despite being hammered, never went wrong, did not sound like a bag of spanners,used NO oil between services amd I sold it at 107,000 mls. Also Merc do a 4.3 V8 , used in the AMG C43 which in low tune is over 300 bhp, and I bet it would do over 100,000 with no problems. I am sure either of these could put out over 350 with a bit of tweaking but still be bulletproof.
To use the race engine theory to justify rebuids etc. is not really on when other similar engines can have power and long life.
I think you partially misunderstand me. I do not think the AJP is neccessarily a bad engine, I simply feel it is not suitable for a road car where a fair percentage of the customers have little grasp of the realities of running this type of engine. On the secondhand market it is more of a liability as you do not know how understanding the former owner was.
£10 of oil in 250mls!! - would suggest to me that if you had not chosen to rebuild it, the choice may shortly have been made for you!
On the AJP being 10 times more reliable - 10 x zero is still zero .
Seriously though, put the AJP in a racing car where expensive rebuilds, blowups and big bills are par for the course and I am sure it is as good as any other , but in a road car??
Some years ago I had a Porsche 928 GT which was a 5 ltr
V8 putting out 320 bhp. It was utterly reliable despite being hammered, never went wrong, did not sound like a bag of spanners,used NO oil between services amd I sold it at 107,000 mls. Also Merc do a 4.3 V8 , used in the AMG C43 which in low tune is over 300 bhp, and I bet it would do over 100,000 with no problems. I am sure either of these could put out over 350 with a bit of tweaking but still be bulletproof.
To use the race engine theory to justify rebuids etc. is not really on when other similar engines can have power and long life.
Just saw jondokic's reply. The trouble is from what I understand, that no information or engine parts other than service items are given to the dealers, let alone an outside engine builder. This means that no outside opinion will ever be given on the integrity of the engines as the factory have to get every single one back if anything goes wrong. Can you imagine the reaction and bill you would get from the factory if you handed them a stripped down engine, but I bet it would reveal a lot.
If anybody wants to donate an engine I reckon the guy who is rebuilding the Hart engine for my racing car would have some interesting comments to make!!
If anybody wants to donate an engine I reckon the guy who is rebuilding the Hart engine for my racing car would have some interesting comments to make!!
quote:
Seriously though, put the AJP in a racing car where expensive rebuilds, blowups and big bills are par for the course and I am sure it is as good as any other , but in a road car?? Some years ago I had a Porsche 928 GT which was a 5 ltr V8 putting out 320 bhp. It was utterly reliable despite being hammered, never went wrong, did not sound like a bag of spanners,used NO oil between services amd I sold it at 107,000 mls. Also Merc do a 4.3 V8 , used in the AMG C43 which in low tune is over 300 bhp, and I bet it would do over 100,000 with no problems. I am sure either of these could put out over 350 with a bit of tweaking but still be bulletproof.
To use the race engine theory to justify rebuids etc. is not really on when other similar engines can have power and long life.
Ruf,
I agree to some extent as I have owned M3's and a C36 AMG prior to my TVR's and since my last Cerby debarcle, decided to bite the bullet and buy a 996.
That said i miss the character and the all out performance of the Cerb...if TVR could get it right and it was totally dependable then i would have no reason to look elsewhere.
Bennno
(ps. Mr 'tvr-jumper' please read the last paragraph twice i am not being derisory!)
I guess there are good AJP's and bad ones. I have just gone past 50,000 miles (52,988 for those who really care !) and have had no engine problems. I dfo treat the car with respect when warming up - not just until the water is at temperature on the gauge but watch the oil pressure to see when it has warmed up too. Anyone who was at Mallory Park when two early Cerberas were out in January will remember the trail of oil from the Hydratrak. The car had been left idling for at least half an hour but the transmission was still sub zero (abour -5 degrees from memory)
My car was October '87 production which I understand means it had the new cams and it doesn't sound any noisier than when new - or am I just tempting fate !
The car is driven "every day" with a mixture of 12 mile commutes and long motorway drives. It has done several track and airfield days as well as a few mad dashes down Duxford runway and seems happy in any of the above environments. The owner seems happier in the latter two and the grin factor outweighs the problems he has experienced.
I would like to hear from any other owners of high mileage AJP's - has anyone really done more than 50K and if so, what is in store !
My car was October '87 production which I understand means it had the new cams and it doesn't sound any noisier than when new - or am I just tempting fate !
The car is driven "every day" with a mixture of 12 mile commutes and long motorway drives. It has done several track and airfield days as well as a few mad dashes down Duxford runway and seems happy in any of the above environments. The owner seems happier in the latter two and the grin factor outweighs the problems he has experienced.
I would like to hear from any other owners of high mileage AJP's - has anyone really done more than 50K and if so, what is in store !
quote:
I guess there are good AJP's and bad ones. I have just gone past 50,000 miles (52,988 for those who really care !) and have had no engine problems. I dfo treat the car with respect when warming up - not just until the water is at temperature on the gauge but watch the oil pressure to see when it has warmed up too. Anyone who was at Mallory Park when two early Cerberas were out in January will remember the trail of oil from the Hydratrak. The car had been left idling for at least half an hour but the transmission was still sub zero (abour -5 degrees from memory)
I was there too and remember it well. One split a radiator too if you recall. My 4.5 has only done a measly 26,000 miles but I get a very respectable 1200 to 1300 miles to a litre of Mobil 1 (I'm told that's what it ought to be) and there are no nasty noises. Like you I think the secret is in very careful warm up. I keep the revs under 3000 and the throttle very light until the temperature has stabilised at 82 egrees for arond 5 miles and the oil pressure has dropped to 52 psi at 2500 rpm. The whole process takes about 10 miles or so from staret up which also gives the tranmission oils a chance to thin out a bit. Even then, it doesn't get revs over 5000 until around 20 miles are covered
quote:
My car was October '87 production which I understand means it had the new cams and it doesn't sound any noisier than when new - or am I just tempting fate !
I would like to hear from any other owners of high mileage AJP's - has anyone really done more than 50K and if so, what is in store !
Wow an 87' that must be like a D reg or something didnt think they were that old??
Ben
I have an S6 Cerb with 31k miles it has been "ON HOLIDAY" in blackpool for 7 weeks now - and this is the third time - two of them for engine rebuild. I have an M3 conv on order for delivery in May and the sunshine. I would appreciate your opinion - do I bite the bullet and sell the cerb for less than £20k which is likely now and get a car that will work and is not much slower, or keep it another year as it won't (can't) depreciate much more. I am now a normal milage driver.
quote:
I have an S6 Cerb with 31k miles it has been "ON HOLIDAY" in blackpool for 7 weeks now - and this is the third time - two of them for engine rebuild. I have an M3 conv on order for delivery in May and the sunshine. I would appreciate your opinion - do I bite the bullet and sell the cerb for less than £20k which is likely now and get a car that will work and is not much slower, or keep it another year as it won't (can't) depreciate much more. I am now a normal milage driver.
A car that will work and is not much slower? you must mean a 5.0 Chimaera!
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