Warning about used Discovery Sport and Evoque Diesels - LRM

[Grimsby]

I was looking at a used Land Rover DS but advised to be careful because of a recurrent steering fault that can cost £2500 to £3000 to put right. Apparently this is caused by salt corrosion of three aluminium bolts and in Canada they even had a recall but for some reason the DfT have let them off - as usual. Added to which Land Rover Monthly is now warning about known DPF problems on the DS and Evoque with possible engine failures from poor lubrication.


https://www.dropbox.com/s/d0bcrd7sve4l598/D8_Dilut...
https://www.evoqueownersclub.co.uk/attachments/lrm...

Edited by Grimsby on Tuesday 7th January 20:11

[snapdragon69]

They should have stuck to making rugged vehicles and not fashion statements.

[anonymous-user]

Speaking to someone who had an Evoque but doesnt now, the reason was steering failure which the main dealer quoted 'over £3,000'. I wasnt aware of the issue but looking on various forums it can happen at any time

[jl34]

it's a shoddy designed steering rack by ZF lenksystem of Germany. I believe the bolts holding the motor and rack are the problem. You would think ZF would have tested them in salty condition's.

[cylinderfin]

Grimsby said:

I was looking at a used Land Rover DS but advised to be careful because of a recurrent steering fault that can cost £2500 to £3000 to put right. Apparently this is caused by salt corrosion of three aluminium bolts and in Canada they even had a recall but for some reason the DfT have let them off - as usual. Added to which Land Rover Monthly is now warning about known DPF problems on the DS and Evoque with possible engine failures from poor lubrication.
Aluminium bolts? You sure? Don’t go near any of the JLR stuff mate. They are the epitome of style over substance. They should be embarrassed by their reliability. Poor design, poor engineering, poor quality control.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/d0bcrd7sve4l598/D8_Dilut...
https://www.evoqueownersclub.co.uk/attachments/lrm...

Edited by Grimsby on Tuesday 7th January 20:11

[Clivey]

snapdragon69 said:

They should have stuck to making rugged vehicles and not fashion statements.

The problem is that new rugged / mechanically simple vehicles without complex electronics are being legislated out of existence.

[PistonBroker]

I certainly wouldn't buy one OP. In fact, I expect never to get into the brand ever again. Bit of a silly stance of theirs considering I was thinking an RRS could be next.

18/18 DS 2.0 150ps diesel that needed two DPFs within the first year. As per the PDF linked to, it was blamed on my driving style, despite that not having changed from the 15/65 Tiguan 2.0 150ps diesel we ran for 2 years before it without issue.

Frustratingly, we decided as this was the car Mrs PB most wanted, it made sense to commit to a 3-year lease. So we've got the bloody thing for another year yet but have to leave it laid up on the drive most of the time for fear of it sooting up. Lex, the guys behind Land Rover finance, aren't interested in the slightest which again strikes me as silly - why not let me out of this lease on the condition I take out another lease on a more 'suitable' car?

I'm only now putting V Power in it - on the basis it's cleaner - and, as said, it now only leaves the drive if it's going somewhere a decent distance away. This, touch wood, appears to be working as we've had no issues since the last DPF almost a year ago. I realised cold weather must be an issue - the DPFs went in December and March respectively - presumably, if the car struggles to warm up as it is, then cold weather can't help matters in the slightest.

If you're desperate for a diesel OP, then I'd go shopping elsewhere. It's worth considering how much you need a diesel though - I'll be going petrol next time as EU6 does appear, in JLR's defence, to have been a nightmare for many.

[Sheepshanks]

PistonBroker said:

...15/65 Tiguan 2.0 150ps diesel
.....
I'm only now putting V Power in it -

Missus has the same Tiguan and it's only ever had V-Power - I'm terrified of putting cheaper stuff in it! Thankfully she only uses a tankful per month.

Would love her to have a Discovery Sport. I'd maybe risk it with a good value lease, but there's absolutely no way I'm taking that gamble with my own money.

[Funk]

Presumably the DPF issue will also affect all other Ingenuim diesel-engined cars such as Jags?

Edited by Funk on Monday 17th February 17:19

[Dashnine]

Funk said:

Presumably the DPF issue will also affect all other Ingenuim diesll-engined cars such as Jags?

Only affects transverse installed Ingeniums as there's no room for the DPF up in the engine bay where it can get nice and warm. Affects the larger Land Rovers too with V6 engines for same reason.

As long as it gets chance to do an active regen (using diesel to burn off the soot) every couple of hundred miles by driving for 30 mins after warmed up and hitting the trigger speed of 40mph it'll be fine.

Any low mileage Euro6 diesel is going to have these issues to some extent, all those people saying "I never had this problem on my previous (insert car of choice here)" probably had a Euro5 vehicle with less stringent emissions hardware.

[PistonBroker]

Dashnine said:

As long as it gets chance to do an active regen (using diesel to burn off the soot) every couple of hundred miles by driving for 30 mins after warmed up and hitting the trigger speed of 40mph it'll be fine.

Any low mileage Euro6 diesel is going to have these issues to some extent, all those people saying "I never had this problem on my previous (insert car of choice here)" probably had a Euro5 vehicle with less stringent emissions hardware.

I think I'm the only one on the thread who as much as said that and, despite not making it clear in my post, I appreciate it's the difference between EU6 and EU5. But that, to my mind, means JLR should be more sympathetic - 'we realise we ballsed-up this EU6 installation and will help out how we can'. But of course, it's much more cost-effective to simply blame the driver.

I'm not convinced your solution would always work. The 20-page piece linked to in the OP seems to suggest otherwise as well.

I wish they'd put a display on the dash - 'DPF is regenerating, don't switch off until complete'. As it stands, you hop out of the car after a long drive, smell that it's been regenning, but then wonder whether you've switched it off during the regen, after the regen, if it was mid-regen will it start again when you get going again . . . .

[Sheepshanks]

Dashnine said:

Any low mileage Euro6 diesel is going to have these issues to some extent, all those people saying "I never had this problem on my previous (insert car of choice here)" probably had a Euro5 vehicle with less stringent emissions hardware.

Nope - our Tiguan is EU6. Touching massive piece of wood, been fine so far (4.5yrs of short journeys). Active regens can start within a couple of mins of engine start and run for about 10 mins. We're forever stopping it mid-regen and it doesn't cause any issues. It only active regens - apparently in UK use they never get anywhere near passive regen temps.

[PistonBroker]

Sheepshanks said:

Nope - our Tiguan is EU6.

Which brings us back round to the links in the OP. JLR ballsed up EU6 whereas others, like VAG, seem to have nailed it.

[Renny]

PistonBroker said:

Which brings us back round to the links in the OP. JLR ballsed up EU6 whereas others, like VAG, seem to have nailed it.

I think with the Land Rover installations, its all due to DPF being further downstream of the engine exhaust manifold, so it doesn't get up to adequate temperatures, even with active regeneration.

We had a Disco Sport on order when they changed the engines to the Ingenium 4.5 years ago, but they mysteriously couldn't deliver. So glad we didn't get caught up with this as we cancelled and bought a Discovery 4 instead. Just about to get rid of it as the running costs are getting silly; at 38K miles and needs suspension bushes, propshaft centre bearing has gone and with rear brakes needing ovehauled, dealer has estimated £2500+ of repairs. Oddly enough, we're not buying another Land Rover, which after 24 years of Discoveries, is pretty poor.

[Snoopy7]

I have a 2015 RR Vogue TDV6 bought from new and regularly dealer serviced. The steering rack failed in Dec 2019 after approx 25000 miles. I was completely unable to steer . Motor had sheared off the steering rack. It could have been a fatality if this had happended on a motorway !
I am still awaiting on the Driving Vehicle Safety Agency ( UK Government Dept.) to get back to me after they contacted Land Rover.. The garage I took it alerted the DVSA and said they had fixed 4 others of these ( 2 on Evoques) .There is a safety recall in Canada : https://www.guideautoweb.com/en/recalls/2019473/

I also had a serious failure after 6 months on this car - it just stopped - cut out - no steering everything went. L R came and did something on the engine management diagnostics but 3 months later - it happened again and this time LR sent the AA and they did it properly. This was quite a frightening situation to be in.(twice) .

[Mikehig]

Sheepshanks said:

Dashnine said:

Any low mileage Euro6 diesel is going to have these issues to some extent, all those people saying "I never had this problem on my previous (insert car of choice here)" probably had a Euro5 vehicle with less stringent emissions hardware.

Nope - our Tiguan is EU6. Touching massive piece of wood, been fine so far (4.5yrs of short journeys). Active regens can start within a couple of mins of engine start and run for about 10 mins. We're forever stopping it mid-regen and it doesn't cause any issues. It only active regens - apparently in UK use they never get anywhere near passive regen temps.

Has your car had the "fix" that was required on all VW group diesels after "Dieselgate" in about 2015/16? If yours was not serviced by VW it may have escaped.
There's been a lot of web commentary that "fixed" cars suffer a lot more DPF failures as well as worse fuel economy.

[Jag_NE]

Mikehig said:

Sheepshanks said:

Dashnine said:

Any low mileage Euro6 diesel is going to have these issues to some extent, all those people saying "I never had this problem on my previous (insert car of choice here)" probably had a Euro5 vehicle with less stringent emissions hardware.

Nope - our Tiguan is EU6. Touching massive piece of wood, been fine so far (4.5yrs of short journeys). Active regens can start within a couple of mins of engine start and run for about 10 mins. We're forever stopping it mid-regen and it doesn't cause any issues. It only active regens - apparently in UK use they never get anywhere near passive regen temps.

Has your car had the "fix" that was required on all VW group diesels after "Dieselgate" in about 2015/16? If yours was not serviced by VW it may have escaped.
There's been a lot of web commentary that "fixed" cars suffer a lot more DPF failures as well as worse fuel economy.

I have a Euro6 diesel that has been trouble free and does a short commute every day.

[Sheepshanks]

Mikehig said:

Has your car had the "fix" that was required on all VW group diesels after "Dieselgate" in about 2015/16? If yours was not serviced by VW it may have escaped.
There's been a lot of web commentary that "fixed" cars suffer a lot more DPF failures as well as worse fuel economy.

Nope - that was for the EU5 models, with VW's EA189 engine. Ours is the later EA288, EU6 engine - it was fitted for the last few months of the mk1 Tiguans, which is what we have.

[Grimsby]

Update on the narrow escape we had with the Land Rover diesel. While we moved on and bought a lovely Volvo XC60 I see somebody else has taken JLR to court alleging that the company knew about these problems and deliberately concealed the information from buyers. Pretty much confirms what LRM said.

7.. Despite notice of the DPF Defect from, among other things, pre-production testing, warranty data, customer complaints at dealerships, and dealership repair orders, Defendant has not recalled the Class Vehicles to repair the Defect, has not offered its customers a suitable repair or replacement free of charge, and has not offered to reimburse all Class Vehicle owners and leaseholders the costs they incurred relating to diagnosing and repairing the DPF Defect.
8. Defendant knew of and concealed the DPF Defect that is contained in every Class Vehicle, along with the attendant dangerous safety problems and associated repair costs, from Plaintiff and the other Class Members both at the time of sale and repair and thereafter. As a result of their reliance on Defendant’s omissions and/or misrepresentations, owners and/or lessees of the Class Vehicles have suffered ascertainable loss of money, property, and/or loss in value of their Class Vehicles.

https://www.classaction.org/media/shaaya-v-jaguar-...

Edited by Grimsby on Friday 18th September 12:04

[anonymous-user]

At one point in China 70 % of all JLR cars were recalled, highest in history.


It amazes me how JLR sell premium products that seemly made with corners cut. Quality has never been high on there agenda.