996 Turbo X50 Tuning advice
Discussion
Can any one tell me what you should update to get more and better bhp from my 996TT X50. Have had the ECU remapped and sports exhaust fitted to stage1 (around 510 bhp, but am wondering if I have missed anything. After looking around I see some people fit new DV's, IC's etc. Any help and advice most welcome
Moosh said:
Can any one tell me what you should update to get more and better bhp from my 996TT X50. Have had the ECU remapped and sports exhaust fitted to stage1 (around 510 bhp, but am wondering if I have missed anything. After looking around I see some people fit new DV's, IC's etc. Any help and advice most welcome
Moosh have you had your car dyno'd since you had it mapped.... .what exhaust are you running ?Depends how much hp you are chasing.... fact is that you've had the easy wins so you need to really start digging deep into the wallet if you want material increases.... doing the dv's and hoses will help reliability but not do anything for power.
Next stage is gonna be putting bigger turbo's in, and various ancillaries to supply the nec quants of fuel... such as bigger injectors.
Have you got 6pots on your car ? I'd go no further with tuning until thats done... how about your suspension and clutch, if you are stock on either of these, then you are almost definitely gonna need to upgrade them both to make the most out of further power increases.
Once you are past the easy gains, you really do need to look at other aspects of the car, so ask yourself just how far do you wanna take it, and make any upgrades compatable with your end goals.
Moosh said:
Can any one tell me what you should update to get more and better bhp from my 996TT X50. Have had the ECU remapped and sports exhaust fitted to stage1 (around 510 bhp, but am wondering if I have missed anything. After looking around I see some people fit new DV's, IC's etc. Any help and advice most welcome
Oh and if you have an X50 then you prob don't need to upgrade the i'cs until you are into the 600hp+ range... and even then, only if you plan on beating on the car until it heatsoaks... I believe ruf use the GT2 i/cs on its nardo pack (albeit they also use stock dv's and hoses, which i've always found strange !!)Moosh said:
I have Europipes fitted stage1 and yes have 6 pots on the front wheels. Looking to reach around 580/590 bhp
With that power you can do this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zKxHyfKG3AYZeroH said:
I believe ruf use the GT2 i/cs on its nardo pack (albeit they also use stock dv's and hoses, which i've always found strange !!)
Ruf uses GT2 I/Cs maybe because they have actually properly tested the cheap (mainly US made) aftermarket intercoolers and deemed that in actual road use the stock ones are better ?RS Tuning also use stock DVs and hoses - maybe that these "must have" items are actually not necessary apart from adding a little bit of extra margin for the "tuner" ?
Moosh said:
I have Europipes fitted stage1 and yes have 6 pots on the front wheels. Looking to reach around 580/590 bhp
Cool - so you have a nice platform to play with ! If you want a professional view on what you need to do to get there, Suggest speaking to Matt at Fearnsport - he knows the turbo inside out and back to front.
Definitely upgrade your dv's and probably should do your hoses (if you want the best then go Samco, full stop), bigger turbos/hybrids and fuelling upgrades.... you may be advised, depending who you talk to, to upgrade headers, I'm not so sure, have heard varying things about their 'worthwhile-ness'...
Other things that come to my head are that above certain flow levels you may need to upgrade the MAF, and also possibly the spark plugs - Matt will be able to advise.
I would also say that unless you're running an upgraded clutch (many people run the Sachs sporting) then budget for a new one !!
I have the GT2 I/Cs due to the X50 pack. Just wondering if I can get more safe bhp without damaging the engine. Mine is around 510 bhp but I hear of claims up to around 550/560 bhp but still stage1. Would 590 bhp be classed as a stage2 upgrade or do you think 590 bhp is achievable with just stage1 components.
TB993tt said:
ZeroH said:
I believe ruf use the GT2 i/cs on its nardo pack (albeit they also use stock dv's and hoses, which i've always found strange !!)
Ruf uses GT2 I/Cs maybe because they have actually properly tested the cheap (mainly US made) aftermarket intercoolers and deemed that in actual road use the stock ones are better ?RS Tuning also use stock DVs and hoses - maybe that these "must have" items are actually not necessary apart from adding a little bit of extra margin for the "tuner" ?
By contrast, the US tuners most definitely have done this with their products against the stock GT2 ones, to show graphically their improved ability to maintain intake temps lower than the GT2 ics over a period of hard running without impeded flow charactieristics.
You can't be serious to think that the GT2 ic's can't be improved... there has to be some product filling the gap between teh GT2's and the Seacan monsters that I know you run !!
Re the hoses and dv's... many many many documented cases of these failing stock. By contrast, how many times have you ever seen someone complain that their Samco F-pipe has split ?
EvoSlayer said:
You should be able to get close to 600hp with K24s and stock fuelling with proper mapping, I'm running 480.7 @ wheels using K24 compressors and stock injectors albeit with a 5Bar fpr.
Will the k24's really flow so much hp?... not impossible perhaps but you'll certainly need very aggressive mapping to do it. I know that in the US, some tuners claim 600hp kits using the stock K24's and correct mapping with various bolt-ons, but I'm somewhat sceptical... Out of interest have you measured your APR's Andy?
Moosh said:
EvoSlayer said:
You should be able to get close to 600hp with K24s and stock fuelling with proper mapping, I'm running 480.7 @ wheels using K24 compressors and stock injectors albeit with a 5Bar fpr.
who done your upgrade for you
EvoSlayer said:
You should be able to get close to 600hp with K24s and stock fuelling with proper mapping, I'm running 480.7 @ wheels using K24 compressors and stock injectors albeit with a 5Bar fpr.
Its late notice mate but on Sat there is a dyno day at Evolve thru 911uk.com.... if you are able to make it there may be a place or two left - be good to see what your car does on a chassis dyno... its in Luton !The more tuned turbos there the better !
ZeroH said:
EvoSlayer said:
You should be able to get close to 600hp with K24s and stock fuelling with proper mapping, I'm running 480.7 @ wheels using K24 compressors and stock injectors albeit with a 5Bar fpr.
Will the k24's really flow so much hp?... not impossible perhaps but you'll certainly need very aggressive mapping to do it. I know that in the US, some tuners claim 600hp kits using the stock K24's and correct mapping with various bolt-ons, but I'm somewhat sceptical... Out of interest have you measured your APR's Andy?
Btw, I thought I'd shown you the RR printouts?
Edited by EvoSlayer on Monday 21st September 15:50
EvoSlayer said:
ZeroH said:
EvoSlayer said:
You should be able to get close to 600hp with K24s and stock fuelling with proper mapping, I'm running 480.7 @ wheels using K24 compressors and stock injectors albeit with a 5Bar fpr.
Will the k24's really flow so much hp?... not impossible perhaps but you'll certainly need very aggressive mapping to do it. I know that in the US, some tuners claim 600hp kits using the stock K24's and correct mapping with various bolt-ons, but I'm somewhat sceptical... Out of interest have you measured your APR's Andy?
Btw, I thought I'd shown you the RR printouts?
Edited by EvoSlayer on Monday 21st September 15:50
ZeroH said:
EvoSlayer said:
ZeroH said:
EvoSlayer said:
You should be able to get close to 600hp with K24s and stock fuelling with proper mapping, I'm running 480.7 @ wheels using K24 compressors and stock injectors albeit with a 5Bar fpr.
Will the k24's really flow so much hp?... not impossible perhaps but you'll certainly need very aggressive mapping to do it. I know that in the US, some tuners claim 600hp kits using the stock K24's and correct mapping with various bolt-ons, but I'm somewhat sceptical... Out of interest have you measured your APR's Andy?
Btw, I thought I'd shown you the RR printouts?
Edited by EvoSlayer on Monday 21st September 15:50
ZeroH said:
Toby, I'm happy for Mr Ruf to come here and say that he has empirical evidence post testing the US i'c competition - but honestly I would doubt that Ruf have purchased a bunch of US i'/c's from the likes of EvoMS, AWE, or Switzer, and have tested them scientifically against the GT2 i/c's.
I don't know if Ruf has done that sort of testing but I know another tuner has, why would they want to use £10K intercoolers when £2K ones will do the job ?ZeroH said:
By contrast, the US tuners most definitely have done this with their products against the stock GT2 ones, to show graphically their improved ability to maintain intake temps lower than the GT2 ics over a period of hard running without impeded flow charactieristics.
Have they really ? You think so ? please show me what testing they have done (and please don't link me to the AWE site with graphs taken from measuring the IAT during a chassis dyno run with little blowers blowing a linear fixed~40mph airflow throught the cores)ZeroH said:
You can't be serious to think that the GT2 ic's can't be improved... there has to be some product filling the gap between teh GT2's and the Seacan monsters that I know you run !!
I run Secans on the 993tt, there is now a cheaper alternative, I have had them made by a company which supplies F1 teams but they still cost £7500 for a pair:
ZeroH said:
Re the hoses and dv's... many many many documented cases of these failing stock. By contrast, how many times have you ever seen someone complain that their Samco F-pipe has split ?!!
documented by who ? the people selling the aftermarket stuff ? old boost hoses will split regardless who makes them 
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