Damage Recorded
Discussion
Hi
can someone clarify what levels of recorded damage there is in laymens terms, in other words you see cars which claim to be Cat D or Cat C?
Do you think it is worth buying a Porsche which is recorded if the job has been done correctly due to the money you can save in the initial purchase?
Would like some clarity on this if possible and some opinions.
can someone clarify what levels of recorded damage there is in laymens terms, in other words you see cars which claim to be Cat D or Cat C?
Do you think it is worth buying a Porsche which is recorded if the job has been done correctly due to the money you can save in the initial purchase?
Would like some clarity on this if possible and some opinions.
Cat D - when car can be repaired, but insurer does not instigate claim. Generally bodywork damage, not structure or mechanics.
Cat C - slightly worse - there must be a strong reason not to repair car.
I'd personall avoid Cat Cs, but as long as the job has been carried out by a trusted bodyshop, there's no reason to avoid Cat Ds.
Cat C - slightly worse - there must be a strong reason not to repair car.
I'd personall avoid Cat Cs, but as long as the job has been carried out by a trusted bodyshop, there's no reason to avoid Cat Ds.
If the car has been deemed a Cat C total loss you have to apply for a VIC...
[url]www.direct.gov.uk/Motoring/BuyingAndSellingAVehicle/AdviceOnBuyingAndSellingAVehicle/AdviceOnBuyingAndSellingArticles/fs/en?CONTENT_ID=4022107&chk=i9R2kk[/url]
and it is noted on on the V5.
Cat D is where the vehicle is unecconomical to repair (the cost of repair is more than the vehicle is worth) normally applied to older vehicles.
It would depend on who has carried out the repairs and the extent of the accident damage as to if I would buy one, but you need to remember that it will sho up on HPI checks so could cause a problem when selling in the future.
[url]www.direct.gov.uk/Motoring/BuyingAndSellingAVehicle/AdviceOnBuyingAndSellingAVehicle/AdviceOnBuyingAndSellingArticles/fs/en?CONTENT_ID=4022107&chk=i9R2kk[/url]
and it is noted on on the V5.
Cat D is where the vehicle is unecconomical to repair (the cost of repair is more than the vehicle is worth) normally applied to older vehicles.
It would depend on who has carried out the repairs and the extent of the accident damage as to if I would buy one, but you need to remember that it will sho up on HPI checks so could cause a problem when selling in the future.
tara911 said:
If the car has been deemed a Cat C total loss you have to apply for a VIC...
[url]www.direct.gov.uk/Motoring/BuyingAndSellingAVehicle/AdviceOnBuyingAndSellingAVehicle/AdviceOnBuyingAndSellingArticles/fs/en?CONTENT_ID=4022107&chk=i9R2kk[/url]
and it is noted on on the V5.
Cat D is where the vehicle is unecconomical to repair (the cost of repair is more than the vehicle is worth) normally applied to older vehicles.
It would depend on who has carried out the repairs and the extent of the accident damage as to if I would buy one, but you need to remember that it will sho up on HPI checks so could cause a problem when selling in the future.
[url]www.direct.gov.uk/Motoring/BuyingAndSellingAVehicle/AdviceOnBuyingAndSellingAVehicle/AdviceOnBuyingAndSellingArticles/fs/en?CONTENT_ID=4022107&chk=i9R2kk[/url]
and it is noted on on the V5.
Cat D is where the vehicle is unecconomical to repair (the cost of repair is more than the vehicle is worth) normally applied to older vehicles.
It would depend on who has carried out the repairs and the extent of the accident damage as to if I would buy one, but you need to remember that it will sho up on HPI checks so could cause a problem when selling in the future.
Not strictly true with reference to the "older vehicles" comment.
A contributor here had his car damaged whilst it was in someone elses custody. I'd estimate it was less than 2 years old at the time of the accident and worth circa £90K.
I spoke to the current owner who'd bought the salvage and repaired it at his own bodyshop.
If what he told me was true, the damage amounted to replacement of a front wing, a door, a sill, O/S/F wheel, hub, strut, caliper, disc and wishbone.
He was adamant there had been no damage to the inner wings or chassis/legs or rear quarter panel.
Why would a £90K vehicle be written off and put on the V car register as Cat D when at the most the repairs would have cost £20-25K ?
Any damaged car that is on the V car register has a "stigma" attached to it (IMO)
Any dealer worth their salt would HPI a car prior to purchasing. The vehicle will appear as a Cat D (or whatever level has been applied) and most reputable dealers then won't touch the car with a proverbial canal boat manouvering stick.
The VIC car check appears to be officialdoms way of ensuring the car is not a "ringer" as opposed to ensuring the vehicle has been properly repaired. (But I stand to be corrected)
This is done so that if someone tries to re-register or tax a car that has obviously been written off because it was deemed uneconomical to repair (ie a car gutted by fire), they can inspect it to make the usual checks on VIN plates and chassis/engine numbers to ensure they haven't been tampered with or removed from another vehicle.
Come resale time, advertising the car without making potential purchasers aware a car is Cat D could leave you deeper in the sh*t than a City of London Sewer maintainance engineer.
If you do alert potential purchasers, most will avoid the car like the plague (or want to pay next to nothing for a car that has a "history" that cannot be removed)
Edited by slippydiff on Sunday 3rd December 01:56
Also be careful of cars that have been registered in Northern or Southern Ireland. There is a loophole where written off cars registered in NI/SI that are re-registered in the UK loose their HPI record. Some traders will buy salvage in the UK, register the car in NI/SI and then re-register the car back in the UK...Buyer beware - I recently went to look at a Black GT3 MK11, turned out it was an ex write off but no HPI record!
Many thanks guys and girls.
Think the best bet is to leave well alone.
Reason for the thread is there is a 97 993 C2S (Turbo Bodied) on a CATC or D not sure for 24k with 50K on the clock, which i was goin go to have a look at, probably not worth it in your opinion??
Think the best bet is to leave well alone.
Reason for the thread is there is a 97 993 C2S (Turbo Bodied) on a CATC or D not sure for 24k with 50K on the clock, which i was goin go to have a look at, probably not worth it in your opinion??
Edited by ED965 on Sunday 3rd December 13:23
Edited by ED965 on Sunday 3rd December 13:43
It is true to say that generally a quite light accident can "write off" an old cheap car that isn't badly damaged (bash the front corner lightly on a £500 Fiesta and the cost of a bonnet, wing, headlight and bumper will cost more than it's worth, whereas on a new one it'd just get fixed and no-one would ever know).
However, there are different scenarios where a not too badly damaged late car can be considered "uneconomical to repair". I will illustrate by example: a friend of mine bought a nearly new (under 18 months old IIRC) VX220 for £12000 which only required a suspension droplink (or similar) and repair to the fibreglass rear tub (if that's the right term?) and painting which cost him about £1200 all in to do. He then had a great car for a lot less money than one without the record (the whole point of buying a Cat D in the first place). The insurance company didn't repair it even though the job with a NEW rear tub was about £6000 and the car was worth £16000 (or thereabouts), the reason being they could pay out £16000 to the owner, sell the salvage for £12000 and be £2000 better off than by repairing it. Everyone wins pretty much.
We sold a MK2 GT3 last year that was Cat D but when inspected it had only had a rear wing and bumpers but no major structural damage (easy to see when looking at the floorpan on the ramp that it was straight and original). The buyer (who I think comes on here) bought the car because it was £10,000 cheaper than a non Cat D car. We had it inspected at the local OPC, it passed and he bought the Porsche warranty too.
The point is, take each car on it's own merits. It may or may not have had damage that bad that you wouldn't ever want it afterwards and it may or may not have been repaired to an acceptable standard and this may or may not have been done with new parts (can't really see the harm in say, using a good second hand 2001 996 wing to repair a crashed 1998 car - the part is identical but newer than the damaged one).
DO bear in mind that any warranty is made void by a "total loss" claim (although manufacturers will rarely know or check), you may have difficulty getting it insured and you will not get finance on it.
A further point is that a repaired car can be inspected by Autolign and if it passes, will be re-categorised as "condition inspected" on HPi. Experian, however, do not re-categorise it. The insepction is to determine that the car is in a condition appropriate to it's age and mileage (hence needs to be sound but could have been repaired with used parts etc) including paintwork colour and condition and or course structural soundness. A car that passes should of course be worth more than one that has never been checked, and some finance companies will lend on them.
Hope this helps.
However, there are different scenarios where a not too badly damaged late car can be considered "uneconomical to repair". I will illustrate by example: a friend of mine bought a nearly new (under 18 months old IIRC) VX220 for £12000 which only required a suspension droplink (or similar) and repair to the fibreglass rear tub (if that's the right term?) and painting which cost him about £1200 all in to do. He then had a great car for a lot less money than one without the record (the whole point of buying a Cat D in the first place). The insurance company didn't repair it even though the job with a NEW rear tub was about £6000 and the car was worth £16000 (or thereabouts), the reason being they could pay out £16000 to the owner, sell the salvage for £12000 and be £2000 better off than by repairing it. Everyone wins pretty much.
We sold a MK2 GT3 last year that was Cat D but when inspected it had only had a rear wing and bumpers but no major structural damage (easy to see when looking at the floorpan on the ramp that it was straight and original). The buyer (who I think comes on here) bought the car because it was £10,000 cheaper than a non Cat D car. We had it inspected at the local OPC, it passed and he bought the Porsche warranty too.
The point is, take each car on it's own merits. It may or may not have had damage that bad that you wouldn't ever want it afterwards and it may or may not have been repaired to an acceptable standard and this may or may not have been done with new parts (can't really see the harm in say, using a good second hand 2001 996 wing to repair a crashed 1998 car - the part is identical but newer than the damaged one).
DO bear in mind that any warranty is made void by a "total loss" claim (although manufacturers will rarely know or check), you may have difficulty getting it insured and you will not get finance on it.
A further point is that a repaired car can be inspected by Autolign and if it passes, will be re-categorised as "condition inspected" on HPi. Experian, however, do not re-categorise it. The insepction is to determine that the car is in a condition appropriate to it's age and mileage (hence needs to be sound but could have been repaired with used parts etc) including paintwork colour and condition and or course structural soundness. A car that passes should of course be worth more than one that has never been checked, and some finance companies will lend on them.
Hope this helps.
I bought a Cat C, still damaged BMW Compact for next rally car project off Ebay
I could see the car needed a chassis leg straightening job and a few parts.
I bought the car for half price £700, spent £90 on parts from a scrap yard and i have just come back from the garage where my friend and i have straightened the chassis leg using a portapack and wood, the shut lines are perfect and the car will go back together in less than four hours.
As a professional job it is not economically viable but for a hobbyest its a great way to source a cheap car and i would certainly buy a Cat C or D Porsche if i wanted say a track car or for conversion to a competition car.
However if resale value is a concern then really you have a higher risk purchase because of insurance and limited market for ex CAT C / D
I could see the car needed a chassis leg straightening job and a few parts.
I bought the car for half price £700, spent £90 on parts from a scrap yard and i have just come back from the garage where my friend and i have straightened the chassis leg using a portapack and wood, the shut lines are perfect and the car will go back together in less than four hours.
As a professional job it is not economically viable but for a hobbyest its a great way to source a cheap car and i would certainly buy a Cat C or D Porsche if i wanted say a track car or for conversion to a competition car.
However if resale value is a concern then really you have a higher risk purchase because of insurance and limited market for ex CAT C / D
well i got a C2'S' for sale this was a cat 'c' ....whoever repaired the car they did a cracking job...dead level car....drives bang on....if its been repaired right and the sale prices is sensible.....hey whats the problem........previously damaged cars must command a less premium than a clean straight car...hence mine been £10k'ish' under the price of a straight C2's'.....
have fun guys............
have fun guys............
Do, however, beware of any Cat C or D car that looks too good. It could be that the it's identity has been put onto an undamaged stolen car. A classic case of a ringer. Buy a badly damaged car that would normally be worth £50k for £15k, nick one identical and identify it as the write off, sell it cheap as repaired for say £35k - nice easy profit and no expense or work getting your hands dirty repairing the damaged car.
thegoose said:
Do, however, beware of any Cat C or D car that looks too good. It could be that the it's identity has been put onto an undamaged stolen car. A classic case of a ringer. Buy a badly damaged car that would normally be worth £50k for £15k, nick one identical and identify it as the write off, sell it cheap as repaired for say £35k - nice easy profit and no expense or work getting your hands dirty repairing the damaged car.
whats a 993 widebody worth on a CAT C?
thegoose said:
It depends on the actual car and what was damaged and how well it was repaired. The usual stuff counts too, history, colour(s), aircon etc.
Just looked at your profile - does this car mean anything to you?
Just looked at your profile - does this car mean anything to you?
Bloody hell, yes my old SC, are you the chap that sold it to me, used to sell mobile phones?
I sold the SC for £10.5k to a guy from Huddersfield who users it as everyday transport, it was a great car, i spent a bit of money on it getting the paint work spot on as you do, and surprising won a concourse competition. Not that i was into that sort of thing.
The C2S i believe is in good order VOSA examined etc etc and low mileage 60k. They want 24-25k for it, which seemed a bit high to me, what do you think?
I remember that car failing the MOT on the horn and all it took was a wobble of the relay and it was all sorted. It used to be white IIRC, but the only slight evidence was under the wheelarches. I think the previous owner had paid around £11,000 for it and had it 9 years or so, albeit he had a new leather interior and numerous other things done to it. A good example of a depreciation proof car though! I used to work for, sorry - be employed by, BT, nothing to do with mobiles though. I now have www.autoperform.com which is mine so no proper job anymore......
A VOSA exam is just an MOT so any car that you look at should pass that. Doesn't sound like an absolute bargain. As a general guide, at this sort of price level I would suggest that if it's been repaired pretty well then it should be about £4000-£5000 less than one without the accident history.
A VOSA exam is just an MOT so any car that you look at should pass that. Doesn't sound like an absolute bargain. As a general guide, at this sort of price level I would suggest that if it's been repaired pretty well then it should be about £4000-£5000 less than one without the accident history.
87 3.2 went out to a Scottish PHer 2 weeks ago (have his Caterham now) and a 93 928S4 went out last Thursday. No more due just now, seem to be doing well with BMW 5 series Sports (a great car). Have a Clio V6 255 due next Monday which should be a hoot. Need to keep having cars that I haven't had before/that excite or interest me so I don't get bored (which would be bad for sales too of course).
sambaman said:
well i got a C2'S' for sale this was a cat 'c' ....whoever repaired the car they did a cracking job...dead level car....drives bang on....if its been repaired right and the sale prices is sensible.....hey whats the problem........previously damaged cars must command a less premium than a clean straight car...hence mine been £10k'ish' under the price of a straight C2's'.....
have fun guys............
have fun guys............
Hi sambaman, what was the damage to your C2S?
10Kish under would make 19-20k for a reasonable car then? Good ones are fetching about 29-30k.
have you any pics or history of what happened?
C'ant you get them de-registered or de-catorgorised through i think its called Autoline or something?
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