Discussion
I've being watching 991 prices in the official network over the last few months and they appear to be increasing!
Cars that were sub £60k three months ago have crept up in price. Seems very bizarre for vehicles that obviously aren't selling. How 'controlled' are used OPC prices? I assumed we would see a dip when the first cars reached 3yrs old (MOT, warranty, etc) but it hasn't appeared.
Maybe the gen 2 will knock these prices down though.
Cars that were sub £60k three months ago have crept up in price. Seems very bizarre for vehicles that obviously aren't selling. How 'controlled' are used OPC prices? I assumed we would see a dip when the first cars reached 3yrs old (MOT, warranty, etc) but it hasn't appeared.
Maybe the gen 2 will knock these prices down though.
I've noticed price firming too. If you look at some of the reputable Porsche independents their 997 gen 1 and 2 cars have really risen in price over the last few months, but then you look at their stock levels they hardly have any cars so clearly these machines are selling well with the economy doing well and interest rates still low.
Regardless of this trend you'd expect a step down in price of 991 gen 1 when gen 2 991 comes out and that should have a knock on effect on the 997.2.
Is there a release date for the gen 2 as the gen 1 has been out for 4 years now and there was 3.5-4 year gap between 997 generations so looks due...
Regardless of this trend you'd expect a step down in price of 991 gen 1 when gen 2 991 comes out and that should have a knock on effect on the 997.2.
Is there a release date for the gen 2 as the gen 1 has been out for 4 years now and there was 3.5-4 year gap between 997 generations so looks due...
There is a lot of room between the models and the generations
997 gen 2 C2S - still in the £40's (about the same as they were 3 years ago)
991 C2s - early £60's for the earliest PDK cars
991 Gen 2 C2s - when released and specced - closer to £100k
I can't see a new £100k model effecting the value of 5 year old £45k cars ???
The ones that might suffer at today's near new USED 991 GTSs and 991 Turbos...no longer the latest and greatest (when the gen 2 comes out)
997 gen 2 C2S - still in the £40's (about the same as they were 3 years ago)
991 C2s - early £60's for the earliest PDK cars
991 Gen 2 C2s - when released and specced - closer to £100k
I can't see a new £100k model effecting the value of 5 year old £45k cars ???
The ones that might suffer at today's near new USED 991 GTSs and 991 Turbos...no longer the latest and greatest (when the gen 2 comes out)
I disagree Wilmslowboy, there's always a cascade effect all the way down the chain. If someone who couldn't afford an early 991 and was opting for a 997.2 can suddenly afford the now slightly cheaper early 991, surely softening demand on the 997.2 will lower its price. How dramatic the drop is and when it actually happens remains to be seen as it will take time for a significant number of 991.2s to hit the road following release.
I might be completely wrong but that's how it would work in my head! I'm sure there are plenty on the forums who know more than me...
I might be completely wrong but that's how it would work in my head! I'm sure there are plenty on the forums who know more than me...
Hugo911 said:
With 997 Gen 2 prices staying quite form, I wonder whether a Gen 2 991 will be out soon to push 997 (Gen 1 and 2) prices down further?
Any thoughts?
I dont see how the 991.2 will have any direct effect on 997.1 and 991.2 prices. They will operate in entirely different markets.Any thoughts?
And in any case, theres always a new 911. For 51 years.
997 values are fairly stable at the moment and I see that continuing.
Setting a side the 991 Gen 2 for a moment
The biggest driver of 997 gen 2 prices could be availability of low milage good condition cars (and the willingness for the specialists to buy, stock and sell them).
Early 991 C2s are early £60s (somewhere they have been for a while) as they drop out of their typical 3 year PCP deals and the used mkt no longer is controlled by the OPC....we might see a shift in the specialist from stocking 997.2s to 991(newer, less prep,better car, lower miles, more likely to have FSH etc etc )
Without specialist support we could see the 997.2s return to its natural deprecation curve...
The vast majority of these types of cars are bought on finance (I'm not involved in Porsche but know something of Audi, Mercedes etc) and at this price level, probably close to 70% are financed....
Once the 991 get into the hands of the specialists in volume....the difference to a customer between a 2011 997.2 or 2012 991 could be as little as around £250 a month......
Final thought....in the launch year of 2012, Porsche sold nearly 50% more 991s than they sold 997.2s in 2011....this sacristy of 997.2s could have been the reason for such strong residuals, furthermore the near extra 10k 911 cars coming upto their 3 birthday this year could put pressure on 991s and therefore 997.2... (this 10k number is for the total sales not UK only)
Lots of reasons for values of 997.2s to change...not sure the launch of the 991.2 is a primary one.
The biggest driver of 997 gen 2 prices could be availability of low milage good condition cars (and the willingness for the specialists to buy, stock and sell them).
Early 991 C2s are early £60s (somewhere they have been for a while) as they drop out of their typical 3 year PCP deals and the used mkt no longer is controlled by the OPC....we might see a shift in the specialist from stocking 997.2s to 991(newer, less prep,better car, lower miles, more likely to have FSH etc etc )
Without specialist support we could see the 997.2s return to its natural deprecation curve...
The vast majority of these types of cars are bought on finance (I'm not involved in Porsche but know something of Audi, Mercedes etc) and at this price level, probably close to 70% are financed....
Once the 991 get into the hands of the specialists in volume....the difference to a customer between a 2011 997.2 or 2012 991 could be as little as around £250 a month......
Final thought....in the launch year of 2012, Porsche sold nearly 50% more 991s than they sold 997.2s in 2011....this sacristy of 997.2s could have been the reason for such strong residuals, furthermore the near extra 10k 911 cars coming upto their 3 birthday this year could put pressure on 991s and therefore 997.2... (this 10k number is for the total sales not UK only)
Lots of reasons for values of 997.2s to change...not sure the launch of the 991.2 is a primary one.
Edited by Wilmslowboy on Sunday 19th July 09:01
Trotmant said:
all of these assumptions would be fair if the gen2 wasn't going to feature a turbo. If that remains true its little surprise if the previous gens start increasing
Interesting point, could you explain further. Not sure I fully understand the issue around the Turbo model.Hugo911 said:
Wilmslowboy, I doff my cap to you. Lots of good points in your last post.
Where do you get all these statistics, would be useful to know.
ooops just checked my numbers the sales (911 up by near 50% 2012 versus 2011 i.e 997.2 versus 991) stands however they are for global sales not UK onlyWhere do you get all these statistics, would be useful to know.
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