996 GT3 KW V3 or standard suspension for road use
Discussion
Earlier in the year I bought a 996 GT3 with KW v3 suspension on and the standard set up in the boot.
After 3,000ish of road driving I'm considering if it's worth changing back to the standard shocks, a local speciliest I've been speaking to has suggested with the right geo set up the standard set up is often better for road use than aftermarket kits. The kW kit seams fine on good roads and in the dry but very bumpy on the rubbish roads and unforgiving in bad weather.
Just wondering what other people experience was, I'm unlikely to use it on track much as racing takes up my track budget but may head over to the 'ring occasionally
After 3,000ish of road driving I'm considering if it's worth changing back to the standard shocks, a local speciliest I've been speaking to has suggested with the right geo set up the standard set up is often better for road use than aftermarket kits. The kW kit seams fine on good roads and in the dry but very bumpy on the rubbish roads and unforgiving in bad weather.
Just wondering what other people experience was, I'm unlikely to use it on track much as racing takes up my track budget but may head over to the 'ring occasionally
It's just the same with standard shocks on B roads.
Cars just not made for them.
A geo is a geo and is not going to change any thing regarding that.
ARB do though and I run mine soft now and it stops the wheel movement loads, but then is not as tight on smooth roads.
So swings and round abouts.
It's def a car for long visits to Spa and the like, not taking the back roads to work.
Cars just not made for them.
A geo is a geo and is not going to change any thing regarding that.
ARB do though and I run mine soft now and it stops the wheel movement loads, but then is not as tight on smooth roads.
So swings and round abouts.
It's def a car for long visits to Spa and the like, not taking the back roads to work.
Edited by mrdemon on Thursday 27th September 22:16
mrdemon said:
It's just the same with standard shocks on B roads.
Cars just not made for them.
^^ hold on..Cars just not made for them.
hi Andy,
hope your well & enjoying the car mate...
I really found the standard bilstein/h&r suspension set up on my 996.1 suprisingly supple & all road friendly as a starting point. no harsher than any of my previous sporty rides.. the standard set-ups downfall for me was its performance on track, way to soft (remember 6.1 was softer sprung than the 996.2).. I upgraded to KW (Manthey 2011 spec) clubsport package last season. whilst I am very pleased with the KW's set up on track, it's way too stiff for daily road use for most.. I know of a few mates who have had KW V3's on 996's, all have changed to other set ups as they were neither happy with the ride on road or track.
ade
keep it lit said:
mrdemon said:
It's just the same with standard shocks on B roads.
Cars just not made for them.
^^ hold on..Cars just not made for them.
hi Andy,
hope your well & enjoying the car mate...
I really found the standard bilstein/h&r suspension set up on my 996.1 suprisingly supple & all road friendly as a starting point. no harsher than any of my previous sporty rides.. the standard set-ups downfall for me was its performance on track, way to soft (remember 6.1 was softer sprung than the 996.2).. I upgraded to KW (Manthey 2011 spec) clubsport package last season. whilst I am very pleased with the KW's set up on track, it's way too stiff for daily road use for most.. I know of a few mates who have had KW V3's on 996's, all have changed to other set ups as they were neither happy with the ride on road or track.
ade
Spot on Ade. Exactly this ^
And this should speak volumes too :
http://classifieds.pistonheads.com/classifieds/par...
Added to which, if you're not planning on going on track, raise it up to the maximum specified ride height, it always makes them more compliant (and the extra travel will improve the cars manners too)
I have them on my 996TT and I think it is fair to say it corners as if on rails, but will have your fillings out on some roads. My ride height has been adjusted down and the rear torsion bar tightened one notch. I am considering a new geo with a slightly higher ride height as at the moment my front splitter isn't going to last long as its so close to the ground and my other half would like a slightly less harsh ride
I've got Manthey KWV3 setup and went from race car low to nearly factory height and the road comfort really improved to acceptable ( its no lexus tho )
Obviously the dampers are variable hence the name V3, so the shockers bump and rebound could be further tweaked as well as ride height to get the best road setup for you,so why not use the adjustablity within the system rather than junk it and go back to factory ?
Mike
Obviously the dampers are variable hence the name V3, so the shockers bump and rebound could be further tweaked as well as ride height to get the best road setup for you,so why not use the adjustablity within the system rather than junk it and go back to factory ?
Mike
Bad man ....Andy,
I had the std suspension old my old mk2 6GT3 and that was fine on the road. I’ve got the KWV3 on my current mk2 6GT3 and although brilliant on track I hate doing long trips on it, its v stiff and crashes over everything.
It is so bad a few weeks ago my desire to get laid by driving up to North Yorkshire to see my ex gf was actually overridden by my hatred of long trips in the GT3.
Keep it standard.
I had the std suspension old my old mk2 6GT3 and that was fine on the road. I’ve got the KWV3 on my current mk2 6GT3 and although brilliant on track I hate doing long trips on it, its v stiff and crashes over everything.
It is so bad a few weeks ago my desire to get laid by driving up to North Yorkshire to see my ex gf was actually overridden by my hatred of long trips in the GT3.
Keep it standard.
BrendonJ said:
Andy,
I had the std suspension old my old mk2 6GT3 and that was fine on the road. I’ve got the KWV3 on my current mk2 6GT3 and although brilliant on track I hate doing long trips on it, its v stiff and crashes over everything.
It is so bad a few weeks ago my desire to get laid by driving up to North Yorkshire to see my ex gf was actually overridden by my hatred of long trips in the GT3.
Keep it standard.
+1, If you do mainly road work, I would swap the car to a road car, not a track car... the 6's are bad enough on std struts/springs.., my 7GT3 was awesome, loved it, however I couldn't go anywhere in it, in case the roads were too bad, it gradually pisses you off and drives you nuts, and don't get me started on squeeks and rattles... the car ended up making the decisions about where I went in it, not me.. so it's gone now..I had the std suspension old my old mk2 6GT3 and that was fine on the road. I’ve got the KWV3 on my current mk2 6GT3 and although brilliant on track I hate doing long trips on it, its v stiff and crashes over everything.
It is so bad a few weeks ago my desire to get laid by driving up to North Yorkshire to see my ex gf was actually overridden by my hatred of long trips in the GT3.
Keep it standard.
Just set your dampers and roll bars to full soft, and try it, if that's too hard, you need to get a softer sprung car like a 4S... !
Andy,
That is my old car - I sold it to Alan Drayson as part ex against a 1970 911s. I can definitely tell you that the ride is better on standard springs and dampers, but the set in your boot need rebuilding as a couple have small leaks (£100 a corner by Bilstein. The geo is Chris Franklin and very mild / road friendly - in fact bog standard Porsche from memory. All GT3s are a pain on bumpy roads.
You can soften the dampers off but I left them as KW suggest.
It is a lovely car.
Cheers
Mark
That is my old car - I sold it to Alan Drayson as part ex against a 1970 911s. I can definitely tell you that the ride is better on standard springs and dampers, but the set in your boot need rebuilding as a couple have small leaks (£100 a corner by Bilstein. The geo is Chris Franklin and very mild / road friendly - in fact bog standard Porsche from memory. All GT3s are a pain on bumpy roads.
You can soften the dampers off but I left them as KW suggest.
It is a lovely car.
Cheers
Mark
andye30m3 said:
Earlier in the year I bought a 996 GT3 with KW v3 suspension on and the standard set up in the boot.
After 3,000ish of road driving I'm considering if it's worth changing back to the standard shocks, a local speciliest I've been speaking to has suggested with the right geo set up the standard set up is often better for road use than aftermarket kits. The kW kit seams fine on good roads and in the dry but very bumpy on the rubbish roads and unforgiving in bad weather.
Just wondering what other people experience was, I'm unlikely to use it on track much as racing takes up my track budget but may head over to the 'ring occasionally
I put PSS9's on my GT2 for road use and they are very, very good. The car rides nicely even with the adgusters towards maximum bump / rebound. they are significantly better than standard, KW would be too firm for me for the road. Make sure you keep a supple front spring rate..After 3,000ish of road driving I'm considering if it's worth changing back to the standard shocks, a local speciliest I've been speaking to has suggested with the right geo set up the standard set up is often better for road use than aftermarket kits. The kW kit seams fine on good roads and in the dry but very bumpy on the rubbish roads and unforgiving in bad weather.
Just wondering what other people experience was, I'm unlikely to use it on track much as racing takes up my track budget but may head over to the 'ring occasionally
Cheers for all the replies
Still loving the car, just wanted to make sure I'm getting the best out of it, having started this post last night I drove it home from a friends early this morning and it felt awesome on the A-roads.
It's due a service shortly which I'll probably use Paragon for, Might get them to look at raising it and softening it slightly and see how I get on.
Still loving the car, just wanted to make sure I'm getting the best out of it, having started this post last night I drove it home from a friends early this morning and it felt awesome on the A-roads.
It's due a service shortly which I'll probably use Paragon for, Might get them to look at raising it and softening it slightly and see how I get on.
I have been through this loop myself.
When I was looking to buy a 996 GT3 I drove several on various different sets of shock/springs, this included Mk1&2.
I nearly bought a Mk1 on KWs as I thought GT3s were supposed to be overly firm and then I had one of those divine revelation moments,
I drove a Mk1 on new standard shocks and springs. The difference was very noticeable. Where the KWs would be firm/crashy and loosen teeth at speed on B roads, the stock setup made the car very compliant with only the very worst bumps upsetting the feel.
I eventually purchased a MK1 996 which had original 50K miles shocks and springs. At this mileage the springs had sagged by about 25mm when loaded and the shocks seemed to have lost their rebound damping making the drive very bumpy and uncomfortable. Its my observation that 996 GT3s tend to sink and become very crashy once the original shocks reach around 30K miles. It seems after market units are ideal for track use but lack compliance and compromise use on average UK B roads.
I replaced the springs with new stock H&Rs and had the original bilstiens re-bushed and re-valved. I set the ride height 10mm above stock and had the geo returned to factory. The difference was amazing - a firm but compliant ride able to iron out all but the worst of surfaces. I would say that it is similar to a standard 996 on an M030 setup in terms of comfort but obviously much more precise due to the better engineering. I have not used it on track so I cant say if the stock setup is too soft, but I guess it will have its limits (probably way beyond my driving skills!). Another thing I found is that the steering feel can be dramatically improved by putting about 20 kilos in the bottom of the frunk. I now carry a spare tyre and extensive toolkit as ballast
When I was looking to buy a 996 GT3 I drove several on various different sets of shock/springs, this included Mk1&2.
I nearly bought a Mk1 on KWs as I thought GT3s were supposed to be overly firm and then I had one of those divine revelation moments,
I drove a Mk1 on new standard shocks and springs. The difference was very noticeable. Where the KWs would be firm/crashy and loosen teeth at speed on B roads, the stock setup made the car very compliant with only the very worst bumps upsetting the feel.I eventually purchased a MK1 996 which had original 50K miles shocks and springs. At this mileage the springs had sagged by about 25mm when loaded and the shocks seemed to have lost their rebound damping making the drive very bumpy and uncomfortable. Its my observation that 996 GT3s tend to sink and become very crashy once the original shocks reach around 30K miles. It seems after market units are ideal for track use but lack compliance and compromise use on average UK B roads.
I replaced the springs with new stock H&Rs and had the original bilstiens re-bushed and re-valved. I set the ride height 10mm above stock and had the geo returned to factory. The difference was amazing - a firm but compliant ride able to iron out all but the worst of surfaces. I would say that it is similar to a standard 996 on an M030 setup in terms of comfort but obviously much more precise due to the better engineering. I have not used it on track so I cant say if the stock setup is too soft, but I guess it will have its limits (probably way beyond my driving skills!). Another thing I found is that the steering feel can be dramatically improved by putting about 20 kilos in the bottom of the frunk. I now carry a spare tyre and extensive toolkit as ballast
andye30m3 said:
Cheers for all the replies
Still loving the car, just wanted to make sure I'm getting the best out of it, having started this post last night I drove it home from a friends early this morning and it felt awesome on the A-roads.
It's due a service shortly which I'll probably use Paragon for, Might get them to look at raising it and softening it slightly and see how I get on.
Andy, before I sold it I planned the same for a trip to Europe - soften ARBs, raise ride height a tad and adjust dampers. Worth trying before switching back to OE.Still loving the car, just wanted to make sure I'm getting the best out of it, having started this post last night I drove it home from a friends early this morning and it felt awesome on the A-roads.
It's due a service shortly which I'll probably use Paragon for, Might get them to look at raising it and softening it slightly and see how I get on.
Cheers
Mark
PS please check positive terminal on battery, the clasp was cross threaded and needed replacing as was loose.
Pugley said:
I have been through this loop myself.
When I was looking to buy a 996 GT3 I drove several on various different sets of shock/springs, this included Mk1&2.
I nearly bought a Mk1 on KWs as I thought GT3s were supposed to be overly firm and then I had one of those divine revelation moments, I drove a Mk1 on new standard shocks and springs. The difference was very noticeable. Where the KWs would be firm/crashy and loosen teeth at speed on B roads, the stock setup made the car very compliant with only the very worst bumps upsetting the feel.
I eventually purchased a MK1 996 which had original 50K miles shocks and springs. At this mileage the springs had sagged by about 25mm when loaded and the shocks seemed to have lost their rebound damping making the drive very bumpy and uncomfortable. Its my observation that 996 GT3s tend to sink and become very crashy once the original shocks reach around 30K miles. It seems after market units are ideal for track use but lack compliance and compromise use on average UK B roads.
I replaced the springs with new stock H&Rs and had the original bilstiens re-bushed and re-valved. I set the ride height 10mm above stock and had the geo returned to factory. The difference was amazing - a firm but compliant ride able to iron out all but the worst of surfaces. I would say that it is similar to a standard 996 on an M030 setup in terms of comfort but obviously much more precise due to the better engineering. I have not used it on track so I cant say if the stock setup is too soft, but I guess it will have its limits (probably way beyond my driving skills!). Another thing I found is that the steering feel can be dramatically improved by putting about 20 kilos in the bottom of the frunk. I now carry a spare tyre and extensive toolkit as ballast
Perfectly put sir (and mirrors my own findings precisely)When I was looking to buy a 996 GT3 I drove several on various different sets of shock/springs, this included Mk1&2.
I nearly bought a Mk1 on KWs as I thought GT3s were supposed to be overly firm and then I had one of those divine revelation moments,
I drove a Mk1 on new standard shocks and springs. The difference was very noticeable. Where the KWs would be firm/crashy and loosen teeth at speed on B roads, the stock setup made the car very compliant with only the very worst bumps upsetting the feel.I eventually purchased a MK1 996 which had original 50K miles shocks and springs. At this mileage the springs had sagged by about 25mm when loaded and the shocks seemed to have lost their rebound damping making the drive very bumpy and uncomfortable. Its my observation that 996 GT3s tend to sink and become very crashy once the original shocks reach around 30K miles. It seems after market units are ideal for track use but lack compliance and compromise use on average UK B roads.
I replaced the springs with new stock H&Rs and had the original bilstiens re-bushed and re-valved. I set the ride height 10mm above stock and had the geo returned to factory. The difference was amazing - a firm but compliant ride able to iron out all but the worst of surfaces. I would say that it is similar to a standard 996 on an M030 setup in terms of comfort but obviously much more precise due to the better engineering. I have not used it on track so I cant say if the stock setup is too soft, but I guess it will have its limits (probably way beyond my driving skills!). Another thing I found is that the steering feel can be dramatically improved by putting about 20 kilos in the bottom of the frunk. I now carry a spare tyre and extensive toolkit as ballast
That being the original Mk1 factory spring and damper rates are perfectly judged. (for road use)
Gassing Station | Porsche General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff