Ford S-Max 240ps
Discussion
Long story short, turns out that our expected second child is actually two kids and so we are going to have in the near future three children all requiring car seats.
Here in New Zealand, choices for 'family friendly' vehicles are a bit limited (this is based on my regularly travelling to the UK to see family and there seem to be many more MPV-type vehicles on the road). We have an Outback at the moment, and it would be perfect for two children but three is a bit much.
We do have a lot of JDM people movers due to our lax import laws e.g. old Toyota Alphards, Estimas etc BUT they are often older models with poor safety features and tech ... and my wife really doesn't like the idea of driving one. I personally think they are quite cool but to her the thought of taking the clan out in a mid 2000s Toyota Alphard 'Royal Lounge' is the idea of social suicide.
Doing research online, a number of people seem to call out the Ford S-Max as being a good family-friendly vehicle that is more car-like. It certainly ticks the boxes for us, with plenty of space and most importantly independent seats all of which are well-suited to taking child seats (plus optional pop-up seats in the rear). I've showed my wife and she likes the look of it.
The only problem?
The S-Max is as rare as hen's teeth in NZ.
However, trawling the motoring classified sites here somebody down the road from me has an imported one for sale (I believe imported originally from Australia).
It's a 2013 with the 2 litre 240hp engine and Powershift transmission.
The owner's wife used it to run an in-home daycare business for a few years, and she has now stopped that so they want to sell it. He has supplied me a number of receipts (it sounds like it has had some problems e.g. fuel pump failure, and then a replacement 'thrust washer' on the gearbox). All of the work has been done at reputable garages I've used myself, and the owner seems very happy to disclose what issues have been repaired in the past which is always nice.
My question is what should I be looking out for if considering one of these vehicles? E.g. I've heard Powershift transmissions are bad, but then some say it was a different type of Powershift more common on the low power Fiestas and Focuses that was the problem.
Any known issues to really look out for? This could be the perfect family car for us for reasonable money, but obviously I want to avoid buying a total dog.
We only need an MPV-style vehicle to last the next couple of years until our eldest can travel in the back of a 3 row SUV e.g. Toyota Highlander or Mazda CX-9. I'm loathe to drop big $$$ on a current shape Kia Carnival or Honda Odyssey if I can get something like an S-Max that will 'bridge the gap' for 2-3 years in reasonable reliability and safety.
Here in New Zealand, choices for 'family friendly' vehicles are a bit limited (this is based on my regularly travelling to the UK to see family and there seem to be many more MPV-type vehicles on the road). We have an Outback at the moment, and it would be perfect for two children but three is a bit much.
We do have a lot of JDM people movers due to our lax import laws e.g. old Toyota Alphards, Estimas etc BUT they are often older models with poor safety features and tech ... and my wife really doesn't like the idea of driving one. I personally think they are quite cool but to her the thought of taking the clan out in a mid 2000s Toyota Alphard 'Royal Lounge' is the idea of social suicide.
Doing research online, a number of people seem to call out the Ford S-Max as being a good family-friendly vehicle that is more car-like. It certainly ticks the boxes for us, with plenty of space and most importantly independent seats all of which are well-suited to taking child seats (plus optional pop-up seats in the rear). I've showed my wife and she likes the look of it.
The only problem?
The S-Max is as rare as hen's teeth in NZ.
However, trawling the motoring classified sites here somebody down the road from me has an imported one for sale (I believe imported originally from Australia).
It's a 2013 with the 2 litre 240hp engine and Powershift transmission.
The owner's wife used it to run an in-home daycare business for a few years, and she has now stopped that so they want to sell it. He has supplied me a number of receipts (it sounds like it has had some problems e.g. fuel pump failure, and then a replacement 'thrust washer' on the gearbox). All of the work has been done at reputable garages I've used myself, and the owner seems very happy to disclose what issues have been repaired in the past which is always nice.
My question is what should I be looking out for if considering one of these vehicles? E.g. I've heard Powershift transmissions are bad, but then some say it was a different type of Powershift more common on the low power Fiestas and Focuses that was the problem.
Any known issues to really look out for? This could be the perfect family car for us for reasonable money, but obviously I want to avoid buying a total dog.
We only need an MPV-style vehicle to last the next couple of years until our eldest can travel in the back of a 3 row SUV e.g. Toyota Highlander or Mazda CX-9. I'm loathe to drop big $$$ on a current shape Kia Carnival or Honda Odyssey if I can get something like an S-Max that will 'bridge the gap' for 2-3 years in reasonable reliability and safety.
Edited by samjaynz on Tuesday 8th April 09:11
So I bought the S-Max in the end. Probably not my wisest purchase (considering these vehicles were never officially sold in NZ) but I really liked how it drove, there was decent service history from the one NZ owner, and the seating arrangements are amazingly practical. It's just so amazingly spacious.
Been driving it for about a week now, and actually haven't used my i30N much (wife is still driving her Outback until the twins arrive). In fact I much prefer it to the i30N for around town driving, vastly more comfortable and practical.
The only issue I've picked up on so far is that it is terrible at spinning the wheels off the line in first gear, at least if the road is damp.
I suppose I'm used to the i30N which is a lot more sophisticated in terms of traction control etc, or the Outback which is both fairly gutless and AWD and basically can't spin the wheels. The S-Max is on Toyo Proxes tyres with good tread ... are these cars just really prone to wheelspin off the line if the road is damp? Anything (apart from gentle throttle input) I can do to minimise this? My wife is a bit of a shocker at just flooring it to pull out of intersections or roundabouts.
Main Ford dealer doesn't want to know in terms of servicing it, but I can buy parts cheap enough from UK and my local independent is happy to fit them (or use cross-comparable parts from Ford vehicles sold in NZ).
Got it booked in for a service this morning, and then a transmissions service later in the week.
Been driving it for about a week now, and actually haven't used my i30N much (wife is still driving her Outback until the twins arrive). In fact I much prefer it to the i30N for around town driving, vastly more comfortable and practical.
The only issue I've picked up on so far is that it is terrible at spinning the wheels off the line in first gear, at least if the road is damp.
I suppose I'm used to the i30N which is a lot more sophisticated in terms of traction control etc, or the Outback which is both fairly gutless and AWD and basically can't spin the wheels. The S-Max is on Toyo Proxes tyres with good tread ... are these cars just really prone to wheelspin off the line if the road is damp? Anything (apart from gentle throttle input) I can do to minimise this? My wife is a bit of a shocker at just flooring it to pull out of intersections or roundabouts.
Main Ford dealer doesn't want to know in terms of servicing it, but I can buy parts cheap enough from UK and my local independent is happy to fit them (or use cross-comparable parts from Ford vehicles sold in NZ).
Got it booked in for a service this morning, and then a transmissions service later in the week.
sherman said:
Ford Forums recommend Goodyear Eagle F1 Asym 5 or 6 for the Focus ST which has similar power so I assume will work for the Smax too.
Ok helpful to know. it really does feel like there's a bit too much power right off the line in first gear (at least for the tires currently fitted). We actually have the exact same tires on the Outback and they are totally fine for that, but very different power output, CVT gearbox as opposed to DCT, and also has that intractable AWD.
It's going for a wheel alignment tomorrow so will ask the tyre shop.
I'm impressed by the handling of it when I took it on some country backroads. Drives miles better than any Japanese MPV I could have bought for the same money. Bizarre Ford never sold these here as we have loads of Mondeos, Focuses, Fiestas etc on the road.
Heaveho said:
As suggested, everything I've tried them on drives better with Goodyear Asymmetrics fitted, form my 2018 Ford Connect work van, my wife's Lexus IS300, my Boxster S and my Mitsubishi Evo. My go to tyre on anything I can fit them to, and I'm never disappointed. Great wet weather tyre.
Ok thanks, will look at these - definitely have seem them for sale in NZ before.Car went in for a service last week, and all checked out ok except that the long-life spark plugs are due for replacement so going to buy some in from the UK (as it's about 1/4 price per plug versus what they go for here) and have them fitted unless it's an easy DIY job on the 2.0 ecoboost motor?
I then had the car in at the transmission specialist for a gearbox service. About an hour later I got a call from the manager saying "come back and pick up your car and we will chat" (very ominous of course). Turns out there is a very minor leak from the gearbox, which he said I never would have picked up on when inspecting the car (neither the regular mechanic who serviced the car the day before, nor the wheel alignment shop picked up on it either).
However, turns out this very transmission shop had worked on the car about 18 months ago to fix the leak, but the fix must have failed. They've offered - despite me being a different owner - to completely redo the work at their cost out of goodwill, apart from me paying them the agreed regular service fee.
He said I can keep driving the car 'as is' - and could probably drive it for the next year or so with no worries - but doesn't want to do the service until the leak is fixed but they just need to book in the time to do it. The shop seemed well-versed in the Powershift gearbox albeit in other vehicles sold in NZ such as the Mondeo and had just that morning completed a full rebuild on one, so I'm hoping if they thought it was some terminal issue (and I've done my dough on the purchase price) they would have told me there and then.
Fingers crossed it all works out ok, as I'm genuinely enjoying the S-Max as a daily driver and I can't get over how good the rear seating arrangements are. In fact I'm finding the i30N is sitting forlorn in the garage as the S-Max is so much nicer as an around-town car. Great visibility, easy to park, plenty of get up and go from low RPM (wheelspin in wet aside). I wish Ford had sold these here!
Edited by samjaynz on Monday 28th April 00:53
Spark plugs are easy enough to do.
They are just hiding under the plastic engine cover.
I had to move a pipe from the air box out of the way of plug 4 on my Focus but that was just a couple of jubillee clips so wdnt back easily.
The plugs are quite deep so you will need an extended socket to get to them.
Wont take you much more than an hour to do.
They are just hiding under the plastic engine cover.
I had to move a pipe from the air box out of the way of plug 4 on my Focus but that was just a couple of jubillee clips so wdnt back easily.
The plugs are quite deep so you will need an extended socket to get to them.
Wont take you much more than an hour to do.
sherman said:
Spark plugs are easy enough to do.
They are just hiding under the plastic engine cover.
I had to move a pipe from the air box out of the way of plug 4 on my Focus but that was just a couple of jubillee clips so wdnt back easily.
The plugs are quite deep so you will need an extended socket to get to them.
Wont take you much more than an hour to do.
Ok good to know. My dad lives just down the road and has every automotive tool known to man (plus is much handier than I am) so will be able to assist.They are just hiding under the plastic engine cover.
I had to move a pipe from the air box out of the way of plug 4 on my Focus but that was just a couple of jubillee clips so wdnt back easily.
The plugs are quite deep so you will need an extended socket to get to them.
Wont take you much more than an hour to do.
Anybody with knowledge on these cars - or Fords of this era - have any other advice on things to really stay on top of maintenance wise? Although the car just needs to do its duty for the next ~18 months (until the twins are out of 'capsule' car seats that click in and out of the pram and into regular car seats and our toddler is in a booster ... then we can have any full sized car) I like this Ford S-Max so much I want it to last.
The purchase price outlay was less than the first key turn's depreciation on something like a late model used Kia Carnival ... if I can get 3, 4, 5 years out of the Ford it will be owed an eternal debt of gratitude.
Edited by samjaynz on Monday 28th April 01:15
samjaynz said:
Anybody with knowledge on these cars - or Fords of this era - have any other advice on things to really stay on top of maintenance wise?
I don't have knowledge of these cars, but my impression is that Fords can be a bit variable on rustproofing, so I'd have the underside looked at and consider having it rustproofed if it wasn't looking too good or the standard rustproofing didn't look great. Do they salt the roads in winter in NZ?trevalvole said:
I don't have knowledge of these cars, but my impression is that Fords can be a bit variable on rustproofing, so I'd have the underside looked at and consider having it rustproofed if it wasn't looking too good or the standard rustproofing didn't look great. Do they salt the roads in winter in NZ?
Thanks for the insight. We don't salt the roads in NZ in winter (well definitely not where I live ... last time it snowed on the road Osama Bin Laden was still FBI's most wanted) as it generally doesn't snow enough in all but the lower south island, and even that isn't hugely common. Having owned about a dozen cars in the past decade I've not seen any meaningful rust on any of them.I definitely haven't noticed any rust issues so far but will take a closer look to confirm.
Thought I'd give a little update on the S-Max - for anybody who might be interested in the goings-on of an old Ford that was never sold in New Zealand, and which has somehow found its way onto our roads.
I've had the car for about a month now, and so far so good.
I've had the engine service done, wheel alignment, and then a transmission service. The transmission service was interesting, as it turns out the previous owner (unbeknownst to me) had a minor leak from the front cover on the transmission. He had taken it to the gearbox specialist I use for all my cars, and they fixed it. The fix had failed within about 12 months (very minor leak) so despite the ownership of the vehicle having changed, this specialist agreed they would re-do the repair at their cost and only charge me for a fresh service. I think that's rather good of them.
So all that I need to do service-wise now is have the spark plugs done, and I'll change out the air filter at the same time as have no record of this being done.
Then I need to turn my attention to:
I've had the car for about a month now, and so far so good.
I've had the engine service done, wheel alignment, and then a transmission service. The transmission service was interesting, as it turns out the previous owner (unbeknownst to me) had a minor leak from the front cover on the transmission. He had taken it to the gearbox specialist I use for all my cars, and they fixed it. The fix had failed within about 12 months (very minor leak) so despite the ownership of the vehicle having changed, this specialist agreed they would re-do the repair at their cost and only charge me for a fresh service. I think that's rather good of them.
So all that I need to do service-wise now is have the spark plugs done, and I'll change out the air filter at the same time as have no record of this being done.
Then I need to turn my attention to:
- Finding some replacement wheel nut covers (about 50% are missing)
- Fixing a crack in the front lip (somebody backed into the car in a carpark and never left a note)
- Sourcing a reverse camera and headunit combo that will let me connect to Carplay, Android Auto etc
Another update, and still enjoying the car. Just this morning used it with the seats flat and it swallowed an entire, assembled large child's cot and another couple of bits of kid's furniture (the seller couldn't quite believe it when I pulled up at their place).
However, I have encountered one issue - if anybody is reading and knows of a potential fix, I'd appreciate your input.
Over the last few days the passenger (front left) door lock has become intermittent. If I lock the car using the key fob, all doors lock. When I press unlock, perhaps 80% of the time the passenger door won't unlock. The internal lock/unlock "button" (above the pull handle) moves about 50% as far as it should compared to the other doors in the car. Sometimes it works fine and there is seemingly no rhyme or reason to whether it's going to work or not.
If inside the car and I open the handle it unlocks the car fine.
Any ideas what this could be? Maybe some kind of actuator failure or something like that? It's like the actuator/motor doesn't have the strength any more to actually unlock the door.
However, I have encountered one issue - if anybody is reading and knows of a potential fix, I'd appreciate your input.
Over the last few days the passenger (front left) door lock has become intermittent. If I lock the car using the key fob, all doors lock. When I press unlock, perhaps 80% of the time the passenger door won't unlock. The internal lock/unlock "button" (above the pull handle) moves about 50% as far as it should compared to the other doors in the car. Sometimes it works fine and there is seemingly no rhyme or reason to whether it's going to work or not.
If inside the car and I open the handle it unlocks the car fine.
Any ideas what this could be? Maybe some kind of actuator failure or something like that? It's like the actuator/motor doesn't have the strength any more to actually unlock the door.
As this has turned into a Readers' Car thread, you'll probably get a bigger audience for it (and more responses) if you reported your own thread and asked the mods to move it to https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/forum.asp?h=0&... - perhaps getting them to delete the second part of the title too.
samjaynz said:
Another update, and still enjoying the car. Just this morning used it with the seats flat and it swallowed an entire, assembled large child's cot and another couple of bits of kid's furniture (the seller couldn't quite believe it when I pulled up at their place).
However, I have encountered one issue - if anybody is reading and knows of a potential fix, I'd appreciate your input.
Over the last few days the passenger (front left) door lock has become intermittent. If I lock the car using the key fob, all doors lock. When I press unlock, perhaps 80% of the time the passenger door won't unlock. The internal lock/unlock "button" (above the pull handle) moves about 50% as far as it should compared to the other doors in the car. Sometimes it works fine and there is seemingly no rhyme or reason to whether it's going to work or not.
If inside the car and I open the handle it unlocks the car fine.
Any ideas what this could be? Maybe some kind of actuator failure or something like that? It's like the actuator/motor doesn't have the strength any more to actually unlock the door.
The door lock modules become lazy, you can change the motors in them if you're that way inclined or complete new units can be had for £30 on AliExpress.However, I have encountered one issue - if anybody is reading and knows of a potential fix, I'd appreciate your input.
Over the last few days the passenger (front left) door lock has become intermittent. If I lock the car using the key fob, all doors lock. When I press unlock, perhaps 80% of the time the passenger door won't unlock. The internal lock/unlock "button" (above the pull handle) moves about 50% as far as it should compared to the other doors in the car. Sometimes it works fine and there is seemingly no rhyme or reason to whether it's going to work or not.
If inside the car and I open the handle it unlocks the car fine.
Any ideas what this could be? Maybe some kind of actuator failure or something like that? It's like the actuator/motor doesn't have the strength any more to actually unlock the door.
trevalvole said:
As this has turned into a Readers' Car thread, you'll probably get a bigger audience for it (and more responses) if you reported your own thread and asked the mods to move it to https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/forum.asp?h=0&... - perhaps getting them to delete the second part of the title too.
Ok good to know, thanks. Sorry for "$hitting up" the board, so to speak ... I'll definitely keep posting updates so will ask for it to be moved. finlo said:
The door lock modules become lazy, you can change the motors in them if you're that way inclined or complete new units can be had for £30 on AliExpress.
Ok great to know, thanks. As these vehicles aren't really supported in NZ (as Ford never sold them here) some parts can be tricky to find, but hopefully it is shared with Fords that were sold here e.g. Mondeo or otherwise I'll look at Aliexpress. samjaynz said:
finlo said:
The door lock modules become lazy, you can change the motors in them if you're that way inclined or complete new units can be had for £30 on AliExpress.
Ok great to know, thanks. As these vehicles aren't really supported in NZ (as Ford never sold them here) some parts can be tricky to find, but hopefully it is shared with Fords that were sold here e.g. Mondeo or otherwise I'll look at Aliexpress. Glad you're enjoying it. I had several S-Maxes and they would be my first choice again if I needed that kind of 2nd row flexibility and general TARDIS like quality. And if the roads around you are as twisty as the ones I've driven in my time in NZ, then the great handling/ride balance and the natural steering feel are just the icing on the cake.
The spinning the front wheels at junctions in the wet thing is unfortunately somewhat inherent in vehicles like this. Fair amount of power delivered to the front wheels, under a short nose out in front of a heavy tall vehicle. Our VW touran was the same. Slightly bipolar gearbox behaviour just makes it worse. The only thing that helped me was manually controlling gears in those situations. HTH.
The spinning the front wheels at junctions in the wet thing is unfortunately somewhat inherent in vehicles like this. Fair amount of power delivered to the front wheels, under a short nose out in front of a heavy tall vehicle. Our VW touran was the same. Slightly bipolar gearbox behaviour just makes it worse. The only thing that helped me was manually controlling gears in those situations. HTH.
occasionalranter said:
Glad you're enjoying it. I had several S-Maxes and they would be my first choice again if I needed that kind of 2nd row flexibility and general TARDIS like quality. And if the roads around you are as twisty as the ones I've driven in my time in NZ, then the great handling/ride balance and the natural steering feel are just the icing on the cake.
The spinning the front wheels at junctions in the wet thing is unfortunately somewhat inherent in vehicles like this. Fair amount of power delivered to the front wheels, under a short nose out in front of a heavy tall vehicle. Our VW touran was the same. Slightly bipolar gearbox behaviour just makes it worse. The only thing that helped me was manually controlling gears in those situations. HTH.
Yeah it's a great drive on the roads around here. Handling and steering feel is miles ahead of our Outback, and you can really hustle it particularly once up to speed. And then you can arrive and load up a stupid amount of stuff and/or kids in car seats. Had 7 adults in it the other day out to a function and took them with comfort and without struggle.The spinning the front wheels at junctions in the wet thing is unfortunately somewhat inherent in vehicles like this. Fair amount of power delivered to the front wheels, under a short nose out in front of a heavy tall vehicle. Our VW touran was the same. Slightly bipolar gearbox behaviour just makes it worse. The only thing that helped me was manually controlling gears in those situations. HTH.
Interesting to know about the wheelspin. I do wonder if the average tyres (that haven't been replaced in some years since import) don't help, but I see your point. I've got used to it now, just need to train my wife that you can't floor it at the lights in the damp like she does in the Outback or i30N.
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