Noble M12 GTO-3R
Discussion
Hi everyone - a couple of people persuaded me that I should do a “Readers’ cars” thread, so here goes!
I was on the hunt for something reasonably fast and dynamic that I could use on road and track, and above all was fun, challenging and rewarding to drive, preferably something a bit different. Having owned a few reasonably fast cars, I knew what I wasn’t looking for:
• My big-engined super-saloons/estates I currently own (E63 AMG @ >700bhp, Mercedes S600 V12 BiTurbo, Jaguar XJ Super V8) are great cars in their own right; powerful, ridiculous and great fun, but they’re obviously not dynamic in the corners.
• The 500bhp+ Audis I’ve owned were very capable, but lack the driver engagement, particularly in the steering. The slight exception was my gen 1 R8 V10 Spyder - I loved this car, mainly as the engine was epic, but maybe just a bit too “safe”!
• Although I owned an E92 M3, which was decent enough, it wasn’t fast enough and I’m not really a fan of the faster more modern M cars (great cars, maybe just a taste thing!).
• Porsche’s don’t do it for me, although I appreciate them – again, [my bad] taste.
• My GBS Zero is possibly the most fun car I’ve owned, but is obviously limited in its use due to lack of doors and roof, and isn’t quite fast enough for what I wanted.
So, there didn’t seem to be all that many options within my budget that ticked the boxes for me. I very nearly bought a McLaren, but in the end decided it was just too much of a stretch for my budget. I ended up whittling it down to a Lotus Exige (ideally with Komo-Tec EX430 or EX460 upgrade), or a Noble M12 GTO-3/3R (ideally with the normal mods for reliability and around 400bhp). These are both fairly (and similarly) quick and have an exceptional reputation for driver engagement and enjoyment. After a lot of research and consideration, I decided on the Noble, mostly due to its rarity and the fact it felt more dramatic, more of an event, to use.
My preference was for an M12 GTO-3R, only for the aesthetics of the faired-in headlights, but this wasn’t a deal-breaker. I went to see and drive a GTO3 at a dealer - it was decent and in my preferred colour (Azure Blue), with most of the desirable mods. However, shifting into 5th and 6th was not right, and I suspect the shift forks may have needed changing. Shortly afterwards, a lovely GTO-3R came up with an incredible amount of mods, fastidiously maintained, running just under 430bhp, in Lotus silver. I usually buy my cars on the owner, and having already spoken with this owner at length, I knew this one could be the one. I went to see it – superbly modified and maintained, and the test drive was eye opening! – and shortly afterwards I had it bought.
I’ve been the proud owner of my M12 GTO-3R for a few months now and absolutely love it. It’s everything I hoped it would be – fast, exciting, involving, rewarding and an event to drive. I’ve done a few local car shows and the first track day is coming up soon, as I feel I’ve got to know it better now.
It sits with my GBS Zero in my physical garage and alongside the following in the metaphorical garage, though this is constantly changing!
Mercedes E63 AMG (S212, 735bhp)
GBS Zero (modified Zetec Blacktop)
Jaguar XJ Super V8 (X350, supercharged)
Mercedes S600 (W220, V12 BiTurbo)
Audi A6 3.0 BiTdi (C7, 400bhp+)
Land Rover Defender Wolf 100 soft-top (ex-military)
Land Rover Series II 88” (1959)
Land Rover Series III 109” (ex-military)
LDV Maxus (kind of a day van!)
I’ll do some (less wordy!) posts soon on what it’s like to drive, all the mods it has, the first few problems I’ve encountered, track days, etc. if people are interested.
I also have a video review of my Noble on my YouTube channel (@Rich_Runs_Cars) here (it’s very amateur, so please only visit if you’re OK with that :-)):
https://youtu.be/olH4_qvYzYw
Also with videos of most of the other cars above, and I’ll post video updates on the Noble there too.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCC2bF2rTdpGIdaq0K...
Cheers.
I was on the hunt for something reasonably fast and dynamic that I could use on road and track, and above all was fun, challenging and rewarding to drive, preferably something a bit different. Having owned a few reasonably fast cars, I knew what I wasn’t looking for:
• My big-engined super-saloons/estates I currently own (E63 AMG @ >700bhp, Mercedes S600 V12 BiTurbo, Jaguar XJ Super V8) are great cars in their own right; powerful, ridiculous and great fun, but they’re obviously not dynamic in the corners.
• The 500bhp+ Audis I’ve owned were very capable, but lack the driver engagement, particularly in the steering. The slight exception was my gen 1 R8 V10 Spyder - I loved this car, mainly as the engine was epic, but maybe just a bit too “safe”!
• Although I owned an E92 M3, which was decent enough, it wasn’t fast enough and I’m not really a fan of the faster more modern M cars (great cars, maybe just a taste thing!).
• Porsche’s don’t do it for me, although I appreciate them – again, [my bad] taste.
• My GBS Zero is possibly the most fun car I’ve owned, but is obviously limited in its use due to lack of doors and roof, and isn’t quite fast enough for what I wanted.
So, there didn’t seem to be all that many options within my budget that ticked the boxes for me. I very nearly bought a McLaren, but in the end decided it was just too much of a stretch for my budget. I ended up whittling it down to a Lotus Exige (ideally with Komo-Tec EX430 or EX460 upgrade), or a Noble M12 GTO-3/3R (ideally with the normal mods for reliability and around 400bhp). These are both fairly (and similarly) quick and have an exceptional reputation for driver engagement and enjoyment. After a lot of research and consideration, I decided on the Noble, mostly due to its rarity and the fact it felt more dramatic, more of an event, to use.
My preference was for an M12 GTO-3R, only for the aesthetics of the faired-in headlights, but this wasn’t a deal-breaker. I went to see and drive a GTO3 at a dealer - it was decent and in my preferred colour (Azure Blue), with most of the desirable mods. However, shifting into 5th and 6th was not right, and I suspect the shift forks may have needed changing. Shortly afterwards, a lovely GTO-3R came up with an incredible amount of mods, fastidiously maintained, running just under 430bhp, in Lotus silver. I usually buy my cars on the owner, and having already spoken with this owner at length, I knew this one could be the one. I went to see it – superbly modified and maintained, and the test drive was eye opening! – and shortly afterwards I had it bought.
I’ve been the proud owner of my M12 GTO-3R for a few months now and absolutely love it. It’s everything I hoped it would be – fast, exciting, involving, rewarding and an event to drive. I’ve done a few local car shows and the first track day is coming up soon, as I feel I’ve got to know it better now.
It sits with my GBS Zero in my physical garage and alongside the following in the metaphorical garage, though this is constantly changing!
Mercedes E63 AMG (S212, 735bhp)
GBS Zero (modified Zetec Blacktop)
Jaguar XJ Super V8 (X350, supercharged)
Mercedes S600 (W220, V12 BiTurbo)
Audi A6 3.0 BiTdi (C7, 400bhp+)
Land Rover Defender Wolf 100 soft-top (ex-military)
Land Rover Series II 88” (1959)
Land Rover Series III 109” (ex-military)
LDV Maxus (kind of a day van!)
I’ll do some (less wordy!) posts soon on what it’s like to drive, all the mods it has, the first few problems I’ve encountered, track days, etc. if people are interested.
I also have a video review of my Noble on my YouTube channel (@Rich_Runs_Cars) here (it’s very amateur, so please only visit if you’re OK with that :-)):
https://youtu.be/olH4_qvYzYw
Also with videos of most of the other cars above, and I’ll post video updates on the Noble there too.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCC2bF2rTdpGIdaq0K...
Cheers.
Edited by Rich Runs Cars on Friday 18th October 09:00
GT4 is probably the only Porsche I'd consider actually - but I don't know much about them! It's probably the safer bet!
I like the quirkiness of the Noble though, and the lack of any driver aids for purity of experience. It's amazing how much attention it gets even next to exotica - I think for many it's the car they wanted but couldn't justify the risk?!
I like the quirkiness of the Noble though, and the lack of any driver aids for purity of experience. It's amazing how much attention it gets even next to exotica - I think for many it's the car they wanted but couldn't justify the risk?!
NomadicTurbo said:
Always thought that these look like a great car.
I don't know enough about them to choose one over a Cayman GT4 though
I don't know enough about them to choose one over a Cayman GT4 though
Wonderful car, and great quality photos too.
One of the few cars, imo, that looks like it was born to have a rear wing. Looks superb, and the performance was a surprise "back in the day", still as quick as needed for big fun. Too many cars get described as "a racecar for the road", but the M12 is one where it feels reasonable... raucous and raw.
Thanks for showing her off.
One of the few cars, imo, that looks like it was born to have a rear wing. Looks superb, and the performance was a surprise "back in the day", still as quick as needed for big fun. Too many cars get described as "a racecar for the road", but the M12 is one where it feels reasonable... raucous and raw.
Thanks for showing her off.
M11rph said:
Wonderful car, and great quality photos too.
One of the few cars, imo, that looks like it was born to have a rear wing. Looks superb, and the performance was a surprise "back in the day", still as quick as needed for big fun. Too many cars get described as "a racecar for the road", but the M12 is one where it feels reasonable... raucous and raw.
Thanks for showing her off.
Thanks for the kind words :-)One of the few cars, imo, that looks like it was born to have a rear wing. Looks superb, and the performance was a surprise "back in the day", still as quick as needed for big fun. Too many cars get described as "a racecar for the road", but the M12 is one where it feels reasonable... raucous and raw.
Thanks for showing her off.
I've seen an M12 without the wing and it didn't look right, but I guess it's what you get accustomed to! It's ridiculous, but I love it - and it seems to appeal to most people under 20 (and some of us older folk too). Interestingly the rear wing gave little additional downforce on the M12 due to the turbulent air from the roof. Some owners did wind tunnel testing and found raising the wing increased downforce, hence the wing on my M12 is raised. (Many more knowledgeable folk on here than me on this topic).
I agree on that! It's not the quickest car, but in a world where anyone can just plant their foot and do 0-60mph in a little over 3 sec in a moderately priced car, and not worry about cornering technique due to 4wd and amazing traction control systems, this is a different type of enjoyment.
macron said:
Your garage sounds brilliant,.would love to see the LDV and E63!
Thank you!The LDV is....hideous! I bought it as a minibus for £1k a few years ago, then used it as a van to do lots of moving stuff. Was going to sell it but made it into a very basic day van for trips with the dogs and for festivals. Re-sprayed it NATO green so the algae is less noticeable :-)
I'll try to dig out some LDV and E63 photos later.
A couple of [not great] videos on my E63 here:
https://youtu.be/t_Z8EKPeSXM
https://youtu.be/tCExJLJI_ow
Cambs_Stuart said:
An M12 has always been on my lottery win garage. Absolutely fantastic cars.
I've had a car with the 3.0 duratec, but nothing like the power to weight ratio.
What did you have the 3.0 Duratec in? I struggled to find exactly what cars the engine was used in.I've had a car with the 3.0 duratec, but nothing like the power to weight ratio.
Unfortunately the days of M12s being more affordable seem to be gone - I think they dipped to low £20ks at one point. But still don't seem particularly over-priced even at today's prices in my opinion. I missed out on one at auction about 18 months ago, and had huge regrets that I didn't bid more and buy it. Rectified now!
Rich Runs Cars said:
Cambs_Stuart said:
An M12 has always been on my lottery win garage. Absolutely fantastic cars.
I've had a car with the 3.0 duratec, but nothing like the power to weight ratio.
What did you have the 3.0 Duratec in? I struggled to find exactly what cars the engine was used in.I've had a car with the 3.0 duratec, but nothing like the power to weight ratio.
Unfortunately the days of M12s being more affordable seem to be gone - I think they dipped to low £20ks at one point. But still don't seem particularly over-priced even at today's prices in my opinion. I missed out on one at auction about 18 months ago, and had huge regrets that I didn't bid more and buy it. Rectified now!
I popped in to Caffeine and Machine The Bowl with the Noble yesterday afternoon. Not been hugely impressed with the venue previously - nothing particularly wrong with it, just lacking cars and atmosphere! There were some lovely cars there (lots of BMWs) and met some really nice guys, but still not particularly busy. Parked next to a Delta Integrale.
It was great to see kids and teenagers flock to the Noble when I drove in - lots of photos taken! I love the enthusiasm of kids with cars they like! I think I like the Noble so much in part because it appeals to the kid in me.
The guy in the photo had a fancy camera and gave me a small printout photo (Polariod?!) of my Noble there and then which was nice of him.
It was great to see kids and teenagers flock to the Noble when I drove in - lots of photos taken! I love the enthusiasm of kids with cars they like! I think I like the Noble so much in part because it appeals to the kid in me.
The guy in the photo had a fancy camera and gave me a small printout photo (Polariod?!) of my Noble there and then which was nice of him.
Edited by Rich Runs Cars on Sunday 20th October 10:07
Rich Runs Cars said:
Thank you!
The LDV is....hideous! I bought it as a minibus for £1k a few years ago, then used it as a van to do lots of moving stuff. Was going to sell it but made it into a very basic day van for trips with the dogs and for festivals. Re-sprayed it NATO green so the algae is less noticeable :-)
I'll try to dig out some LDV and E63 photos later.
A couple of [not great] videos on my E63 here:
https://youtu.be/t_Z8EKPeSXM
https://youtu.be/tCExJLJI_ow
Hey mate, love the noble. How do you find the 63 wagon? It's on my next motor list along with a few other cars and it's hard to find a 5.5 wagon that hasn't been ragged. Are they a do it all car excluding winter? Always loved an estate with a massive engine 😬😅The LDV is....hideous! I bought it as a minibus for £1k a few years ago, then used it as a van to do lots of moving stuff. Was going to sell it but made it into a very basic day van for trips with the dogs and for festivals. Re-sprayed it NATO green so the algae is less noticeable :-)
I'll try to dig out some LDV and E63 photos later.
A couple of [not great] videos on my E63 here:
https://youtu.be/t_Z8EKPeSXM
https://youtu.be/tCExJLJI_ow
Toddtherod said:
Hey mate, love the noble. How do you find the 63 wagon? It's on my next motor list along with a few other cars and it's hard to find a 5.5 wagon that hasn't been ragged. Are they a do it all car excluding winter? Always loved an estate with a massive engine ????
Thanks! The E63 is a superb car, can't recommend it enough - you definitely wouldn't be disappointed. It's definitely a do-it-all car, enormous boot, extremely easy to drive, but when you want to have some fun it is supercar quick in a straight line once rolling (with map), but also remarkably good in the corners for its size and weight. And AMGs have the best sound in my opinion!What else are you considering? Hard to see what can match it at the 212 pricepoint...?
I actually think if you go for an estate over saloon they are generally much less ragged - often family cars, so has spouse speed control a lot of the time! I think estates get a different type of owner often. Also, I know quite a few upper middle aged gentlemen have them, so find one of those :-) You can generally tell by speaking with the owner how they've looked after the car, if buying privately.
Gassing Station | Readers' Cars | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff