JHR Suspended From Ginetta Competition
Discussion
"Leading team JHR Developments have been suspended from all Ginetta competition for the remainder of the 2017 season pending an investigation by the Yorkshire manufacturer."
http://www.thecheckeredflag.co.uk/2017/08/jhr-deve...
http://www.thecheckeredflag.co.uk/2017/08/jhr-deve...
Here's the report from the MSA court hearing; https://www.msauk.org/assets/casenoj2017171819.pdf
From reading that it sounds to me as though JHR were guilty of modifying the engines, but due to the MSA scrutineer not having followed the correct procedures for eligibility checks (which doesn't surprise me), the court had no option but to uphold their appeal.
From reading that it sounds to me as though JHR were guilty of modifying the engines, but due to the MSA scrutineer not having followed the correct procedures for eligibility checks (which doesn't surprise me), the court had no option but to uphold their appeal.
telecat said:
Thought Tockwith were in LMP2 this year. Anybody know if JHR can modify the engines as this seemed to be the crux of the defence?
Tockwith LMP Programme Parked For Remainder Of 2017 Seasonhttp://www.dailysportscar.com/2017/08/09/tockwith-...
Reading the MSA hearing document, it appears someone had skimmed the heads and that's obviously contrary to the rules.
Whether it will be proven that JHR carried out the work we don't yet know but it's difficult to think of any other way it could have been done to multiple engines in just one team.
Whether it will be proven that JHR carried out the work we don't yet know but it's difficult to think of any other way it could have been done to multiple engines in just one team.
FurtiveFreddy said:
Reading the MSA hearing document, it appears someone had skimmed the heads and that's obviously contrary to the rules.
Whether it will be proven that JHR carried out the work we don't yet know but it's difficult to think of any other way it could have been done to multiple engines in just one team.
And the hearing was overturned because there was a lack of records of the seals on the engines, making it impossible to prove the engines hadn't left the factory in that way.Whether it will be proven that JHR carried out the work we don't yet know but it's difficult to think of any other way it could have been done to multiple engines in just one team.
Unless there's some politics involved I can't see why Ginetta would exclude JHR unless they were 100% certain the engines were not supplied like that. What's the benefit to Ginetta?
Ginetta don't appear to have a motive.
JHR obviously could have a motive to win races/customers.
(Obviously though as it's racing there will be massive untold politics between individuals at play...but on the face of it...)
Ginetta don't appear to have a motive.
JHR obviously could have a motive to win races/customers.
(Obviously though as it's racing there will be massive untold politics between individuals at play...but on the face of it...)
telecat said:
Lookin at the results it difficult to say if the engines were faster or not. Watching it I wouldn't have said they were.
Eh? Seb Priaulx and Tom Gamble are first and second in the standings and I don't know what sort of differences you expect to see watching the races. The performance gains from taking a few thou' off the head will be small and the difference it makes very subtle, but in this sort of racing it can make just enough of a difference to affect the results and on the face of it, it has (not taking anything away from Seb).Even the drivers probably wouldn't think there's anything much different about their cars, just that they are a bit faster than the rest, but they'll put that down to set up or their driving.
TBH, we don't know yet if this was done to gain advantage or even whether it actually has benefited the drivers. But two of them are at the top.
telecat said:
But presumably they wouldn't be using those engines after Thruxton and they still top the standings. That's 7 rounds with an engine deemed to have been tampered with and 11 without. If it did make that much difference I wouldn't expect them to still be winning.
Is cheating only cheating when you win?I can see this being very expensive for Ginetta....
Clearly the sealing of engines was shambolic which means absolutely nothing is provable - hence why the MSA exonerated JHR as they had no other choice. Whatever everyone's view on the likelihood it counts for nothing.
JHR as far as I can see fundamentally earn their living out of the various flavours of Ginetta and they have been denied that income stream and I am not sure on what authority Ginetta can exclude - it is not a move I can see the MSA enforcing for that very reason.
I would expect a hefty claim against Ginetta from JHR and a judge is going to want to see irrefutable proof which Ginetta simply do not have - that has been tested already.
It is possible that they MSA may also review the actions of Ginetta
Clearly the sealing of engines was shambolic which means absolutely nothing is provable - hence why the MSA exonerated JHR as they had no other choice. Whatever everyone's view on the likelihood it counts for nothing.
JHR as far as I can see fundamentally earn their living out of the various flavours of Ginetta and they have been denied that income stream and I am not sure on what authority Ginetta can exclude - it is not a move I can see the MSA enforcing for that very reason.
I would expect a hefty claim against Ginetta from JHR and a judge is going to want to see irrefutable proof which Ginetta simply do not have - that has been tested already.
It is possible that they MSA may also review the actions of Ginetta
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