Thursday 16th February 2017

New WRC cars 'too fast' says FIA

Swedish stage cancelled after FIA says new faster WRC cars are ... too fast

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Remember how much we were looking forward to the new, faster and more wild looking WRC cars and the promise of a return to Group B style pace? Looks like it could be a case of 'careful what you wish for' in the case of the latter, the FIA cancelling the second running of the Kron stage on safety grounds in an ominous echo of the safety concerns that killed off that same Group B era. At least in that instance we got a four seasons of iconic action to enjoy - in the case of the new WRC cars it's lasted just a couple of rallies!

Times have changed of course and rallying in the early 80s was very different from the modern era, not least in terms of crowd control and the safety of the cars. And nobody wants to see anyone get hurt. But having launched the new era of WRC specifically on the promise of bringing back a sense of the speed of Group B cars it seems ironic for the FIA to then immediately seek to slow the cars down again.

The problem came when Ott Tanak's M-Sport Fiesta clocked an average speed of 85.65mph through the first running of the stage. This was declared too fast by the FIA and the second run on the same stage - SS12 - was cancelled, the governing body since reported by Motorsport.com to be "considering regulatory changes to ensure average speeds do not exceed 80mph".

Apparently the FIA's rally director for the event Jarmo Mahonen raised concerns about the speed of the stage after even the 'old' WRC cars that lack the extra power, aero and technology of the 2017 ones were clocking over 80mph. As such the problem would seemingly be attributed to the configuration of the stage, not the cars specifically. But the fact the FIA seems keen to make WRC cars run slower - by whatever means - does rather fly in the face of the widely applauded initiative to restore some of the spectacle absent from the sport in recent years.

Any attempt to impose restrictions - perceived or actual - on WRC's speeds will come as a blow, especially given the season has already shown competitive pace among all the top teams and a closely fought battle among manufacturers not present under VW's domination of the championship. Toyota's Jari-Matti Latvala won the Swedish event, the Yaris taking victory in only its second WRC event and providing Toyota with its first win in 17 years. With multiple stage wins by Neuville's Hyundai, Tanak's Ford and another by Sordo in the Hyundai it would seem the new cars are all on the pace and the stage is set for a proper battle as the season unfolds. Assuming the FIA doesn't make them weave through bales to keep the speeds down...

[Sources: Autosport.com, Motorsport.com]

[Photos: RedBull content pool]

[FactoryRSVR]

The only other sport I remember that had speed limits was truck racing. Everyone seems to be obsessed with speed in rallying as if that is what makes it exciting. The introduction of pointless aero and centre diffs has increased grip which reduces spectacle. Maybe the focus should be on making the cars tougher to drive and the stages more challenging, less repeat loops, longer stages more varied conditions would increase spectacle without the need for increase in outright speed.

[zeb]

That would be the RAC Rally you mean then?

[SystemParanoia]

oh do fk off FIA.

[JTSmith]

FIA Fun Police are not happy

[HighwayStar]

I suspect they are having to be cautious and keep eye on speed because a spectator has already died on the seasons opener, the Monte Carlo.
https://www.rte.ie/sport/motorsport/2017/0119/8462...

[FactoryRSVR]

HighwayStar said:

I suspect they are having to be cautious and keep eye on speed because a spectator has already died on the seasons opener, the Monte Carlo.
https://www.rte.ie/sport/motorsport/2017/0119/8462...

That was very very sad and no one wants to see that happen, but I think where they were standing and not the the speed of the car wwas the contributing factor in this case.

[jtopps]

FactoryRSVR said:

HighwayStar said:

I suspect they are having to be cautious and keep eye on speed because a spectator has already died on the seasons opener, the Monte Carlo.
https://www.rte.ie/sport/motorsport/2017/0119/8462...

That was very very sad and no one wants to see that happen, but I think where they were standing and not the the speed of the car wwas the contributing factor in this case.

Agreed, whilst it was very sad to see he literally couldn't have picked a worse place to stand. As for reducing the speed on the grounds of safety i think that would be a shame and ill founded idea. The safety of these cars is so far advanced from that of the Group B era that you cannot compare the two at all. Also *touches wood so as not to jinx it* crowds seem a touch less suicidal these days and you see a lot less people standing in the middle of the road as a car is approaching at full chat. You do still get the occasional idiot but that is their gamble if you ask me and the FIA shouldn't pander to this. Don't be boring FIA, you're onto a good thing here, these cars are spectacular.

[HighwayStar]

jtopps said:

FactoryRSVR said:

HighwayStar said:

I suspect they are having to be cautious and keep eye on speed because a spectator has already died on the seasons opener, the Monte Carlo.
https://www.rte.ie/sport/motorsport/2017/0119/8462...

That was very very sad and no one wants to see that happen, but I think where they were standing and not the the speed of the car wwas the contributing factor in this case.

Agreed, whilst it was very sad to see he literally couldn't have picked a worse place to stand. As for reducing the speed on the grounds of safety i think that would be a shame and ill founded idea. The safety of these cars is so far advanced from that of the Group B era that you cannot compare the two at all. Also *touches wood so as not to jinx it* crowds seem a touch less suicidal these days and you see a lot less people standing in the middle of the road as a car is approaching at full chat. You do still get the occasional idiot but that is their gamble if you ask me and the FIA shouldn't pander to this. Don't be boring FIA, you're onto a good thing here, these cars are spectacular.

Agreed also but... but you know the FIA can't say it was his on fault, same etc. I would think given time and a few tweaks things will settle down.

[Zajda]

double post...delete please

Edited by Zajda on Thursday 16th February 16:44

[Zajda]

Dan Trent said:

Swedish stage cancelled after FIA says new faster WRC cars are ... too fast

I read both linked articles and how did you concluded from them that FIA is about to change the actual technical regulations is beyond me.
In all due respect you don't follow rally too much, do you?
Seems like you are mixing apples and oranges here.
One stage was cancelled, that's all.
Second rounds of stages are being regulary cancelled due to high speeds even in our national championship with R5's.
The organisers in Finland and Poland will take a note to use more hay bales and everybody will be happy.
No one cares about actual speeds too much.
Only about calculated average.
Czech multiple rally champ Václav Pech tried 997 GT3 for one season, posting comparable times as R5's in the dry.
But hitting his 215 km/h rev limiter quite often in the process :-)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDikci9kw0I

Edited by Zajda on Thursday 16th February 21:31

[anonymous-user]

The WRC has been dying a slow death the last few years but with the slightly faster cars fans were getting very excited about the return of proper rallying.

If you listen to any of the drivers after the first few staged in the Monte Carlo Rally they were delighted driving cars which made them sit up and take note.

Yes the faster you go the higher the risk but what is the point of even competing if you can't drive these cars at the limit.

Whether the death of the spectator at the Monte has made the FIA go all extreme we will never know but you could have cars with 100 bhp and it would still kill someone willing to stand in a very stupid place.

Not just the speed factor but the FIA also had a go at Sweden regarding the lack of snow especially the need for more snow banks. Pressure has been put on the organiser to move more into Norway to find better stages with more snow.

The FIA cancel a stage due to the cars going too fast but if the cars were able to lean on snow banks they would go even faster.

Perhaps not allowing teams to run studded tyres is the answer so we can just watch them stuck at the start of the stage unable to get any traction.

Beyond words how much the FIA seem to hate the sport they govern.

Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 16th February 17:42

[speedking31]

If the aero increases speed through the corners but the straightline speed is unaffected then the average will increase but not necessarily at the cost of overall safety.

[Glosole]

Simple really its not the cars too fast its the fact they are running studs if they ran regular snow rubber the speeds would be much more sensible. When it snows on Rally Wales they don't use 100's of studs just regular M and S rubber though maybe the 2017 aero need raining in a bit even though it looks cool starting to look a bit like a dtm car.

[RumbleOfThunder]

Tinfoil hat on. A dastardly scheme by Citroen to shake up the status quo allowing them to get back on pace quicker.

[rtz62]

Antediluvian hat on; rallying hasn't been of much interest since the twilight glory years of Makinen, McRae and Burns et al.
Followed it religiously since the days of Roger Clark, in Ford Escorts, through Mikkola in the Audi Quattro, Toivonen in the S4, Sainz in the GT-Four and then the 3 names at the beginning of my ramble.
Now? It's just a 'meh' from me; like footballers, the drivers have got soft, no all-night stages etc, no spectators sipping steaming hot bovril on a mid-winter night etc etc.
Personally I don't care what people might say of my viewpoint, but I'm glad I got to watch the above drivers and their cars when WRC was in its pomp, not the pasteurised, sterilised version we get today...

[D-Angle]

How much does rallying really need the FIA? It's not like they use circuits that they need to keep on-side if they are under the FIA's umbrella, what would stop them breaking away under a new governing body?

For the longest time, it seems that any FIA motorsport that isn't F1 gets this kind of treatment as soon as it becomes more interesting to the general public.

[MikeGoodwin]

Funny i was watching it this week thinking it was for a change actually interesting. Its been total dross for years. Fia can fk off.

[Welshwonder]

I was amused when Mads Ostberg was interviewed after losing his rear spoiler - the lack of downforce at the back caused the rear end of the car to lift over a jump. The car landed on its nose - ouch.

Hope the fellas who returned his spoiler got a bloody big bad of freebies!

[velocemitch]

I think most people are missing the point really.
Rallying has always had a maximum speed for sections or stages, its how it works. The crew closest to that maximum speed across the event is the winner. In most situations in Stage Rallying the maximum average speed (which I believe is about 80mph on WRC) is achievable, so it is simply the fastest crew who wins.
Its up to the organisers of the event to judge the speed of the stages by the layout of them, fewer long straights, more sharp twisty sections. In this instance they misjudged it, the conditions and the cars got the better of them and the minimum stage times were achievable... not just by the 2017 WRC cars but ALSO by the 2016 cars. The organisers got it wrong, the FIA pulled them up on it as they should.
Its a shot across the bows to other organisers to make sure they lay the stages out to keep the average down, there is no way they will lift the average allowed speed, or alter the spec of the Cars.

[Ralphthemouth]

My 2 cents worth, they have just introduced a huge increase in power. Combined with other 'upgrades'. These cars are the fastest they've seen for many many years and as a result there's bound to be some teething troubles. For the FIA they are entering a new era of rallying and don't want things getting out of hand like they did in the 80s.

For all our sakes lets just hope they don't ruin the sport as quick as they made it better.....now, that idea about Citroen!? That's pure genius....whose in charge of the FIA WRC? Not Jean Todt is it still?