Suspension mods S2 Vixen
Discussion
Hi,
Having hillclimbed and sprinted my Vixen S3 for a number of years, there are plenty of things that can be done to improve the performance of a Vixen. Of course the number of modifications is purely dependent on budget, but the cars generally are excellent handling machines capable of embarassing much more powerful machinery (even beating Griffs and Cerberas!)
What is your car at the moment? Any tweaks planned/completed? What are you aiming at? How mechanically minded are you and do you have a budget?
Have fun,
TreVoR Jasper
Having hillclimbed and sprinted my Vixen S3 for a number of years, there are plenty of things that can be done to improve the performance of a Vixen. Of course the number of modifications is purely dependent on budget, but the cars generally are excellent handling machines capable of embarassing much more powerful machinery (even beating Griffs and Cerberas!)
What is your car at the moment? Any tweaks planned/completed? What are you aiming at? How mechanically minded are you and do you have a budget?
Have fun,
TreVoR Jasper
In the past, I have beaten 5litre Griffs at Sprints and overtaken all sorts of Griffs and Cerberas at track days at Cadwell, Oulton Park etc.
For example, my best time at Curborough last year was 35.91 secs, and best sprint time round Goodwood was 99.63 secs. Compare those with some of the times reported last year from Peter Humphries sprint reports. Pete is quicker than that now, because his car has been developed from standard. There aren't many people who can drive a standard Griff that fast.
Ian Bannister embarassed a number of Griffs and Chimps at Three Sisters the week before last, no doubt repeating that feat at Harewood last weekend. And he has yet to get his more powerful Crossflow back into his car. He'll have another 30hp to play with soon.
Without doubt, the Vixens can be made to out-handle and out-sprint many standard and some modified Griffs, driver ability not withstanding.
Later....
TreVoR
For example, my best time at Curborough last year was 35.91 secs, and best sprint time round Goodwood was 99.63 secs. Compare those with some of the times reported last year from Peter Humphries sprint reports. Pete is quicker than that now, because his car has been developed from standard. There aren't many people who can drive a standard Griff that fast.
Ian Bannister embarassed a number of Griffs and Chimps at Three Sisters the week before last, no doubt repeating that feat at Harewood last weekend. And he has yet to get his more powerful Crossflow back into his car. He'll have another 30hp to play with soon.
Without doubt, the Vixens can be made to out-handle and out-sprint many standard and some modified Griffs, driver ability not withstanding.
Later....
TreVoR
When you look at the actual power-to-weight ratio, a tuned Vixen is not that far off a standard 4.0 V8. They also seem to corner better, presumably the reduced weight helps here. But the power advantage of the V8 cars seems to tell at the faster tracks where aerodynamics come into play.
Having said that I think in this case the driver has to take a lot of the credit. There's no way a Vixen should be able to do a standing lap of Goodwood in under 100 seconds, they are typically some ten seconds slower. In all the sprints I've been to at Goodwood only three TVRs of any capacity have done a standing lap in under 100 seconds, and they were all modified V8s. To achieve this in a Vixen is simply phenomenal.
Having said that I think in this case the driver has to take a lot of the credit. There's no way a Vixen should be able to do a standing lap of Goodwood in under 100 seconds, they are typically some ten seconds slower. In all the sprints I've been to at Goodwood only three TVRs of any capacity have done a standing lap in under 100 seconds, and they were all modified V8s. To achieve this in a Vixen is simply phenomenal.
quote:
In the past, I have beaten 5litre Griffs at Sprints and overtaken all sorts of Griffs and Cerberas at track days at Cadwell, Oulton Park etc.
For example, my best time at Curborough last year was 35.91 secs, and best sprint time round Goodwood was 99.63 secs. Compare those with some of the times reported last year from Peter Humphries sprint reports. Pete is quicker than that now, because his car has been developed from standard. There aren't many people who can drive a standard Griff that fast.
Ian Bannister embarassed a number of Griffs and Chimps at Three Sisters the week before last, no doubt repeating that feat at Harewood last weekend. And he has yet to get his more powerful Crossflow back into his car. He'll have another 30hp to play with soon.
Without doubt, the Vixens can be made to out-handle and out-sprint many standard and some modified Griffs, driver ability not withstanding.
Later....
TreVoR
Thanks Pete.
Anyway, getting back to topic, modifying Vixens can be extremely rewarding. As I said, what peeair can do depends on what he has now and what sort of budget to spend.
I'll willingly point you in the right direction as to suspension, engine and wheel/tyre combos that I've found work well.
Have fun.
TreVoR (YellowShed)
Anyway, getting back to topic, modifying Vixens can be extremely rewarding. As I said, what peeair can do depends on what he has now and what sort of budget to spend.
I'll willingly point you in the right direction as to suspension, engine and wheel/tyre combos that I've found work well.
Have fun.
TreVoR (YellowShed)
At the moment the car is still in the restoration stage, just about to paint and re-wire it, the only mods at the moment are a set of AVO dampers and a rollcage, i have got a set of DCOE 40's to go on but that be for later, i'd like to use it on the road as well as compete with it. Any advice on tyres would be of great help, can you use tubless tyres on the original TVR wheels?
peeair,
You certainly can use tubeless tyres on the original rims. You'll find, though, that they tend to not be too round and will lead to fairly rapid tyre imbalance - to the extent that you'll have to rebalance them once a season, depending on usage/speed, etc
For your levels of power, I can recommend the Yokohama A539 compound in a 185/55R15 size. That'll give you a nice-looking (in proportion for the car) wheel/tyre combo and won't over-tyre the car - especially in the wet/damp conditions that can occur in Britain!
If you really insist on the widest tyre, I've run 195/50R15s on the original rims but they sit much better on the Minilite 6x15 wheels. Whilst great in the dry, I have suffered on 195 width tyres in the wet sprinting where I haven't been able to get the tyre warm enough to grip properly. On a track, this is less of an issue.
The 185 and 195 options both considerably reduce the gearing giving better acceleration which is a good thing. The downside is you use more revs on the road getting to and from an event. However, I competed for the whole of the 1996 season on 195/50 tyres, driving to each event, and had been using them as road tyres for a couple of years previously. So they are useable, depending on how much you're prepared to put up with. Saying that I also ran with a 4.11 diff which made things much more revvy!
Another consequence of the smaller tyres is the lower ground clearance. I used to raise the rear ride-height on my Leda shocks after events to compensate for the tools etc that I carried to the events.
Whatpower are you looking at for the engine. Have you got a good head? Is it standard bore etc? I am building a 1700cc crossflow for Kristian Petersson's 1600M and looking for 135bhp. I used to have a very similar spec engine putting out that sort of power before finally going to 1760cc and 170bhp! That's not the ultimate for the engine, but it is pretty much it for the gearbox and diff. I broke a gearbox tooth at Oulton Park and wore out differentials in a season with that much power!! However, it was worth it to have Cerbera's pull over to let me by when I'd caught them.....
I could put together a pretty rock-solid engine for you if you want......
Then we could get onto springs and dampers, front and rear suspension mods etc...... How bottomless is your money pit?
You certainly can use tubeless tyres on the original rims. You'll find, though, that they tend to not be too round and will lead to fairly rapid tyre imbalance - to the extent that you'll have to rebalance them once a season, depending on usage/speed, etc
For your levels of power, I can recommend the Yokohama A539 compound in a 185/55R15 size. That'll give you a nice-looking (in proportion for the car) wheel/tyre combo and won't over-tyre the car - especially in the wet/damp conditions that can occur in Britain!
If you really insist on the widest tyre, I've run 195/50R15s on the original rims but they sit much better on the Minilite 6x15 wheels. Whilst great in the dry, I have suffered on 195 width tyres in the wet sprinting where I haven't been able to get the tyre warm enough to grip properly. On a track, this is less of an issue.
The 185 and 195 options both considerably reduce the gearing giving better acceleration which is a good thing. The downside is you use more revs on the road getting to and from an event. However, I competed for the whole of the 1996 season on 195/50 tyres, driving to each event, and had been using them as road tyres for a couple of years previously. So they are useable, depending on how much you're prepared to put up with. Saying that I also ran with a 4.11 diff which made things much more revvy!
Another consequence of the smaller tyres is the lower ground clearance. I used to raise the rear ride-height on my Leda shocks after events to compensate for the tools etc that I carried to the events.
Whatpower are you looking at for the engine. Have you got a good head? Is it standard bore etc? I am building a 1700cc crossflow for Kristian Petersson's 1600M and looking for 135bhp. I used to have a very similar spec engine putting out that sort of power before finally going to 1760cc and 170bhp! That's not the ultimate for the engine, but it is pretty much it for the gearbox and diff. I broke a gearbox tooth at Oulton Park and wore out differentials in a season with that much power!! However, it was worth it to have Cerbera's pull over to let me by when I'd caught them.....
I could put together a pretty rock-solid engine for you if you want......
Then we could get onto springs and dampers, front and rear suspension mods etc...... How bottomless is your money pit?
When i bought the car i found reciepts in the glove box showing that the car had a recon Ford engine fitted in 1985 and since then it has covered 8000 miles, the bores are standard and i've had the converted to unleaded, at the moment i'd like to get the handling sorted so that i can use it this year and build up a more powerful engine over the winter,as and when i can afford it. Thanks for the info on tyres 185 would be the way to go i think. I've gone for standard spring rates at the moment, to use as a datum point, is there any advantage in retaining the twin dampers at the rear used on the S2 vixen? If it's any easier you can e-mail direct at peter stallard@hotmil.com
Peter,
I ran single springs only on my car - it does make it easier to set the rates and control the dampers if you only have one set. It also is cheaper!
Critically, if you're uprating springs, then you really need new pivot bars - and getting ones out of your old uprights can be a nightmare. Then you have to be sure that the rear wheel bearings are good. Setting them up with machined bearing spacers is time-consuming and requires some engineering expertise but is well worth it in the end. As someone who's had a quill shaft break on the track, I can say that it's not a nice experience!!!!
If you're in any doubt about the rear uprights, then I would say that investing in some refurbished ones from Adrian Venn at Exactly TVR (www.exactly-tvr.demon.co.uk) - advertised under Vixen Specials - would be well worth it. Even better are the Competition units which I now have on my car and would never go back to the standard units - the difference in the aluminium casting quality has to be seen to be believed. I know they seem expensive, but brand new castings versus 30yr old castings, believe me, they ARE worth the money. That gives the added benefit of improved pivot bar strength allowing you to run whatever spring rates you want.
A definite benefit to the standard car is uprated front springs - and I mean uprated. You can gain big improvements in the handling by going to much stiffer front springs. Again, Adrian Venn will supply you with the appropriate springs.
YellowShed aka TreVoR Jasper
I ran single springs only on my car - it does make it easier to set the rates and control the dampers if you only have one set. It also is cheaper!
Critically, if you're uprating springs, then you really need new pivot bars - and getting ones out of your old uprights can be a nightmare. Then you have to be sure that the rear wheel bearings are good. Setting them up with machined bearing spacers is time-consuming and requires some engineering expertise but is well worth it in the end. As someone who's had a quill shaft break on the track, I can say that it's not a nice experience!!!!
If you're in any doubt about the rear uprights, then I would say that investing in some refurbished ones from Adrian Venn at Exactly TVR (www.exactly-tvr.demon.co.uk) - advertised under Vixen Specials - would be well worth it. Even better are the Competition units which I now have on my car and would never go back to the standard units - the difference in the aluminium casting quality has to be seen to be believed. I know they seem expensive, but brand new castings versus 30yr old castings, believe me, they ARE worth the money. That gives the added benefit of improved pivot bar strength allowing you to run whatever spring rates you want.
A definite benefit to the standard car is uprated front springs - and I mean uprated. You can gain big improvements in the handling by going to much stiffer front springs. Again, Adrian Venn will supply you with the appropriate springs.
YellowShed aka TreVoR Jasper
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