Ferrari based self built chassis, Q plate?
Discussion
Hi I have been considering building a replica Ferrari chassis from tube and making a body from genuine and fabricated components. When registering the car I would like age related (against the engine?) or a new plate by having all new but a recon engine.
The bit I cant quite get clarification on is you need to provide receipts of the new components. If I am building the chassis from tube can I provide a receipt for the tube? and the body that again will be made by making moulds, so I will not have a receipt for them.
I have been looking at the rebody / radically modified car route but think this might be expensive to insure? I could use a ferrari chassis but the roof line will be different. Perhaps using a convertible and fitting a roof maybe the solution, or making the changes to the chassis and then taking the photo (i know is naughty)
Say a Ferrari 348 If i removed the a b and c pillars is that a modified chassis, I imagine it is.
Can you build a "kitcar" without purchasing a made chassis / body?
The bit I cant quite get clarification on is you need to provide receipts of the new components. If I am building the chassis from tube can I provide a receipt for the tube? and the body that again will be made by making moulds, so I will not have a receipt for them.
I have been looking at the rebody / radically modified car route but think this might be expensive to insure? I could use a ferrari chassis but the roof line will be different. Perhaps using a convertible and fitting a roof maybe the solution, or making the changes to the chassis and then taking the photo (i know is naughty)
Say a Ferrari 348 If i removed the a b and c pillars is that a modified chassis, I imagine it is.
Can you build a "kitcar" without purchasing a made chassis / body?
You can build your own car making the chassis and body yourself. Keep all receipts for the materials and a good photo blog of making the moulds and the panels.
For your new build you can have one major item reconditioned (As you say engine) but again you must have receipts showing it has been 'rebuilt to an as new condition' changing plugs and points won't cut it.
Steve
For your new build you can have one major item reconditioned (As you say engine) but again you must have receipts showing it has been 'rebuilt to an as new condition' changing plugs and points won't cut it.
Steve
SJK said:
I guess I cant do age related then?
When filling in the make and model, what are my options if the engine was ferrari?
You would need an original chassis for age related.When filling in the make and model, what are my options if the engine was ferrari?
If you are building new you would have to make up a name for it but you will not get away with calling it a Ferrari even if it has a Ferrari engine. I doubt you could give it a Ferrari model name unless it was just a number.
Steve
Would there be an option to use all new (plus one reconditioned) component to get a current registration and then buy a "personalised" number to make it age related?
I know that once a Q plate is on a car, it cannot be changed, but I've never heard of a rule saying that an age related or current plate cannot be changed, as long as it doesn't make the car appear younger than it is.
I know that once a Q plate is on a car, it cannot be changed, but I've never heard of a rule saying that an age related or current plate cannot be changed, as long as it doesn't make the car appear younger than it is.
Yes. To get a new reg if you can prove that most (again, using a points system) parts are new. So brand new crate engine, new gearbox, etc. This is what Caterham and the likes do when they supply a kit of new parts. Again the chassis isn't a barrier to that.
If you have a new, or age-related plate, you can then switch it to a personalised one.
If you have a new, or age-related plate, you can then switch it to a personalised one.
Am going down a similar route myself and going for kit converted route as explained here. Aiming to get an age related number.
Tips so far:
- Check all numbers match reg docs etc and so on, so you don't get to end of process and find you do not have the two original major parts as the, for example, engine has been replaced etc and so on.
- Create a spreadsheet of potential costs. Was shocked when doing mine. Anticipated man maths costs were way out. Don't forget things like transport and BIVA test.
Good luck with your project.
Tips so far:
- Check all numbers match reg docs etc and so on, so you don't get to end of process and find you do not have the two original major parts as the, for example, engine has been replaced etc and so on.
- Create a spreadsheet of potential costs. Was shocked when doing mine. Anticipated man maths costs were way out. Don't forget things like transport and BIVA test.
Good luck with your project.
SDB660 said:
Am going down a similar route myself and going for kit converted route as explained here. Aiming to get an age related number.
Tips so far:
- Check all numbers match reg docs etc and so on, so you don't get to end of process and find you do not have the two original major parts as the, for example, engine has been replaced etc and so on.
- Create a spreadsheet of potential costs. Was shocked when doing mine. Anticipated man maths costs were way out. Don't forget things like transport and BIVA test.
Good luck with your project.
After researching I think this is the route I will go, as for potential costs.. its going to be a long term hands busy project. It may take a long time, it might not be worth the money it costs but i am adding two invaluable benefits (Keeping out of trouble, driving my 'dream car')Tips so far:
- Check all numbers match reg docs etc and so on, so you don't get to end of process and find you do not have the two original major parts as the, for example, engine has been replaced etc and so on.
- Create a spreadsheet of potential costs. Was shocked when doing mine. Anticipated man maths costs were way out. Don't forget things like transport and BIVA test.
Good luck with your project.
As far as i am concerned, it the chassis is to original design, the body is correct, the heart is a ferrari engine and its wearing 2 turbos its going to be the same thing. And it wont have a £1m price tag.
PAUL500 said:
The base 348 chassis from which the GTB and GTS are then derived have no a or b pillars, or a windscreen surround so you are good to go if you remove them from your donor chassis, as they are not structural :-)
This might be the route I go, but the kit converted rules say I can modify the original chassis and get age related plate. I might consider killing a mondial QV/TEdited by PAUL500 on Wednesday 12th July 20:48
SJK said:
PAUL500 said:
The base 348 chassis from which the GTB and GTS are then derived have no a or b pillars, or a windscreen surround so you are good to go if you remove them from your donor chassis, as they are not structural :-)
This might be the route I go, but the kit converted rules say I can modify the original chassis and get age related plate. I might consider killing a mondial QV/TEdited by PAUL500 on Wednesday 12th July 20:48
The DVLA site is wrong and is missing an "un" as in unmodified chassis. Any mucking around with a chassis is a Q.
Do not know if this helps, but you can buy a new Aston DB4/5/6 chassis and make variants thereof such as Zagato or Volante from a firm in Midlands I believe. Cost is about £20K. Also believe sans supperleggera tubes.
Could you buy a Mondial/Ferrari chassis brand new? Get your two major components and then get an age related plate. BIVA required.
Could you buy a Mondial/Ferrari chassis brand new? Get your two major components and then get an age related plate. BIVA required.
I am doing the same, building a car from scratch and going for a brand new plate based on the engine being fully reconditioned (which it will be and all components will be brand new with chassis and body made by me).
What you need to do is keep receipts for the tube, resins, materials etc, and take a lot of pictures of you actually making the parts. You thin include them as evidence for the build.
The absolute most significant thing you are going to need in your folder is a 'certificate of newness' for the car. Without this you are going to struggle so you need to consider how you will get this. I have a genuine LTD company that is building my 'kit' and I will legitimately get the certificate from this company. I do know of others that obtained the certificate in different ways.
What you need to do is keep receipts for the tube, resins, materials etc, and take a lot of pictures of you actually making the parts. You thin include them as evidence for the build.
The absolute most significant thing you are going to need in your folder is a 'certificate of newness' for the car. Without this you are going to struggle so you need to consider how you will get this. I have a genuine LTD company that is building my 'kit' and I will legitimately get the certificate from this company. I do know of others that obtained the certificate in different ways.
In relation to the link, you are correct, that chassis will be classed as modified, but in relation to the 348 as you can see from the illustration then the actual structural part of the chassis is as shown, so as long as you take it back to the point, but not beyond then it is still unmodified, remove any more than shown in the pic and it does then become modified.
We are getting into a circular thread scenario here, but please check this out https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The DVLA site is wrong and is missing an "un" as in unmodified chassis. Any mucking around with a chassis is a Q.
SDB660 said:
SJK said:
PAUL500 said:
The base 348 chassis from which the GTB and GTS are then derived have no a or b pillars, or a windscreen surround so you are good to go if you remove them from your donor chassis, as they are not structural :-)
This might be the route I go, but the kit converted rules say I can modify the original chassis and get age related plate. I might consider killing a mondial QV/TEdited by PAUL500 on Wednesday 12th July 20:48
The DVLA site is wrong and is missing an "un" as in unmodified chassis. Any mucking around with a chassis is a Q.
andygtt said:
The absolute most significant thing you are going to need in your folder is a 'certificate of newness' for the car. Without this you are going to struggle so you need to consider how you will get this. I have a genuine LTD company that is building my 'kit' and I will legitimately get the certificate from this company. I do know of others that obtained the certificate in different ways.
How can you get a certificate of newness if you build it yourself? If a company builds it for you doesn't it then go outside or Basic IVA because it's a professional build?I may be we incorrect, but can't a Q plate be replaced with a personal plate as long as the personal plate is pre suffix (and of course pre- prefix) ie pre 1962?
Some very confusing information on here, some of which is just plain wrong.
Firstly the chassis that is being talked about cutting down - if you cut ANY parts off a chassis, even things like outriggers & the tail end of chassis rails which are non-structural then you will need IVA (some Range Rover conversions fall foul of this). However if the A B C pillars are bolted on, then you can remove them without needing IVA, that would simply become a body conversion & should retain the original no. plate, just needs re-registering with DVSA as whatever it becomes (give it a model name)
Surely a "certificate of newness" is only required if you are building a kit from a manufacturer? unless things have changed a lot in recent years then if self building if you can prove the tubes were purchased new & show pictures of the frame being built which matches the frame submitted for test then you have proof of it being new - certainly has always been the way for self built locost 7 types.
You don't need to have an original chassis for age related, all of my Furore's with the exception of the very first (which was a total bitza built from a modified Formula Ford chassis) have age related plates - you need 8 points, a new chassis gets you 5 points, I believe you get 1 for gearbox & 2 for engine, so if you have engine & box from a single donor then you should get age related from that donor year, but obviously check with VOSA.
Our cars are bike engined, so can't go the above route, but you get 1 point for each "axle", steering, brakes etc., as long as all of that comes from one donor then again you should get age related (& no one can prove where it comes from anyway as none of it has any ID other than the engine, which makes the rules complete nonsense, but then you're dealing with government departments)
Firstly the chassis that is being talked about cutting down - if you cut ANY parts off a chassis, even things like outriggers & the tail end of chassis rails which are non-structural then you will need IVA (some Range Rover conversions fall foul of this). However if the A B C pillars are bolted on, then you can remove them without needing IVA, that would simply become a body conversion & should retain the original no. plate, just needs re-registering with DVSA as whatever it becomes (give it a model name)
Surely a "certificate of newness" is only required if you are building a kit from a manufacturer? unless things have changed a lot in recent years then if self building if you can prove the tubes were purchased new & show pictures of the frame being built which matches the frame submitted for test then you have proof of it being new - certainly has always been the way for self built locost 7 types.
You don't need to have an original chassis for age related, all of my Furore's with the exception of the very first (which was a total bitza built from a modified Formula Ford chassis) have age related plates - you need 8 points, a new chassis gets you 5 points, I believe you get 1 for gearbox & 2 for engine, so if you have engine & box from a single donor then you should get age related from that donor year, but obviously check with VOSA.
Our cars are bike engined, so can't go the above route, but you get 1 point for each "axle", steering, brakes etc., as long as all of that comes from one donor then again you should get age related (& no one can prove where it comes from anyway as none of it has any ID other than the engine, which makes the rules complete nonsense, but then you're dealing with government departments)
Russ, when you could actually buy a new base spec 348 chassis it came as per my pic, therefore anything else is an addition and can subsequently also be removed, whatever method it was later fixed to the car.
In your example such as the Range Rover the additional non structural metal came as part of the new item from the factory so removing it modified the chassis.
Semantics I know but in the case of the Ferrari then the subsequent non structural metal is additional to the chassis not part of it.
In your example such as the Range Rover the additional non structural metal came as part of the new item from the factory so removing it modified the chassis.
Semantics I know but in the case of the Ferrari then the subsequent non structural metal is additional to the chassis not part of it.
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