Discussion
harrysnoble said:
hi everyone! well im a new member to this and ive some bad news! ive crashed my gto3 in to a ditch! and im not sure how i did! it was raining tho,i went to overtake someone and the car just seemed to go sideways into the ditch! i must have been doing 40 when i went to overtake! anyone else had anything like this happen?
...bummer, much damage or can't you tell yet?!
Sorry to hear that Harry. As the other Graham said, it's not unusual with high powered rear wheel drive cars at this time of year.
In fact I was testing the 3R for PH a couple of weeks back and had a quick run in a GTO first. Had both of them go sideways when accelerating along straight roads because of the slippery conditions, so it's not just you. Seems you just got unlucky when you did it.
In fact I was testing the 3R for PH a couple of weeks back and had a quick run in a GTO first. Had both of them go sideways when accelerating along straight roads because of the slippery conditions, so it's not just you. Seems you just got unlucky when you did it.
Did exactly the same thing at the end of November in me Tuscan! Went to overtake and used maybe 2mm more throttle pedal than I should have done...
....oversteer...hit car that i'm overtaking...spin oversteer...backwards into a wall at about 55mph
Broken ribs, broken pelvis, dislocated shoulder, ruptured spleen that was removed ten days later!!!
Car is no longer
Well not quite true, I have a windscreen wiper!!
I've done all sorts of wet track days and driving tuition days, in the end like the Graham's say, it's a powerful rear wheel drive car with no electronic traction control. All you have to do is spin the rear wheels at the wrong time in the wrong place and.....
Lets be careful out there
xxx sp
....oversteer...hit car that i'm overtaking...spin oversteer...backwards into a wall at about 55mph
Broken ribs, broken pelvis, dislocated shoulder, ruptured spleen that was removed ten days later!!!
Car is no longer
Well not quite true, I have a windscreen wiper!! I've done all sorts of wet track days and driving tuition days, in the end like the Graham's say, it's a powerful rear wheel drive car with no electronic traction control. All you have to do is spin the rear wheels at the wrong time in the wrong place and.....
Lets be careful out there
xxx sp
oh sorry to hear that! dont take this the wrong way but im glad to know that its not just me sliding my car off the road! i was thinking maybe it was the car or i'd done something really wrong but i look back now and can see how it all went wrong! oh and i only just missed the car i was overtaking and was even closer to the car on the otherside of the road!
Yes of course Harry, it comes under the general heading of Sh''T -happens. This is all fine and dandy until that Sh''T happens to yourself (or ourselves!) Then it hurts, either in the wallet or dangley bits or both!!!!
I thought I had powerful rear wheel driving 'under control' so to speak. Thought I'd started to write the book on it
I've spun the Tuscan enough on Airfield days to know where the limits of traction in the wet are.
Also, I had a very new set of Toyos on it.
.... but I didn't count on one thing - THE HUMAN TRACTION CONTROL SYSTEM or H.T.C. for short
I found during my sort of training period in a Chimaera and the Tuscan that we have a thing called a RIGHT FOOT.
With the right modifications, the 'Right Foot' can be attached to our Brains via a 'leg' and 'torso'. The mod requires some careful tweaking though to enable the Brain to use the 'Right Foot' with caution
- otherwise it tends to push too hard at the wrong time!!!!
Well this is what I found out to my peril anyway!!!!
LOL
Simon
I thought I had powerful rear wheel driving 'under control' so to speak. Thought I'd started to write the book on it
I've spun the Tuscan enough on Airfield days to know where the limits of traction in the wet are.
Also, I had a very new set of Toyos on it.
.... but I didn't count on one thing - THE HUMAN TRACTION CONTROL SYSTEM or H.T.C. for short
I found during my sort of training period in a Chimaera and the Tuscan that we have a thing called a RIGHT FOOT.
With the right modifications, the 'Right Foot' can be attached to our Brains via a 'leg' and 'torso'. The mod requires some careful tweaking though to enable the Brain to use the 'Right Foot' with caution
- otherwise it tends to push too hard at the wrong time!!!!
Well this is what I found out to my peril anyway!!!!
LOL
Simon
Very sorry to hear about your doubly bad luck Simon. As you say, shit happens, and life has clearly dropped a massive turd on you with that one. 
Think the thing about the road as opposed to tracks/airfields is that you can also get mud, diesel and such crap deposited on the road, which when combined with water results in a far more slippery surface than you'd get with water alone. Just ask any biker who's suddenly found themselves sliding along the road on their arse...
So rest assured Harry that you're far from being the only person to be caught out by roads than can be trecherous and unpredictable around this time of year.
Sometimes it all comes down to being unlucky enough to hit a particularly slippy patch at just the wrong time - says the man who once backed a Cobra replica into a wall after hitting a patch of mud while cornering at 60mph along a dark country road...
Think the thing about the road as opposed to tracks/airfields is that you can also get mud, diesel and such crap deposited on the road, which when combined with water results in a far more slippery surface than you'd get with water alone. Just ask any biker who's suddenly found themselves sliding along the road on their arse...
So rest assured Harry that you're far from being the only person to be caught out by roads than can be trecherous and unpredictable around this time of year.
Sometimes it all comes down to being unlucky enough to hit a particularly slippy patch at just the wrong time - says the man who once backed a Cobra replica into a wall after hitting a patch of mud while cornering at 60mph along a dark country road...
Yes, that little switch! It's probably a knee jerk reaction an all, but currently I think i'd happily see a little switch fitted to these hairy chest rear wheel drive cars.
Funny, because I was all for not having such Porsche type frills, but weighing up the alternatives of flicking a wee switch if it's wet (big red warning light of course) and actually having my car here (oh...and no pain) and having no switch and having nothing but a windscreen wiper and a piece of fibreglass about 3" x 3" painted blue --- uuuummm!!!
I quite like the idea of the little switch
sp
Funny, because I was all for not having such Porsche type frills, but weighing up the alternatives of flicking a wee switch if it's wet (big red warning light of course) and actually having my car here (oh...and no pain) and having no switch and having nothing but a windscreen wiper and a piece of fibreglass about 3" x 3" painted blue --- uuuummm!!!
I quite like the idea of the little switch
sp
Although it's a real shame that you had the accident, the most important thing to remember is that you walked away from it.
There is the insurance issues to think about, or private funding for the repairs, courtesy cars, compensation etc. But all of these things are money - nothing else. Remember that there are some things money can't buy (no this is not a Mastercard advert). If you had lost a limb your relentless thoughts on the accident would be 100 times worse!
I know you have a bit of a mess on your hands, and your pride and joy is in a bit of a state (I remember going through it all in my accident), and this will sound like a terrible cliché, but things could have been a whole lot worse.
I'm really pleased to hear you're ok.
Laurence
There is the insurance issues to think about, or private funding for the repairs, courtesy cars, compensation etc. But all of these things are money - nothing else. Remember that there are some things money can't buy (no this is not a Mastercard advert). If you had lost a limb your relentless thoughts on the accident would be 100 times worse!
I know you have a bit of a mess on your hands, and your pride and joy is in a bit of a state (I remember going through it all in my accident), and this will sound like a terrible cliché, but things could have been a whole lot worse.
I'm really pleased to hear you're ok.
Laurence
21TVR said:
Yes, that little switch! It's probably a knee jerk reaction an all, but currently I think i'd happily see a little switch fitted to these hairy chest rear wheel drive cars.
Funny, because I was all for not having such Porsche type frills, but weighing up the alternatives of flicking a wee switch if it's wet (big red warning light of course) and actually having my car here (oh...and no pain) and having no switch and having nothing but a windscreen wiper and a piece of fibreglass about 3" x 3" painted blue --- uuuummm!!!
I quite like the idea of the little switch
sp
I humbly submit that you'd have likely found the limits of grip sometime at a higher speed (and thus potentially even more damaging to your health), then. The switch will help you out - up to the point where basic laws of physics apply and you're off without a warning.
The, you have to think of the consequences of fitting traction control. On it's own, I reckon it makes the car more dangerous than before. For starters, you have no ABS, but being equipped with TC you can step on the throttle and the car sorts itself out for you all the same. Then you have to brake, and discover that things are more slippery than you thought they were, the hard way. Same goes for steering. Which indicates it needs to be the whole hog (ABS, traction and stability control) or nothing. And frankly, the more likely a car is to be driven on the outside envelope of its capabilities, the less comfortable I am with them being fitted with electronic driver aids. The last thing you want is the car to make you feel totally confident up to 99.99% of its capabilities, just before sending you into the scenery at speeds you'd never have reached in the first place without driver aids.
I'm afraid that there are no easy answers on this one. I've been lucky enough to return all the high powered cars I've driven as a car hack in one piece, but I'm sure that was 80% luck and 20% my natural timidness.
I do think however that all of us need to see past the machismo of 'rwd proper drivers' cars, fwd boring blah blah blah' and accept when driving an ultra-powerful rwd sportscar (or a 'bike for that matter), on all but dry and smooth roads you basically have to revert to 'survival mode' - keep speeds well down, don't overtake if you don't strictly have to, et cetera.
If you need to make good progress in bad weather conditions, it's good to have something fast, secure and fwd (or a benign awd affair) in the garage next to your rwd missile. Horses, courses and stuff...
More to the point, let's be careful out there.
Eric
>> Edited by 900T-R on Wednesday 31st December 21:29
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