Chaps,need feedback today(Sunday)
Discussion
Noble fellas,
Need to make a decision on a Noble prior to the storm of calls to dealers that will no doubt take place after Top Gear tonight. Please can you answer a few questions about ownership that I won't know about without buying.
Reliability - can you depend upon the car. Could I, say, drive it to the South of France without worrying.
Running costs. What's a service. Brakes? A new Clutch?
The Marque - Do people know what they are? It sounds like a stupid question, but (And please, I don't mean to offend with this question do people look at them as a glorified kit car, or do they recognise the marque. I drive a Porsche at the moment, and people know what a porsche is and what they cost. A GTO 3R fully spec'd is now about 58k. That's easily 911 money. No, I don't want to drive a porsche (and I know about reliability build quality etc, but my porsche is boring). Do any ex Porsche noble owners have opinions? Do women think they're kit cars. Do people realise you've spend silly money on them, or do they think you're built it yourself. Do people come up and ask you bizarre but nice questions at petrol stations?
Anybody put high mileage on one. DO they take it. Will the Duratec engine hold up.
If I'm not going to take it on track days, do I need the racing sump.
Can you hear the stereo if you're not thrashing the life out of the engine.
If the turbo's haven't cut in (I assume below 3k) is the car much quieter at speed? Could I do a journey in it and not feel knackered at the end of it.
Look, I know it's not a terrible practical car, and no I don't want really to buy another car. And if it's terribly impractical, It doesn't mean I want to stick with a porsche. I don't. There's just too many of them about and I love the individuality of having a car made in such small numbers. I just wondered what the trade off was.
Sorry for the questions. It's just 60k is a lot of money to me, and I just want to make sure I've found out what the dealers cant really tell me before I do.
Thanks for any feedback you can give.
Marcos
Need to make a decision on a Noble prior to the storm of calls to dealers that will no doubt take place after Top Gear tonight. Please can you answer a few questions about ownership that I won't know about without buying.
Reliability - can you depend upon the car. Could I, say, drive it to the South of France without worrying.
Running costs. What's a service. Brakes? A new Clutch?
The Marque - Do people know what they are? It sounds like a stupid question, but (And please, I don't mean to offend with this question do people look at them as a glorified kit car, or do they recognise the marque. I drive a Porsche at the moment, and people know what a porsche is and what they cost. A GTO 3R fully spec'd is now about 58k. That's easily 911 money. No, I don't want to drive a porsche (and I know about reliability build quality etc, but my porsche is boring). Do any ex Porsche noble owners have opinions? Do women think they're kit cars. Do people realise you've spend silly money on them, or do they think you're built it yourself. Do people come up and ask you bizarre but nice questions at petrol stations?
Anybody put high mileage on one. DO they take it. Will the Duratec engine hold up.
If I'm not going to take it on track days, do I need the racing sump.
Can you hear the stereo if you're not thrashing the life out of the engine.
If the turbo's haven't cut in (I assume below 3k) is the car much quieter at speed? Could I do a journey in it and not feel knackered at the end of it.
Look, I know it's not a terrible practical car, and no I don't want really to buy another car. And if it's terribly impractical, It doesn't mean I want to stick with a porsche. I don't. There's just too many of them about and I love the individuality of having a car made in such small numbers. I just wondered what the trade off was.
Sorry for the questions. It's just 60k is a lot of money to me, and I just want to make sure I've found out what the dealers cant really tell me before I do.
Thanks for any feedback you can give.
Marcos
about 5050 between 'what is it mate' and "f'ing hell, I haven't seen one of these on the road before, can I have a sit in it please".
I've had people walk into my works car park who don't even work there just to ask how I'm finding it. With Top gear tonight as well the recognition of the marque is going to go up.
Best one so far is 3 young lads knowcking on my door to ask if it was a maclaren F1
I've had people walk into my works car park who don't even work there just to ask how I'm finding it. With Top gear tonight as well the recognition of the marque is going to go up.
Best one so far is 3 young lads knowcking on my door to ask if it was a maclaren F1
Marcos,
Having come from 911 ownership (I have had 3 Porsches, my last being a 993), and being on order for a new 3R, I know where you are coming from, as I agonised for ages over giving up the Porsche badge. But you know what? Since I sold it, I have not missed it for a single minute. It has occured to me that the car really was quite dull, the prestige of the badge was what made me keep the car for so long.
So that left the question of what I wanted in its place. For the money I could think of no other car than the Noble that would give me what I wanted. New M3?? If you want to blend in with the thousands of others that are on the road. 993 Twin Turbo? I thought about this seriously, but could not justify spending £50k odd on a car that was 4+ years old with 40k miles on the clock. New 996 Carrera - not on your life, I couldnt think of a more boring car if I tried. Soooooo dull.
I would love a SL55 or 996TT, but alas do not posess the requisite £100k to make the purchase! So as sad as it may sound, what else can you buy for £56k? Not an awful lot that you would really want!! (or at least that I would want anyway).
And dont talk to me about Porsche reliability - sure they are pretty good, but they do have their fair share of problems:
Faulty wiring harnesses (sub-standard insulation used)
Dodgy clutch slave cylinders
Dodgy clutch pedal mechanism (had to be updated)
Door straps that fail and require huge amounts of welding work to put right.
Cam cover gaskets that fail.
Poor materials used in valve guides
Poor A/C
So they do have their fair share of problems as well.
Having come from 911 ownership (I have had 3 Porsches, my last being a 993), and being on order for a new 3R, I know where you are coming from, as I agonised for ages over giving up the Porsche badge. But you know what? Since I sold it, I have not missed it for a single minute. It has occured to me that the car really was quite dull, the prestige of the badge was what made me keep the car for so long.
So that left the question of what I wanted in its place. For the money I could think of no other car than the Noble that would give me what I wanted. New M3?? If you want to blend in with the thousands of others that are on the road. 993 Twin Turbo? I thought about this seriously, but could not justify spending £50k odd on a car that was 4+ years old with 40k miles on the clock. New 996 Carrera - not on your life, I couldnt think of a more boring car if I tried. Soooooo dull.
I would love a SL55 or 996TT, but alas do not posess the requisite £100k to make the purchase! So as sad as it may sound, what else can you buy for £56k? Not an awful lot that you would really want!! (or at least that I would want anyway).
And dont talk to me about Porsche reliability - sure they are pretty good, but they do have their fair share of problems:
Faulty wiring harnesses (sub-standard insulation used)
Dodgy clutch slave cylinders
Dodgy clutch pedal mechanism (had to be updated)
Door straps that fail and require huge amounts of welding work to put right.
Cam cover gaskets that fail.
Poor materials used in valve guides
Poor A/C
So they do have their fair share of problems as well.
Marcos, prior to owning the M12 I had an SL500 (new style) and a 996 C2. I thought they were both pretty special cars, but compared to the Noble they just got ignored (good/bad?). The M12 is a real headturner, I even had some bloke hanging out of his Audi TT going around Huntingdon ring road 'cos he wanted to know what it was 
. Overall, I've never had any negative comments about the car, it's usually "nice car mate" and suchlike. Only 1 person has ever asked if it's a kit car but he's American so I let it go as most of them don't know what a real car is!
I mainly keep the Noble for the weekends and after 2 months of ownership I'd still describe driving it as intoxicating (that feeling lasted about 4 weeks with the Merc - very sophisticated but too boring to be a purely weekend "fun" car, and about 2 months with the 996 (but that was my first proper sports/GT car)).
As far as build quality etc goes, I'd say it's up there with the best of the mass manufactured vehicles (my SL500 had to be re-called for a majorish suspension fault). The interior is very well finished and solidly put together (no rattles, squeeks etc) and from the quality of the shutlines etc you'd be hard pressed to guess they only made 200 a year.
For reliability, I've covered nearly 2K miles so far and have had no show-stoppers (couple of niggles with the air-con and other very minor stuff which was all sorted at the 1st service). The air-con is very effective, even in the really hot weather we've been having recently and the engine cooling system works consistently even when sat in long queues (eg. getting into and out of Goodwood last weekend). Overall, I've found my car totally dependable and wouldn't have a problem being confident about taking it on a driving holiday.
Re running costs, MPG if you're not constantly thrashing it is low 20's, I seem to average c. 200 miles on about 43 litres of Optimax (tank size is 50L but with the needle on empty there's usually about 7L left in the tank). My 1K service was £90, after that the 6K services cost about £500 (so I've been told). Can't help with the price of brakes/clutch etc but as most items are "off the shelf" from one source or another I wouldn't imagine they're too expensive.
If you're not planning on tracking the car then you won't need the baffled sump, IMO you'd be better spending the money on a 6 sp box.
Re stereo etc, the Sony unit they put in is a good one. There are only 2 speakers fitted as standard which means you've got to turn up the volume a bit at speed but it's more than audible when pootling.
Noise in the cabin is fairly constant but not excessive, a throaty roar which hardens as you nail the throttle (re the turbos you only hear the wastegates/dump valves - which is a great noise) and I would say is one of the great pleasures of Noble ownership. I've done 150 mile journeys without stopping and felt perfectly fresh/relaxed at the end.
For me the biggest problem of owning a Noble is the question of what to replace it with (not that I'm planning to short or long term)! Concensus of opinion suggests the 996 Turbo X50, which at over £100K is nearly twice the price and probably still isn't as exciting because it's not as "raw" as the Noble.
For me it is without shadow of a doubt the best car I have ever owned, I just wish I'd bought one sooner rather than wasting my money on the depreciation I lost on the 996 and SL!
HTH
. Overall, I've never had any negative comments about the car, it's usually "nice car mate" and suchlike. Only 1 person has ever asked if it's a kit car but he's American so I let it go as most of them don't know what a real car is! I mainly keep the Noble for the weekends and after 2 months of ownership I'd still describe driving it as intoxicating (that feeling lasted about 4 weeks with the Merc - very sophisticated but too boring to be a purely weekend "fun" car, and about 2 months with the 996 (but that was my first proper sports/GT car)).
As far as build quality etc goes, I'd say it's up there with the best of the mass manufactured vehicles (my SL500 had to be re-called for a majorish suspension fault). The interior is very well finished and solidly put together (no rattles, squeeks etc) and from the quality of the shutlines etc you'd be hard pressed to guess they only made 200 a year.
For reliability, I've covered nearly 2K miles so far and have had no show-stoppers (couple of niggles with the air-con and other very minor stuff which was all sorted at the 1st service). The air-con is very effective, even in the really hot weather we've been having recently and the engine cooling system works consistently even when sat in long queues (eg. getting into and out of Goodwood last weekend). Overall, I've found my car totally dependable and wouldn't have a problem being confident about taking it on a driving holiday.
Re running costs, MPG if you're not constantly thrashing it is low 20's, I seem to average c. 200 miles on about 43 litres of Optimax (tank size is 50L but with the needle on empty there's usually about 7L left in the tank). My 1K service was £90, after that the 6K services cost about £500 (so I've been told). Can't help with the price of brakes/clutch etc but as most items are "off the shelf" from one source or another I wouldn't imagine they're too expensive.
If you're not planning on tracking the car then you won't need the baffled sump, IMO you'd be better spending the money on a 6 sp box.
Re stereo etc, the Sony unit they put in is a good one. There are only 2 speakers fitted as standard which means you've got to turn up the volume a bit at speed but it's more than audible when pootling.
Noise in the cabin is fairly constant but not excessive, a throaty roar which hardens as you nail the throttle (re the turbos you only hear the wastegates/dump valves - which is a great noise) and I would say is one of the great pleasures of Noble ownership. I've done 150 mile journeys without stopping and felt perfectly fresh/relaxed at the end.
For me the biggest problem of owning a Noble is the question of what to replace it with (not that I'm planning to short or long term)! Concensus of opinion suggests the 996 Turbo X50, which at over £100K is nearly twice the price and probably still isn't as exciting because it's not as "raw" as the Noble.
For me it is without shadow of a doubt the best car I have ever owned, I just wish I'd bought one sooner rather than wasting my money on the depreciation I lost on the 996 and SL!
HTH
Just like ek993 I went from a 993 to a Noble - though I've sold it now 
The only single aspect the Porker has over the Noble is luggage space. The Noble has naff all. Joust managed to get his seats reconfigured to slide back further, allowing more behind the seats, but it's a tight squeeze. The 911s have rear 'seats' and a front boot. The Noble can't compete with this.
However the Noble exudes a sense of quality and decent build - there isn't the Lotus-style 'this is going to break down' feeling. The 'luxury' bits (i.e. air con) are Ford and work properly (unlike both 993s I owned, where the air con needed charging twice a year and was still lame). The ergonomics are spot on - seats are comfortable and controls are ideal.
Unless you're comparing the Noble to the more extreme versions of the 911, the fuel consumption of the Noble will be noticeable - I didn't ever get much above 15 mpg, but hell I enjoyed the car!!!
Only downside to me (though a big upside to others) is the sheer amount of attention you'll get. Wherever you go, someone will be staring or pointing at you. I don't have the ego or need the attention (I like to go quickly and unobtrusively) but you'll find that even if people don't know what it is, they still give you MUCH more respect than in a Porsche. What I mean by this relates to non-enthusiasts who see Porsches as status symbols.... whereas virtually no-one would stop to let me out of a turning in my 911, plenty more would for the Noble. It arouses positive attention wherever it goes - I never had anything other than positive comments.
It's also pretty fast. Buy one
The only single aspect the Porker has over the Noble is luggage space. The Noble has naff all. Joust managed to get his seats reconfigured to slide back further, allowing more behind the seats, but it's a tight squeeze. The 911s have rear 'seats' and a front boot. The Noble can't compete with this.
However the Noble exudes a sense of quality and decent build - there isn't the Lotus-style 'this is going to break down' feeling. The 'luxury' bits (i.e. air con) are Ford and work properly (unlike both 993s I owned, where the air con needed charging twice a year and was still lame). The ergonomics are spot on - seats are comfortable and controls are ideal.
Unless you're comparing the Noble to the more extreme versions of the 911, the fuel consumption of the Noble will be noticeable - I didn't ever get much above 15 mpg, but hell I enjoyed the car!!!
Only downside to me (though a big upside to others) is the sheer amount of attention you'll get. Wherever you go, someone will be staring or pointing at you. I don't have the ego or need the attention (I like to go quickly and unobtrusively) but you'll find that even if people don't know what it is, they still give you MUCH more respect than in a Porsche. What I mean by this relates to non-enthusiasts who see Porsches as status symbols.... whereas virtually no-one would stop to let me out of a turning in my 911, plenty more would for the Noble. It arouses positive attention wherever it goes - I never had anything other than positive comments.
It's also pretty fast. Buy one
ek993 said:
lx, why did you sell the Noble? Have you / are you replacing it with anything?
dirty cash, I'm afraid - been out of work since March so the most expensive toy needed to go. Big shame, I loved the M12.
Still got my track car, so no worries for track days. But I got my first proper speeding problem in the Noble - as per the thread in Speeding & the Law - so a potential summons and big points/fine may make it a wise move to keep away from serious performance for a while.
The Noble is ridiculously quick and, alas, I have absolutely no self-control.
LX
OMG! I had a court summons as well in the Noble! My first ever brush with the law in any car. Was zapped doing 62 in a 40 near Maidenhead last June, only two weeks into owning the car, went to court, 4 points and £150 fine. Maybe the car is destined to give all it's owners some points on their licence, lol!
Did you sell the car back to Mole Valley?
OMG! I had a court summons as well in the Noble! My first ever brush with the law in any car. Was zapped doing 62 in a 40 near Maidenhead last June, only two weeks into owning the car, went to court, 4 points and £150 fine. Maybe the car is destined to give all it's owners some points on their licence, lol!
Did you sell the car back to Mole Valley?
EVOTIM said:
LX
OMG! I had a court summons as well in the Noble! My first ever brush with the law in any car. Was zapped doing 62 in a 40 near Maidenhead last June, only two weeks into owning the car, went to court, 4 points and £150 fine. Maybe the car is destined to give all it's owners some points on their licence, lol!
Did you sell the car back to Mole Valley?
Sell to MV?? After your experience?? Got to be joking, surely?
Luckily there's a small garage near me who seem to sell a lot of specialist cars, so they did a good deal on sale or return. Sold within one day....
Likewise it's my first speeding incident - never even been Gatso'd. Haven't got the summons yet but it'll be for 92 in a 60 (A36, big wide empty road). Any good tips on what to say to the magistrate??
As to that Noble being a speeding ticket jinx, I reckon ALL Nobles are... they should only sell them to people with some self control
lx993 said:
LX
OMG! I had a court summons as well in the Noble! My first ever brush with the law in any car. Was zapped doing 62 in a 40 near Maidenhead last June, only two weeks into owning the car, went to court, 4 points and £150 fine. Maybe the car is destined to give all it's owners some points on their licence, lol!
Did you sell the car back to Mole Valley?
Sell to MV?? After your experience?? Got to be joking, surely?
Luckily there's a small garage near me who seem to sell a lot of specialist cars, so they did a good deal on sale or return. Sold within one day....
Likewise it's my first speeding incident - never even been Gatso'd. Haven't got the summons yet but it'll be for 92 in a 60 (A36, big wide empty road). Any good tips on what to say to the magistrate??
As to that Noble being a speeding ticket jinx, I reckon ALL Nobles are... they should only sell them to people with some self control
I must agree this was one of the reason for mine being sold to make way for the SL
I got done for 80 in a 40 - this is worse than it sounds though as the 40 in question was a nice stretch of deserted dual carriageway near city airport in the Docklands. £500 fine and 28 day ban ;( I had a brief but with a name like Mr Alibi (seriously!) i should have known not to bother. He just p1ssed off the judge and spanked me.
Just to show the even hand of the law. The guy before me on his 15th offence of driving without tax or insurance got a slapped wrist and £50 fine................go figure
Just to show the even hand of the law. The guy before me on his 15th offence of driving without tax or insurance got a slapped wrist and £50 fine................go figure
105mph on the M25 at half past midnight. Policeman was as pleasant as can be expected about it (considering I was doing 105), he said he was not going to lecture me, but that I would have to go to court. And to his credit, he did state in court that there was no other traffic on the motorway, and the weather conditions were good at the time, which is probably why I got off with a £600 fine and 6 points rather than a ban. You may say a 28 day ban is a lot better as you get it over and done with without having points on your license, but once you tell an insurer you have been banned, you severly restrict yourself in who will provide a quote in the first place.
amg merc said:
[quote=lx993]
[quote=EVOTIM]LX
Sell to MV?? After your experience?? Got to be joking, surely?
... what's wrong with MV - mine's on order from them and I'm curious?!
Nothing wrong with buying from MV whatsoever. But if you want to sell a car back to them, they are renowned for offering VERY low values... I didn't fancy losing 8-9 grand in a few months
lx993 said:
[quote=lx993]
[quote=EVOTIM]LX
Sell to MV?? After your experience?? Got to be joking, surely?
... what's wrong with MV - mine's on order from them and I'm curious?!
Nothing wrong with buying from MV whatsoever. But if you want to sell a car back to them, they are renowned for offering VERY low values... I didn't fancy losing 8-9 grand in a few months
I concur with that they offered me mid to late 30's for my Noble when it was 4 months old and only had 3k on the clock - I told them where to get off - plus they were very rude about it - shame really 'cause the the service guy's are really good - their loss not mine they poteintaily had a total of 4 orders through my self and my brother - but they messed up...
guysh said:
amg merc said:
[quote=lx993]
[quote=EVOTIM]LX
Sell to MV?? After your experience?? Got to be joking, surely?
... what's wrong with MV - mine's on order from them and I'm curious?!
Nothing wrong with buying from MV whatsoever. But if you want to sell a car back to them, they are renowned for offering VERY low values... I didn't fancy losing 8-9 grand in a few months
I concur with that they offered me mid to late 30's for my Noble when it was 4 months old and only had 3k on the clock - I told them where to get off - plus they were very rude about it - shame really 'cause the the service guy's are really good - their loss not mine they poteintaily had a total of 4 orders through my self and my brother - but they messed up...
... I kind of figured MV would approach used prices like this (even though they would have already made a margin from the same customer (sounds like being mugged twice!!!)) - I hope they're "listening" as sales of marques like the Noble only really get going through our promotion and enthusiasm!!!
near city airport in the Docklands. £500 fine and 28 day ban ;( I had a brief but with a name like Mr Alibi (seriously!) i should have known not to bother. He just p1ssed off the judge and spanked me.
..Mr. Alibi - LOL!!! I once met a plastic surgeon called Dr. Saad (as in Marquis de...) - but am I starting a new thread here!!!
..Mr. Alibi - LOL!!! I once met a plastic surgeon called Dr. Saad (as in Marquis de...) - but am I starting a new thread here!!!
guysh said:
amg merc said:
[quote=lx993]
[quote=EVOTIM]LX
Sell to MV?? After your experience?? Got to be joking, surely?
... what's wrong with MV - mine's on order from them and I'm curious?!
Nothing wrong with buying from MV whatsoever. But if you want to sell a car back to them, they are renowned for offering VERY low values... I didn't fancy losing 8-9 grand in a few months
I concur with that they offered me mid to late 30's for my Noble when it was 4 months old and only had 3k on the clock - I told them where to get off - plus they were very rude about it - shame really 'cause the the service guy's are really good - their loss not mine they poteintaily had a total of 4 orders through my self and my brother - but they messed up...
Same here Guy. They offered me a crap trade in on my 10 month old Boxster 'S' against a black GTO3 (your brothers!) saying that I wouldn't get anything more selling privately. When I refused, the pushy salesman got all funny about it which really p*ssed me off. I ended up selling the Boxster privately for the money I wanted and ordered my 3R at HR Owen instead.
Funny 
Were you in a hurry to get rid of it Tim? I thought Mole Valley gave you 750 over the odds to help you clear your finance, and you couldn't find a better trade in deal elsewhere, despite a lot of trying?????
Last time I spoke to Charles he managed to sell the car just one day after paying you for it - so it seems MV can shift them rather fast as well.
FYI
Charles has offered to sell any of my cars "sale or return" when doing a trade in against another car.
Basically he offered to sell it with me just covering the sales persons commission and a small gesture for the "shop space" , or I can just do a "swap and chop" - the latter obviously giving me less money.
So - when I come to swap the GTO for the GTC it means that if I can stand being without the GTO for as long as it takes to sell I then get full sticker price for it minus MV's direct costs - not sure I could have had a better offer???!!!???
Obviously if I am in a hurry then I'll just swap it in, but that is no different than any dealer for any car - it was no different when I went to chop in one of my cars for the X5 - I ended up selling that privately because the offer was so c**p!
J
Were you in a hurry to get rid of it Tim? I thought Mole Valley gave you 750 over the odds to help you clear your finance, and you couldn't find a better trade in deal elsewhere, despite a lot of trying????? Last time I spoke to Charles he managed to sell the car just one day after paying you for it - so it seems MV can shift them rather fast as well.
FYI
Charles has offered to sell any of my cars "sale or return" when doing a trade in against another car.
Basically he offered to sell it with me just covering the sales persons commission and a small gesture for the "shop space" , or I can just do a "swap and chop" - the latter obviously giving me less money.
So - when I come to swap the GTO for the GTC it means that if I can stand being without the GTO for as long as it takes to sell I then get full sticker price for it minus MV's direct costs - not sure I could have had a better offer???!!!???
Obviously if I am in a hurry then I'll just swap it in, but that is no different than any dealer for any car - it was no different when I went to chop in one of my cars for the X5 - I ended up selling that privately because the offer was so c**p!
J
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