Ground Clearance
Discussion
Hi All,
I have a bit of a problem with ground clearance. I have a bit of a steep slope to contend with in order to get my car into my garage which my old Lotus Elise with sports suspension managed with ease if I approached it right.
Trouble is, no matter how I try with the M12 I still ground out that black front strip across the bottom of the nose.
This black strip must stick out 2" and be about 1" thick and I'm sure that if it wasn't there that I wouldn't have a problem. It looks like it is removable, has anyone else had a look at this yet?
Phil
I have a bit of a problem with ground clearance. I have a bit of a steep slope to contend with in order to get my car into my garage which my old Lotus Elise with sports suspension managed with ease if I approached it right.
Trouble is, no matter how I try with the M12 I still ground out that black front strip across the bottom of the nose.
This black strip must stick out 2" and be about 1" thick and I'm sure that if it wasn't there that I wouldn't have a problem. It looks like it is removable, has anyone else had a look at this yet?
Phil
You could take it of but I would not recomend it - the High speed handling will be shot to pieces - suffice to say when you try and go round a bend at high speed they will be less downforce on the front so poteintailly you end up going straight on! - I would just get a plank of wood the right size to be left outside your garage...
edited to say too many spelling mistakes to correct but you get the idea!
>> Edited by guysh on Tuesday 28th January 12:18
edited to say too many spelling mistakes to correct but you get the idea!
>> Edited by guysh on Tuesday 28th January 12:18
AHA! I had the same problem.
My solution, 2 x sheets of 5 ply plywood, 1 2x2 length of wood. Put the two pieces of ply one over the other - overlapping about half - infront of the garage. Then put the piece of 2x2 where the two cross over to "smooth out" the ramp. Works a treat.
I'll take a picture if you want to see.
J
My solution, 2 x sheets of 5 ply plywood, 1 2x2 length of wood. Put the two pieces of ply one over the other - overlapping about half - infront of the garage. Then put the piece of 2x2 where the two cross over to "smooth out" the ramp. Works a treat.
I'll take a picture if you want to see.
J
Try coming off at an angle - works well in T1's NCP car park @ Heathrow, but means you have to reverse back up the ramp at the bottom to get a decent angle. Looks a bit silly when you are doing it, and takes time - but you don't hit anything!
neilmurphy said: Same problem here on normal roads e.g speed ramps and bloody NCP car park ramps!!!!
If you imagine the forces at 100+ mph, rubber would just bend. The current one seems quite sturdy, and just seems to make more noise than damage due to it's construction....
The black strip should be really made out of some form of rubber to make the impact a bit easier to take and also easier to replace!!
Just an idea......!
As for speed humps - again take them at an angle
J
>> Edited by joust on Tuesday 28th January 15:12
guysh said: You could take it of but I would not recomend it - the High speed handling will be shot to pieces - suffice to say when you try and go round a bend at high speed they will be less downforce on the front so poteintailly you end up going straight on!
Do you know this for sure, I mean have you tried it or are you just guessing?
The black strip in question would appear to have the aerodynamic properties of a brick and does not appear to be shaped to generate downforce or at least none of any benefit at a speed where you might be cornering - even at speed.
I asked John Hammond at Noble that if it was removable would they advise for or against it - he said "The strip is removable and sounds like a good idea."
So there you have it!
Phil
Do you know this for sure, I mean have you tried it or are you just guessing?
The black strip in question would appear to have the aerodynamic properties of a brick and does not appear to be shaped to generate downforce or at least none of any benefit at a speed where you might be cornering - even at speed.
Phil
Phil,
I'm no expert and certainly not in aerodynamics but it is referred to as a splitter which perhaps gives us a clue. This type of arrangement is not uncommon on low ground clearance GTs designed for racing and track work. I should imagine that there would be turbulence generated at the front of the car and the splitter is there to help direct air more cleanly over and equally importantly under in order to assist the aerodynamics designed into the car.
I wouldn't contemplate removing it unless I knew what I was doing and for that I would recommend a chat with Lee Noble. He is a very approachable guy and of course is the M12's designer so who better? In the meantime the other suggestions about trying to smooth out the slope are probably your best option.
Martin.
martvr said
I wouldn't contemplate removing it unless I knew what I was doing and for that I would recommend a chat with Lee Noble. He is a very approachable guy and of course is the M12's designer so who better? In the meantime the other suggestions about trying to smooth out the slope are probably your best option.
Martin.
So are you suggesting that I shouldn't listen to any of the Noble Moy Automotive factory staff, other than Lee himself?
Just curious on what your take is, based on what I've been told by someone at Noble already.
Phil
Just offering a suggested way forward that would be easy to follow. I've tried to point you in the direction of the concerns that I would have if I were to be contemplating such a change. I don't know whether they are right or not, just my take on the subject. It's along the same lines as guysh was suggesting though.
As an afterthought, I think it is made easily removable because it is quite vulnerable to damage so I would prefer to call it replaceable. I've scraped mine gently countless times and although it makes a nerve jangling noise it doesn't seem to suffer too badly. Give it a front-on smack though and I don't suppose it would like it too much.
I've had several very pleasant conversations with John about various subjects but when it has come to technical discussions he has passed me on to Lee (or Tony if Lee is busy). Did I read somewhere that he had taken over Alan Wallace's role as Sales Manager? Not sure.
Your call, I really don't mind.
Martin
As an afterthought, I think it is made easily removable because it is quite vulnerable to damage so I would prefer to call it replaceable. I've scraped mine gently countless times and although it makes a nerve jangling noise it doesn't seem to suffer too badly. Give it a front-on smack though and I don't suppose it would like it too much.
I've had several very pleasant conversations with John about various subjects but when it has come to technical discussions he has passed me on to Lee (or Tony if Lee is busy). Did I read somewhere that he had taken over Alan Wallace's role as Sales Manager? Not sure.
Your call, I really don't mind.
Martin
martvr said:Did I read somewhere that he had taken over Alan Wallace's role as Sales Manager? Not sure.
It would appear so. I spoke with Martin Beddow (Noble) at the "Autosport Show" the other week and I asked if Alan would be attending the show. He told me that the last time he spoke to Alan he was unemployed and John Hammond had been retained to sort out the mess.
Nuff said.
Phil
Fair enough - I don't actually know whether it makes a aero dynamic difference -
But firstly are you will to drive it around a bend at 60 plus then take of the splitter an do the same bend - i'm not!
Plus it does kind of protect the rest of the body work - if you remove it and then scrap the painted body work it's going to cost you alot more to sort out!
But firstly are you will to drive it around a bend at 60 plus then take of the splitter an do the same bend - i'm not!
Plus it does kind of protect the rest of the body work - if you remove it and then scrap the painted body work it's going to cost you alot more to sort out!
Rainman said:
It would appear so. I spoke with Martin Beddow (Noble) at the "Autosport Show" the other week and I asked if Alan would be attending the show. He told me that the last time he spoke to Alan he was unemployed and John Hammond had been retained to sort out the mess.
Funnily enough, I saw Alan at the Autosport show. He was on his mobile though, so I didn't get a chance to talk to him...
Jim
joust said: AHA! I had the same problem.
My solution, 2 x sheets of 5 ply plywood, 1 2x2 length of wood. Put the two pieces of ply one over the other - overlapping about half - infront of the garage. Then put the piece of 2x2 where the two cross over to "smooth out" the ramp. Works a treat.
I'll take a picture if you want to see.
J
I have a driveway at a 10 degree slope so need to work out whether the Noble will ground out either the front (at turn-in to the drive) or center of the car (over the crest at top into flat garage). Trigonometry tells me it *should* clear both, but I'd appreciate real-world experience.
What angle is your drive at? Steeper than 10 degrees?
Thanks
UPDATE:
I've been back in touch with John Hammond at Noble regarding the removal of the front splitter and asked what the aerodynamic significance of removing it would be. He's replied :-
Sounds fair enough to me. I think I'll be removing it for every day use and possibly install it for those high days, holidays and track days.
Phil
I've been back in touch with John Hammond at Noble regarding the removal of the front splitter and asked what the aerodynamic significance of removing it would be. He's replied :-
Dear Phil
I've spoken to Lee Noble about this (as I
always do on any technical matters) and he
says that the black strip (splitter) does
have aerodynamic significance but only
above 85/90 mph.
Therefore, if you are just going to use the
car on the road in this country below the
legal speed limit everything will be fine.
You would be more likely to notice a
difference if you used your car for say a
track day, when you would be using the full
power of the vehicle.
Originally you asked about removing it to
facilitate access to your garage, which is
why I answered in the way I did. It really
depends how you intend to use the car and
only you will know this.
Regards
John Hammond
Sales Administrator
Sounds fair enough to me. I think I'll be removing it for every day use and possibly install it for those high days, holidays and track days.
Phil
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