Rear Uprights cracked through
Discussion
Both my rear uprights on the GTO3R are badly cracked where the lower ball joint attaches. ( beyond repair )
I do not want to replace them with the same system as it will inevitably fail again.
Has anybody got any info on an upgrade....I have heard there is a bushed system but will this mean changing anything other than the bottom wishbone and is it a simple replacement or is it more involved.
I would be grateful for any info from anybody that has had this problem and can shed some light on the matter.
Than you , Luke
I do not want to replace them with the same system as it will inevitably fail again.
Has anybody got any info on an upgrade....I have heard there is a bushed system but will this mean changing anything other than the bottom wishbone and is it a simple replacement or is it more involved.
I would be grateful for any info from anybody that has had this problem and can shed some light on the matter.
Than you , Luke
One of mine was clearly cracked at the factory as the upright hole was smaller than the bolt that was forced through, crack was huge when I stumbled across it doing a week bearing, had never been spotted by all the noble garages that had works on it previously.... It was shocking as it had ended up double cracking and was mm away from catastrophic failure. I sorted it around 6 years ago and the original crack was large enough to fit a screwdriver through to touch the bolt. Fortunately at the time the car had never been on track.
The other upright I found last year and had simply developed a hairline crack over time.
The other upright I found last year and had simply developed a hairline crack over time.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=153...
been there, I had repaired at an engineering workshop, I can provide details if you want.
been there, I had repaired at an engineering workshop, I can provide details if you want.
Just to follow on.....the car has never been tracked and i am afraid to say the fault would appear to be more common than you may think.......considering how many cars have been produced and how many people have had issues maybe we should all be getting our uprights checked as Andy suggests......driven in a cracked condition it could lead to something catastrophic happening.
Maybe these photos will help clarify the situation.
Luke
Maybe these photos will help clarify the situation.
Luke
Edited by lukebryan on Monday 18th April 07:15
That looks identical to the first crack I found, major crack down the middle as the bolt was actually larger than the hole machined in the upright, must have cracked when installed IMO.
The a hairline to the side nearly extending full length which when it finished meant the bolt would fall out, scary.
I actually had the upright properly repaired and welded up. I know welding aneals the alloy so it's weaker, however it's miles stronger than when it had a crack in it that had been there since car was new and not actually failed, it's a very large mounting point.
The other side that I discovered recently was only a small hairline in the same place.
The a hairline to the side nearly extending full length which when it finished meant the bolt would fall out, scary.
I actually had the upright properly repaired and welded up. I know welding aneals the alloy so it's weaker, however it's miles stronger than when it had a crack in it that had been there since car was new and not actually failed, it's a very large mounting point.
The other side that I discovered recently was only a small hairline in the same place.
It's interesting - in the middle picture, it looks like the bushing that's on the ball joint right next to the rubber boot has split - that bushing should be there to adapt between the taper of the ball joint and the straight sided hole in the upright. If it weren't split, it should stop the taper from acting as a wedge and splitting the upright.
In the US, only the very early M12s had this ball joint - all the later M12s and all the M400s had a bushing-with-through-bolt setup between the a-arm and the upright. Is this the case in the UK, too?
In the US, only the very early M12s had this ball joint - all the later M12s and all the M400s had a bushing-with-through-bolt setup between the a-arm and the upright. Is this the case in the UK, too?
TuxMan said:
GTO600 said:
I don't think this is very common & l would suggest it's caused by a loose balljoint or possibly over tightened rather than a design issue & is preventable with proper maintanance.
im with Kev on this one , over tightened or done up with a buzz gun . There are apparently 2 designs of this setup as the original one caused cracking of the uprights (ball joint old, bush new), the above and mine are the original ball joint design
.... time for an upgrade me thinks.Should point out that the spacer on mine was not cracked on either side
Best check which exact setup you have and monitor accordingly.
I think that the ball joint system was designed with practicality in mind as it allows for tracking adjustment without putting any stress on any suspension parts whereas the bushed system ( which in my opinion is not an upgrade but merely a solution to uprights that cracked ) will put stress on the bush which while absorbing the angle change as you adjust toe in or toe out will increase the potential of binding up and not allow a smooth flowing suspension........maybe the answer to upgrading would be to rose joint it or update and modify the ball jointed system.
Edited by lukebryan on Tuesday 19th April 20:17
doug_porsche said:
And I thought I was done with the suspension for spring.
Note to self: check for cracks
Also check wheels for cracks too... Note to self: check for cracks
I'm going with that the above crack was likely due to overtightening. Whether it was overtightening from the factory installing the tie-rod, or subsequent maintenance.
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