1000+ bhp. When and who will it be?
Discussion
There are some big power cars out there these days producing up to 2000bhp for street legal cars. I just can't imagine that sort of power when I find a 350bhp Noble kind of fast!
So who is going to build the first 1000bhp M12 and is it in reality, pointless? I assume it would mean a different engine, if only to keep it reasonably reliable? I would also assume it wouldn't be transverse? And, as with all these cars with enormous power, are they only ever going to be straight line missiles? (which of course isn't what Noble stands for).
So who is going to build the first 1000bhp M12 and is it in reality, pointless? I assume it would mean a different engine, if only to keep it reasonably reliable? I would also assume it wouldn't be transverse? And, as with all these cars with enormous power, are they only ever going to be straight line missiles? (which of course isn't what Noble stands for).
Someone did 1200bhp from the V6 in the states with a large amount of Nos..... as far as I can tell it disappeared almost immediately after it surfaced suggesting the motor didn't last long but then I don't think the block can handle that kind of power.
I am currently doing some trick changes to my engine that will probably see more power, but I am not doing it to chase more power... certainly I will never be chasing 1000bhp.
I am currently doing some trick changes to my engine that will probably see more power, but I am not doing it to chase more power... certainly I will never be chasing 1000bhp.
chuntington101 said:
You need to find a gearbox that can take 750lbs ft of torque first! Or develop a version of the V6 that can rev to 10k!
Technically not true, I rev mine to 8000rpm and already have over 600ftlb, if I was able to increase the boost with rpm to hold torque till redline i would see mid 900's bhp... I used to do this before i changed some of the internals and ran MBE (ran 1.7bar at 7500rpm) but my latest package has increased power quite a bit and extra boost up top didn't increase power, it ran 1.4 bar on the dyno and the turbo could deliver 2 bar.and Steve, this is NOT me talking myself into having a go.
andygtt said:
chuntington101 said:
You need to find a gearbox that can take 750lbs ft of torque first! Or develop a version of the V6 that can rev to 10k!
Technically not true, I rev mine to 8000rpm and already have over 600ftlb, if I was able to increase the boost with rpm to hold torque till redline i would see mid 900's bhp... I used to do this before i changed some of the internals and ran MBE (ran 1.7bar at 7500rpm) but my latest package has increased power quite a bit and extra boost up top didn't increase power, it ran 1.4 bar on the dyno and the turbo could deliver 2 bar.and Steve, this is NOT me talking myself into having a go.
Need to make sure you have enough turbo also. I know Lichfield use BW 6758 EFR turbos on their 3.8ltr motors.
wessexrfc said:
You would never be able to use that sort of power, what would be the point????
I'd argue otherwise.... mine is easy to drive fast and i have never used the traction control even with its 700+bhp even when driving fast in the wet (I only run high boost). Its all about having a decent package and engine management/map.bernhund said:
So realistically, would we be talking about a different engine & box? And if you lose the transverse box & go with something like a G50, would that mean extending the chassis to accommodate it?
Our box is as strong as a normal G50 so little point changing to one of those, I have a box that can take the power but its 8k and much heavier than ours.... realistically 8000rpm is the limit for our engines due to the valve train.As I say I think the block is going to be the issue with our engine!
Not keen on going longitude or V8 as i think it would negatively effect the handling, you have to remember that its centre of gravity of the weight as much as the weight itself that is taken into account when designing the suspension, putting a different engine in will mean you will probably need to change the geo of the suspension to compensate to retain the handling characteristics.
I don't think anyone will go for 1000bhp anytime soon lol
andygtt said:
bernhund said:
So realistically, would we be talking about a different engine & box? And if you lose the transverse box & go with something like a G50, would that mean extending the chassis to accommodate it?
Our box is as strong as a normal G50 so little point changing to one of those, I have a box that can take the power but its 8k and much heavier than ours.... realistically 8000rpm is the limit for our engines due to the valve train.As I say I think the block is going to be the issue with our engine!
Not keen on going longitude or V8 as i think it would negatively effect the handling, you have to remember that its centre of gravity of the weight as much as the weight itself that is taken into account when designing the suspension, putting a different engine in will mean you will probably need to change the geo of the suspension to compensate to retain the handling characteristics.
I don't think anyone will go for 1000bhp anytime soon lol
I'm with Paul on this absolutely no point in going any further with the power , both Graham and myself have gone faster on track with less power !! It's all pub talk and in reality is impossible to use especially if you want to set a fast lap time . V-max is about the only time you would need more and then you run out of legs . The std heads with not Rev over 8 as the cam followers jump out !!
andygtt said:
Not keen on going longitude or V8 as i think it would negatively effect the handling, you have to remember that its centre of gravity of the weight as much as the weight itself that is taken into account when designing the suspension, putting a different engine in will mean you will probably need to change the geo of the suspension to compensate to retain the handling characteristics.
Things you can tune the car to utilize properly. For me, I lost 100lbs/45kg in curb weight with my engine swap, improved my cross-weights from 48% to 50%. Also moved more weight forward. I do have to get some testing done on how it changed the handling characteristics, but I'd imagine it'll be much more stable on corner entry, which equates to more speed in the corner.
Basically, you can compensate for these changes with suspension tuning, just takes time/effort.
TuxMan said:
I'm with Paul on this absolutely no point in going any further with the power , both Graham and myself have gone faster on track with less power !! It's all pub talk and in reality is impossible to use especially if you want to set a fast lap time . V-max is about the only time you would need more and then you run out of legs . The std heads with not Rev over 8 as the cam followers jump out !!
Never heard a racer say less power please because it's slower now, unless the car is undrivable.I might not be a racer, but I CAN use all my power on road and track so it's not just pub talk.
;););)Just to add my 2 Penny's worth,
Power and torque does not make a car undrivable, your right foot and skill determine how fast u are on track.
Owning a 310bhp Caterham weighing 500kg and a 700bhp Noble weighing 1080kg The more power I have, has improved the lap times consistently.
Torque gets u out the corners quicker.
HP gets you down the straights faster.
All controlled by ur right foot
Power and torque does not make a car undrivable, your right foot and skill determine how fast u are on track.
Owning a 310bhp Caterham weighing 500kg and a 700bhp Noble weighing 1080kg The more power I have, has improved the lap times consistently.
Torque gets u out the corners quicker.
HP gets you down the straights faster.
All controlled by ur right foot
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