Who’s buying all the used 1.2 puretech engine cars?
Discussion
Was dropping of at Peugeot dealers, mechanic tells me they currently had 7 that’s right SEVEN 1.2 puretechs all needing new engines for one of 2 reasons
- drinking oil due to piston wear
- cam belt snapped
All over 3 years old and out of warranty although one was covered by the used warranty.
Which made me think, the 1.2 puretech is widely used, it was only 2023 models where you could guarantee it has a chain instead of the belt (some models changed over to the chain version of the engine in 2022 but there where still 22 and 72 plates in the UK with the belt set up); who is buying all these vehicles with a known engine failure design?
Especially buying them out of manufacture warranty?
Lovely drive the puretech, it’s a shame like the Ford eco boost it’s made of cheese
- drinking oil due to piston wear
- cam belt snapped
All over 3 years old and out of warranty although one was covered by the used warranty.
Which made me think, the 1.2 puretech is widely used, it was only 2023 models where you could guarantee it has a chain instead of the belt (some models changed over to the chain version of the engine in 2022 but there where still 22 and 72 plates in the UK with the belt set up); who is buying all these vehicles with a known engine failure design?
Especially buying them out of manufacture warranty?
Lovely drive the puretech, it’s a shame like the Ford eco boost it’s made of cheese
Most manufacturers have "known issues" with engines... but not everybody knows or cares. Googling issues on a car is a bit like Googling your health symptoms, you end up down and rabbit hole convinced of the worst. Not every 1.2 Puretech will fail so people probably tend to just get on with it and deal with it if it happens. Can't live live nor base car purchases on a worst case scenario or nobody would buy any cars.
I have friends who are either oblivious or simply don't care and there are times when I wish I could be a bit more like that. I think knowing or being around people who do know can be very good, but can also be quite restrictive as there's always somebody out there ready to tell you X, Y or Z will likely go wrong and you really shouldn't buy X, Y or Z either.
My friend, not a single care... he recently bought an older Audi and I went "Oh, are they not bad for X, Y or Z" and he said "And? If it breaks, I'll fix it" and he likes the car, it's what he wanted and so he bought it with minimal regard for what ifs. He very bluntly pointed out that women are prone to breast cancer but that didn't put him off marrying his wife 20 years ago.
The man has a point!
My friend, not a single care... he recently bought an older Audi and I went "Oh, are they not bad for X, Y or Z" and he said "And? If it breaks, I'll fix it" and he likes the car, it's what he wanted and so he bought it with minimal regard for what ifs. He very bluntly pointed out that women are prone to breast cancer but that didn't put him off marrying his wife 20 years ago.
The man has a point!
Regular punters have no idea about what a good/bad engine is.
My mate bought a car that has known issues (1.5 PSA diesel) and it promptly shat itself on the A1, needs a whole new engine and the warranty company, dealer and manufacturer want nothing to do with it.
He does 40k PA so you'd think he would have done some research or speak to mates who know...
My mate bought a car that has known issues (1.5 PSA diesel) and it promptly shat itself on the A1, needs a whole new engine and the warranty company, dealer and manufacturer want nothing to do with it.
He does 40k PA so you'd think he would have done some research or speak to mates who know...
I have one (well wife does) 1.2 peugeot 308 (2014) and to be honest it’s been a great little car. bought it 5yrs ago, and didn’t know there was a ‘known issue’ with the wet timing belt.
this summer, car started stuttering, threw and engine warning light. turns out it was the timing belt disintegrating and blocked the oil pick up pipe. took it to a local garage, who stripped it down, cleaned it out, new timing belt, plus service for £650. back on the road and all good.
with hindsight would’ve got the belt done at 55k, was a bit of a stressful week when it went wrong, but not the end of the world
this summer, car started stuttering, threw and engine warning light. turns out it was the timing belt disintegrating and blocked the oil pick up pipe. took it to a local garage, who stripped it down, cleaned it out, new timing belt, plus service for £650. back on the road and all good.
with hindsight would’ve got the belt done at 55k, was a bit of a stressful week when it went wrong, but not the end of the world
I think you have to remember that the internet is full of horror stories. No one posts up "my car didn't blow up today". 
How many 1.2 Puretech engines within a reasonable radius of that dealership are merrily running around having not expired?
I have owned two RX8s with the infamously fragile wankel engine, a Porsche Boxster with the dreaded IMS and RMS problems, and my girlfriend currently drives around propelled by an Ingenium diesel engine. All were relative bargains because of their reputations. If the internet is to be believed, the combined force of their failures should have ripped open a fresh black hole over my driveway! Full disclosure ... I got burned on the RX8s. Everything else has been perfectly reliable. You win some, you lose some.
Maybe I'm just a glass-half-full guy, but when people get worked up about a 10% failure rate, my brain immediately goes "so a 9 in 10 chance of getting a good car at a bargain price".
Most people are ignorant of these reputations. Some people who aren't ignorant chose to take an informed risk. The few who are both informed and risk adverse avoid them. So to answer your question, it's either people ignorant of their reputation, or those who are aware and willing to take an informed risk.
How many 1.2 Puretech engines within a reasonable radius of that dealership are merrily running around having not expired?
I have owned two RX8s with the infamously fragile wankel engine, a Porsche Boxster with the dreaded IMS and RMS problems, and my girlfriend currently drives around propelled by an Ingenium diesel engine. All were relative bargains because of their reputations. If the internet is to be believed, the combined force of their failures should have ripped open a fresh black hole over my driveway!
Full disclosure ... I got burned on the RX8s. Everything else has been perfectly reliable. You win some, you lose some.Maybe I'm just a glass-half-full guy, but when people get worked up about a 10% failure rate, my brain immediately goes "so a 9 in 10 chance of getting a good car at a bargain price".
Most people are ignorant of these reputations. Some people who aren't ignorant chose to take an informed risk. The few who are both informed and risk adverse avoid them. So to answer your question, it's either people ignorant of their reputation, or those who are aware and willing to take an informed risk.
Davie said:
Most manufacturers have "known issues" with engines... but not everybody knows or cares. Googling issues on a car is a bit like Googling your health symptoms, you end up down and rabbit hole convinced of the worst.
That's a good analogy. As my current car was by some distance the most expensive I've bought I took it upon myself to do a fair bit of research. According to the internet, amongst other things I'd chew through tyres every 12,000 miles (so roughly every 8/9 months), would struggle to get above 35mpg, would be buying locking mechanisms and window regulators every other week, any suspension components would cost a fortune, any spares at all would cost a fortune, it would drink almost as much oil as it did diesel, the handling would see me slewing off into ditches on a regular basis and the gearbox would s
t itself soon after 100k miles. The reason I bought it anyway was that every other car I considered was apparently no better in the round. As it turns out none of that has happened so I can only conclude that A) you really do get a doom-laden view of the world from the internet, and B) a lot of such info comes from people that are stupid and can't drive for toffee. So the next time I spend even more on a car I doubt I'll bother doing any such research, I'll just get the one I like. Rotary Potato said:
I think you have to remember that the internet is full of horror stories. No one posts up "my car didn't blow up today".
How many 1.2 Puretech engines within a reasonable radius of that dealership are merrily running around having not expired?
I have owned two RX8s with the infamously fragile wankel engine, a Porsche Boxster with the dreaded IMS and RMS problems, and my girlfriend currently drives around propelled by an Ingenium diesel engine. All were relative bargains because of their reputations. If the internet is to be believed, the combined force of their failures should have ripped open a fresh black hole over my driveway! Full disclosure ... I got burned on the RX8s. Everything else has been perfectly reliable. You win some, you lose some.
Maybe I'm just a glass-half-full guy, but when people get worked up about a 10% failure rate, my brain immediately goes "so a 9 in 10 chance of getting a good car at a bargain price".
Most people are ignorant of these reputations. Some people who aren't ignorant chose to take an informed risk. The few who are both informed and risk adverse avoid them. So to answer your question, it's either people ignorant of their reputation, or those who are aware and willing to take an informed risk.
Humans are terrible at assessing risk, it's a flaw in our evolution.How many 1.2 Puretech engines within a reasonable radius of that dealership are merrily running around having not expired?
I have owned two RX8s with the infamously fragile wankel engine, a Porsche Boxster with the dreaded IMS and RMS problems, and my girlfriend currently drives around propelled by an Ingenium diesel engine. All were relative bargains because of their reputations. If the internet is to be believed, the combined force of their failures should have ripped open a fresh black hole over my driveway!
Full disclosure ... I got burned on the RX8s. Everything else has been perfectly reliable. You win some, you lose some.Maybe I'm just a glass-half-full guy, but when people get worked up about a 10% failure rate, my brain immediately goes "so a 9 in 10 chance of getting a good car at a bargain price".
Most people are ignorant of these reputations. Some people who aren't ignorant chose to take an informed risk. The few who are both informed and risk adverse avoid them. So to answer your question, it's either people ignorant of their reputation, or those who are aware and willing to take an informed risk.
I would imagine some of these faults are much less than 1/10, probably more like 1/00, or even 1/500. If you look at the tables of the most reliable cars and brands, there isn't that much statistical deviation between the most reliable and least, but people behave like it's night and day.
Davie said:
.. but not everybody knows or cares.
Indeed. My mate bought a Ford Ecosport with the wetbelt 1.0 engine and had no idea what I was talking about when I was telling him to make sure he kept on top of the servicing and keeping an eye on the age/mileage of the belt.I suspect 99% of buyers of these sorts of cars would buy whatever the most economical engine was. If you offered them a wetbelt engine that did 45mpg versus a bulletproof engine that did 40mpg they'd pick the former.
Truckosaurus said:
I suspect 99% of buyers of these sorts of cars would buy whatever the most economical engine was. If you offered them a wetbelt engine that did 45mpg versus a bulletproof engine that did 40mpg they'd pick the former.
many would choose the car that has apple car play or whatever the latest gadget is , and never heard of oil changes or top ups let alone proper oil changes on the dot with proper oil , drive it until the low pressure light comes on seems the norm Truckosaurus said:
Indeed. My mate bought a Ford Ecosport with the wetbelt 1.0 engine and had no idea what I was talking about when I was telling him to make sure he kept on top of the servicing and keeping an eye on the age/mileage of the belt.
I suspect 99% of buyers of these sorts of cars would buy whatever the most economical engine was. If you offered them a wetbelt engine that did 45mpg versus a bulletproof engine that did 40mpg they'd pick the former.
the ecoboom problem isn't even reported widely on sites such an honest john, which tend to quite good with highlighting serious issues. It's not even mentioned for the focus. Makes you wonder how much of it is nonsense internet hysteria.I suspect 99% of buyers of these sorts of cars would buy whatever the most economical engine was. If you offered them a wetbelt engine that did 45mpg versus a bulletproof engine that did 40mpg they'd pick the former.
https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/ford/focus/2014/
Or they are getting a lot of cash from Ford to keep it quiet, which is likely too.
The “Purecrap” engine has been a disaster, costing Peugeot/Citroen millions.
The belt deteriorates, debris gets into the oil pump pick up and causes low oil pressure and possible engine damage.
The belt must be replaced every 50K, ( Peugeot say 100K which is asking for trouble )
It’s essential that the correct grade of oil is used.
Any sign of a degraded belt have the sump removed and cleaned out.
The belt deteriorates, debris gets into the oil pump pick up and causes low oil pressure and possible engine damage.
The belt must be replaced every 50K, ( Peugeot say 100K which is asking for trouble )
It’s essential that the correct grade of oil is used.
Any sign of a degraded belt have the sump removed and cleaned out.
Truckosaurus said:
I suspect 99% of buyers of these sorts of cars would buy whatever the most economical engine was. If you offered them a wetbelt engine that did 45mpg versus a bulletproof engine that did 40mpg they'd pick the former.
Are these 3 cylinder engines even that good on fuel anyway? A few years ago we hired a Renault Capture and it had the 0.9 TCE engine fitted.I found it incredibly difficult to drive smoothly, no power to pull away and then impossible to change into second without feeling like a learner driver.
Also it was absolutely gutless, going up a slight incline on the motorway at 70 MPH, 3 up with my foot welded to the floor it was slowly losing speed.
It wasn't even that great on fuel, it averaged 40MPG for the week we had it.
And they feel rough compared to a 4 cylinder engine. I recently drove a brand new 24 Clio with the TCE engine and when I got back into my 13 year old shed I could not believe how quiet, smooth and powerful it felt in comparison.
Personally I cannot see why anyone would buy one.
A girl here at work had asked me about her car last week, A 3008 with this engine it was using a lof of oil and she said she wanted rid of it because she was worried, never even entered her head to google the issue. I had quick google and wow, lots of issues. Told her as much and she was horrified.
So she bought a new car, yep, a Peugeot 3008 with the 1.2 hyrbid engine.
So she bought a new car, yep, a Peugeot 3008 with the 1.2 hyrbid engine.
I don't know how long the Puretech issues have been known about, but my 1.5 BlueHDi had no known issues when I bought it, was dealer serviced it's whole life, and it just died at 5 yrs + 1 month due to what turns out to be another well known issue with a timing chain. Dealer and Peugeot don't care and want 9 grand for a new engine, all garages I know near me won't touch it with a bargepole.
I'm completely comfortable with previously unknown technical issues, that's life, but if Peugeot aren't advising customers of revised maintenance schedules for known issues that to me is not right.
I'm completely comfortable with previously unknown technical issues, that's life, but if Peugeot aren't advising customers of revised maintenance schedules for known issues that to me is not right.
fatandwheezing said:
I don't know how long the Puretech issues have been known about, but my 1.5 BlueHDi had no known issues when I bought it, was dealer serviced it's whole life, and it just died at 5 yrs + 1 month due to what turns out to be another well known issue with a timing chain. Dealer and Peugeot don't care and want 9 grand for a new engine, all garages I know near me won't touch it with a bargepole.
I'm completely comfortable with previously unknown technical issues, that's life, but if Peugeot aren't advising customers of revised maintenance schedules for known issues that to me is not right.
Same thing happened to my mate (same engine). Dealer, warranty company and DS wanted nothing to do with it.I'm completely comfortable with previously unknown technical issues, that's life, but if Peugeot aren't advising customers of revised maintenance schedules for known issues that to me is not right.
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