Comfortable/refined fun for £5k?

[decafbeermerchant]

Afternoon PHers

Just sold my 2011 Volvo S60 R-Design. It had been very faithful to me but I eventually got bored of it and wanted to try something a bit different. I've now got £5k to spend on a new daily driver and would like something sportier/more interesting/more fun than the Volvo.

Although I love saloons and coupés, I'd be perfectly happy driving a hatch, a liftback type thing or an estate. I definitely don't want a convertible - I'm autistic, so every time I've driven/been a passenger in a droptop I've found it pretty overstimulating and unpleasant.

Prefer petrol but diesel would probably be fine if it's older/pre-DPF (I only do 5k miles/year). Practicality isn't much of an issue and neither are running costs/insurance within reason. I'd like something modern enough to be safe and reasonably reliable; for that reason, a MK5 Golf GTI is probably the oldest I'd want design wise.

I do a 5-6 hour round trip on the motorway once a fortnight so ideally want something nice and comfortable with a decent turn of pace. Good ride quality would also be nice as although my Volvo was fine on the motorway, it got really crashy over bumps and potholes.

I can do a reasonable bit of maintenance myself - I'm expecting to have to do so in fact - but I'd like to avoid getting shafted if some big-ticket commonly failed item goes wrong and I can't fix it myself/have to pay loads for some obscure part. RX-8s need not apply.

Would love to hear your suggestions. Cheers

[CrippsCorner]

Test driven a few cars recently and I was impressed with the 208 GTi. Definitely more refined than the Fiesta ST but I don't need the sharpest drive these days, and the interior is a definite step up (material wise, but also CarPlay etc.)

My friend had the 308 GT Line which is absolutely great for size, and still pokey enough.

There's also the KIA C'eed GT Line which my wife had a couple of years ago, again they're very nice inside and a great design in my opinion.

Haven't really got any advice outside of hatches as they're my thing!

[eth2190]

Lexus GS450h for me. Hard to find a better combination of refinement, performance coupled with reasonable running costs at this price point.

[66HFM]

Octavia VRS, Seat Leon FR, Honda Civic Type S or R, Audi A3 Sportback

[Madness60]

Jag XF

[anonymous-user]

1980 SAAB 900 turbo

[samoht]

Surely this has BMW 3-series written all over it?

[decafbeermerchant]

samoht said:

Surely this has BMW 3-series written all over it?

This was was one of first thoughts - an E90 325i/330i. Anyone here have any experience with them? Reliability/common faults, parts prices, auto vs. manual?

[decafbeermerchant]

CrippsCorner said:

Test driven a few cars recently and I was impressed with the 208 GTi. Definitely more refined than the Fiesta ST but I don't need the sharpest drive these days, and the interior is a definite step up (material wise, but also CarPlay etc.)

My friend had the 308 GT Line which is absolutely great for size, and still pokey enough.

There's also the KIA C'eed GT Line which my wife had a couple of years ago, again they're very nice inside and a great design in my opinion.

Haven't really got any advice outside of hatches as they're my thing!

I'm not keen on the Peugeot stuff if I'm honest - too many horror stories out there about the Prince engine which just seems to be grossly underengineered. Shame as I think Peugeot hit their stride in terms of styling/interiors with this generation of cars.

The Kia sounds like a good shout. Which engine did your other half have? Any issues or things to be aware of?

[decafbeermerchant]

66HFM said:

Octavia VRS, Seat Leon FR, Honda Civic Type S or R, Audi A3 Sportback

Never really liked the Leon but the vRS seems like a solid option. A3 could also be decent if it's specced with the right engine (2.0T/V6).

Think the CTR is a bit shouty for me but the Type S looks like a better bet. Hopefully a less VTEC-y engine/smaller wheels would make it a more comfortable daily than the CTR.

[cerb4.5lee]

decafbeermerchant said:

samoht said:

Surely this has BMW 3-series written all over it?

This was was one of first thoughts - an E90 325i/330i. Anyone here have any experience with them? Reliability/common faults, parts prices, auto vs. manual?

I've had both an E90 330d auto and an E90 330i auto. They are great all round cars I think, although perhaps surprisingly I did much prefer the 330d though.

The auto didn't suit the 330i either for me, so even though they're quite difficult to get hold of, I'd definitely be looking for a manual I reckon. The N52 engine in the 330i loves to rev, so it deserves a manual gearbox I think.

[Mr Tidy]

I had a manual E91 325i for a year, but it just felt a bit lacking in mid-range performance.

So over 5 years ago I replaced it with a manual E90 330i and love it. It's a 3005 model so has the lovely N52 engine that as Lee says loves to rev right to the 7,000rpm red-line, but makes peak torque at 2,500rpm which is about 70mph in 6th so you don't need to keep down-changing if you get held up on Motorways.

It's surprisingly economical, on a decent run 35mpg is easily achievable. I don't commute so don't need to drive in rush hours or towns and it has averaged over 33mpg. Road Tax isn't too bad at £415 a year when some of its rivals at the time are in the £700+ bracket.

Main issues are oil leaks from oil filter and cam-cover housing gaskets. Mine has had both, but it's just perished gaskets which isn't surprising given its age. Other potential issue is the electric water pump dying leaving you stranded, so quite a few owners replace them to avoid that scenario knowing it won't need doing again. But genuine Pierburg ones are £250-300 so long as you don't buy from BMW.

The later N53 Direct Injection engine is a band cheaper for Road Tax, but often seems to suffer from fuel pump and injector problems which rapidly swallows any tax saving so I deliberately avoided them!

Mine is the less desirable SE model and cost me just under £3,500 in 2019 and there is nothing I'd rather have that wouldn't cost me thousands more. I'd love to have the M-Sport seats, but wouldn't want the stiffer M-Sport suspension or 18" wheels.

[ZX10R NIN]

2.5T Mondeo Ghia, a bit of a sleeper & a car that hits the brief exactly:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202406200...

2.0T Titanium X Sport, as above but make sure the gearbox has been serviced as per schedule:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202410215...

Focus ST-3:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202407031...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202410115...

3.2 A3:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202409093...

A5:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202408173...

TT:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202407191...

335i:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202409184...

325i:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202409264...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202406150...

[decafbeermerchant]

cerb4.5lee said:

The auto didn't suit the 330i either for me, so even though they're quite difficult to get hold of, I'd definitely be looking for a manual I reckon. The N52 engine in the 330i loves to rev, so it deserves a manual gearbox I think.

Mr Tidy said:

I had a manual E91 325i for a year, but it just felt a bit lacking in mid-range performance.

So over 5 years ago I replaced it with a manual E90 330i and love it. It's a 2005 model so has the lovely N52 engine that as Lee says loves to rev right to the 7,000rpm red-line, but makes peak torque at 2,500rpm which is about 70mph in 6th so you don't need to keep down-changing if you get held up on Motorways.

It's surprisingly economical, on a decent run 35mpg is easily achievable. I don't commute so don't need to drive in rush hours or towns and it has averaged over 33mpg. Road Tax isn't too bad at £415 a year when some of its rivals at the time are in the £700+ bracket.

Main issues are oil leaks from oil filter and cam-cover housing gaskets. Mine has had both, but it's just perished gaskets which isn't surprising given its age. Other potential issue is the electric water pump dying leaving you stranded, so quite a few owners replace them to avoid that scenario knowing it won't need doing again. But genuine Pierburg ones are £250-300 so long as you don't buy from BMW.

The later N53 Direct Injection engine is a band cheaper for Road Tax, but often seems to suffer from fuel pump and injector problems which rapidly swallows any tax saving so I deliberately avoided them!

I've had a short drive in my mate's 2005 E90 325i and I must be honest, I didn't find it lacking in performance though I can understand how it might feel a bit less sprightly than the 330i.

Either way it seems like there's a strong case for the E90, particularly if it's an 07 or earlier. Nice looking cars as well without being at all aggressive. What sort of money/effort would I be looking at to change the oil filter/cam cover gaskets if they failed?

[decafbeermerchant]

ZX10R NIN said:

2.5T Mondeo Ghia, a bit of a sleeper & a car that hits the brief exactly:

2.0T Titanium X Sport, as above but make sure the gearbox has been serviced as per schedule:

Focus ST-3:

3.2 A3:

A5:

TT:

335i:

325i:

Some good looking options there. The A5 and 3-Series look great as does that facelift Mondeo I have to say. How worried should I be that it's had a rebuilt engine?

The TT is also very tempting, I've always had a thing for that shape. Would probably want a 2.0 though, seems like they're pretty solid engines and offer strong performance for the money

[davek_964]

decafbeermerchant said:

Some good looking options there. The A5 and 3-Series look great as does that facelift Mondeo I have to say. How worried should I be that it's had a rebuilt engine?

The TT is also very tempting, I've always had a thing for that shape. Would probably want a 2.0 though, seems like they're pretty solid engines and offer strong performance for the money

My TT (2010) is one of the most uncomfortable cars I've owned. Just seems impossible to get the seat adjusted so that it's comfortable.

[Jiebo]

decafbeermerchant said:

This was was one of first thoughts - an E90 325i/330i. Anyone here have any experience with them? Reliability/common faults, parts prices, auto vs. manual?

It will over 15 years old at this point. All cars this age have the ability to need some serious money spend as things like suspensions, cooling systems, electronics, clutchs etc will be due a refresh. They will mostly be run on a shoe string with 4 different budget tyres and minimal servicing. BMW parts aren't cheap.

i'd only buy a car like this from an enthusiast who's actually got a stack of bills to show they haven't run it into the ground.

[CrippsCorner]

decafbeermerchant said:

CrippsCorner said:

Test driven a few cars recently and I was impressed with the 208 GTi. Definitely more refined than the Fiesta ST but I don't need the sharpest drive these days, and the interior is a definite step up (material wise, but also CarPlay etc.)

My friend had the 308 GT Line which is absolutely great for size, and still pokey enough.

There's also the KIA C'eed GT Line which my wife had a couple of years ago, again they're very nice inside and a great design in my opinion.

Haven't really got any advice outside of hatches as they're my thing!

I'm not keen on the Peugeot stuff if I'm honest - too many horror stories out there about the Prince engine which just seems to be grossly underengineered. Shame as I think Peugeot hit their stride in terms of styling/interiors with this generation of cars.

The Kia sounds like a good shout. Which engine did your other half have? Any issues or things to be aware of?

It was only the 1ltr turbo, all the GT Line's are. £30 tax or something was nice. Only issue we had in time of ownership was tyre pressure monitor failed. We only 'upgraded' because of another child, and needed a bigger car... but she wants one again one day! I said maybe the Sportage GT Line next

[Gastons_Revenge]

decafbeermerchant said:

The TT is also very tempting, I've always had a thing for that shape. Would probably want a 2.0 though, seems like they're pretty solid engines and offer strong performance for the money

I've had a 2008 manual 2.0 non-quattro for a year, and It's never been a car I've gone out of my way to properly take for an enjoyable drive. I'm looking at jumping to an E92 330i so that says it all!

I would personally avoid them, they're plagued with all of the 2000s VAG foibles like understeery suspension (unless you experiment with aftermarket setups), loads of creaks and rattles from perishing plastics, and poor electrical design. The ride is also weirdly firm on the 17in alloys- ironically I'd chosen them specifically for more comfort on the back roads I commute on.
The 2.0 engine is direct injection & cokes up like nobody's business, owners have recommended walnut blasting every 30k miles(!) as part of a regular maintenance schedule! It's a typical turbocharged small capacity engine- torquey enough and pulls decently. It is a bit characterless though, I vastly preferred the M54B30 3.0 on my old Z4.

Regarding the electrical issues- in the damp autumn/winter weather the drivers' door on mine intermittently won't unlock off the remote, it's touch and go until warmer weather hits; judging by the forums this is quite common with both doors and isn't easy to diagnose. The car's had the infamous brake light cluster grounding issue multiple times in its life according to previous garage receipts as well as in my ownership, until I installed bypass wires that avoid the ground pin (methods detailed in several places by owners on the TT forums).

At the £5k mark it's hard to find a petrol coupe in decent spec- automatic lighting package, xenons, cruise control etc seem to be quite rare compared to the E9X 3 Series. If I enjoyed the car enough I would retrofit them but fitting the key one I want (lighting package) involves tearing the windscreen out and fitting a new one with the auto lighting sensor installed on it! You also need access to the VCDS software to code most modules in if they're retrofitted.

They do look good though. I think they are more suited if you consider them as a mini grand tourer rather than an actual sports car, they aren't dynamically enjoyable enough for that. I bought mine as it was the most interesting locally available car when I had to get off a lease deal; if I did it again I would try to find a V6 Quattro one or a TTS, with an auto box and as many options as I could find.

Edited by Gastons_Revenge on Wednesday 30th October 12:50

edit: oh, and there's a lot of road and wind noise in the cabin for a coupe, I think NVH is worse than in my old Z4 and that car was 4 years older than my TT.

Edited by Gastons_Revenge on Wednesday 30th October 13:14

[decafbeermerchant]

davek_964 said:

My TT (2010) is one of the most uncomfortable cars I've owned. Just seems impossible to get the seat adjusted so that it's comfortable.

Gastons_Revenge said:

I've had a 2008 manual 2.0 non-quattro for a year, and It's never been a car I've gone out of my way to properly take for an enjoyable drive. I'm looking at jumping to an E92 330i so that says it all!

I would personally avoid them, they're plagued with all of the 2000s VAG foibles like understeery suspension (unless you experiment with aftermarket setups), loads of creaks and rattles from perishing plastics, and poor electrical design. The ride is also weirdly firm on the 17in alloys- ironically I'd chosen them specifically for more comfort on the back roads I commute on.
The 2.0 engine is direct injection & cokes up like nobody's business, owners have recommended walnut blasting every 30k miles(!) as part of a regular maintenance schedule! It's a typical turbocharged small capacity engine- torquey enough and pulls decently. It is a bit characterless though, I vastly preferred the M54B30 3.0 on my old Z4.

Regarding the electrical issues- in the damp autumn/winter weather the drivers' door on mine intermittently won't unlock off the remote, it's touch and go until warmer weather hits; judging by the forums this is quite common with both doors and isn't easy to diagnose. The car's had the infamous brake light cluster grounding issue multiple times in its life according to previous garage receipts as well as in my ownership, until I installed bypass wires that avoid the ground pin (methods detailed in several places by owners on the TT forums).

At the £5k mark it's hard to find a petrol coupe in decent spec- automatic lighting package, xenons, cruise control etc seem to be quite rare compared to the E9X 3 Series. If I enjoyed the car enough I would retrofit them but fitting the key one I want (lighting package) involves tearing the windscreen out and fitting a new one with the auto lighting sensor installed on it! You also need access to the VCDS software to code most modules in if they're retrofitted.

They do look good though. I think they are more suited if you consider them as a mini grand tourer rather than an actual sports car, they aren't dynamically enjoyable enough for that. I bought mine as it was the most interesting locally available car when I had to get off a lease deal; if I did it again I would try to find a V6 Quattro one or a TTS, with an auto box and as many options as I could find.

Edited by Gastons_Revenge on Wednesday 30th October 12:50

edit: oh, and there's a lot of road and wind noise in the cabin for a coupe, I think NVH is worse than in my old Z4 and that car was 4 years older than my TT.

Edited by Gastons_Revenge on Wednesday 30th October 13:14

Not quite the glowing review I was expecting. Shame as I've always liked the looks of these MK2s. Am I right in saying that the MK5 GTIs probably suffer from many of the same issues? Certainly the engine related ones?