It's not much fun any more

[SFTWend]

For some forty years I've bought and sold nearly all my cars privately. The exceptions have been for something more expensive, where I've bought from a specialist. I've enjoyed the hunt, meeting the owners, the haggle, and driving away knowing I've got a good deal. I've tended to mostly change cars every year or two and by selling privately often lost very little in depreciation.

I think those days have gone. Very few cars for sale privately now and many of those listed are either in poor condition or asking dealer prices. Last couple of purchases have been from franchised dealers as I took the view that, if I'm paying retail money, only a manufacturer approved warranty is worth having. Hopefully I'll still be able to sell privately.

Last week I went to test drive a four year old car and came away having signed up to a two year lease on a new one, which likely works out cheaper than buying the used one. I've never bought new, or financed, in my life because of the heavy initial depreciation. Our next family car will probably be an EV, which I'll lease because of the depreciation and the rapidly improving developments in battery technology.

I wonder what will happen to the used car market and whether the private sale is dead, especially with the emergence of CarWow, Motorway etc?

[Derek182]

My experience is very similar, I've always preferred buying privately, meet the owner, get a feel for whether they are genuine and been suspicious of traders and their worthless warranties.
In the main I've owned enthusiast's cars, hot hatches, classics, Caterhams, sports cars etc and I think there is still a market to buy and sell these privately.
Also similar to the OP I recently started looking at buying a newer sports car (Alpine A110 in my case) and ended up buying a new one on PCP as the 0% deal made it cheaper than buying a used one plus the reassurance of a proper 3 year warranty.
To do this I had to sell a middle aged Boxster, never considered PXing it as I knew the offer would be derisory, I did put it in WBAC, also derisory, so advertised it privately, not a quick or easy sale but did get much more than the trade were offering.

[Discombobulate]

SFTWend said:

For some forty years I've bought and sold nearly all my cars privately. The exceptions have been for something more expensive, where I've bought from a specialist. I've enjoyed the hunt, meeting the owners, the haggle, and driving away knowing I've got a good deal. I've tended to mostly change cars every year or two and by selling privately often lost very little in depreciation.

I think those days have gone. Very few cars for sale privately now and many of those listed are either in poor condition or asking dealer prices. Last couple of purchases have been from franchised dealers as I took the view that, if I'm paying retail money, only a manufacturer approved warranty is worth having. Hopefully I'll still be able to sell privately.

Last week I went to test drive a four year old car and came away having signed up to a two year lease on a new one, which likely works out cheaper than buying the used one. I've never bought new, or financed, in my life because of the heavy initial depreciation. Our next family car will probably be an EV, which I'll lease because of the depreciation and the rapidly improving developments in battery technology.

I wonder what will happen to the used car market and whether the private sale is dead, especially with the emergence of CarWow, Motorway etc?

Which "rapidly improving developments in battery technology"? There may be some on the horizon, but most advances in current tech have been pretty marginal.

[dontlookdown]

I always used to enjoy buying and selling cars privately too, but I think the private market, certainly for anything that isn't rare or enthusiast-only, disappeared years ago.

I haven't bought or sold privately for a decade - these days if one does see a private it is usually a driveway trader trying to dodge their legal obligations to their customers. And on the rare occasions when it's a genuine private sale the price is often completely unrealistic.

It's a bit of a shame as I much prefer dealing with real people rather than car sales "executives' but the world moves on.

[SWoll]

SFTWend said:

I've never bought new, or financed, in my life because of the heavy initial depreciation. Our next family car will probably be an EV, which I'll lease because of the depreciation and the rapidly improving developments in battery technology.

What rapidly improving developments in battery technology?

Lease prices on EV's are through the roof in most cases because of that heavy initial depreciation you mention and the fact that most are going to company car/salary sacrifice drivers who make substantial tax savings. You aren't avoiding it by leasing one, you're paying it all + an additional margin for the lease company?

As an example the Model 3 RWD will cost £25k to lease for 3 years/30k miles today. Based on current values that car will be worth £20-22k at the end of the lease, so £5-7k is going to the lease company on top of the actual depreciation.

[SFTWend]

SWoll said:

What rapidly improving developments in battery technology?

Lease prices on EV's are through the roof in most cases because of that heavy initial depreciation you mention and the fact that most are going to company car/salary sacrifice drivers who make substantial tax savings. You aren't avoiding it by leasing one, you're paying it all + an additional margin for the lease company?

As an example the Model 3 RWD will cost £25k to lease for 3 years/30k miles today. Based on current values that car will be worth £20-22k at the end of the lease, so £5-7k is going to the lease company on top of the actual depreciation.

Plenty of good deals are raised on the leasing thread.

If EVs are the future I'd expect significant progress to be made in terms of range, for example, over the next few years.

[SWoll]

SFTWend said:

Plenty of good deals are raised on the leasing thread.

If EVs are the future I'd expect significant progress to be made in terms of range, for example, over the next few years.

You can expect that, but at the moment any big jump in battery tech is looking a long way off and will be very expensive when it does eventually arrive. I'm also hopeful that rather than the endless focus on more range, any new tech delivers lighter and more efficient EV's that charge much faster than the current generation. That would truly benefit all owners.

Any examples of these good deals you can share?

[Cambs_Stuart]

I've been looking to buy recently and I've been amazed at the difference in responses from private sellers and traders. From Private sellers I've had long, articulate, detailed, honest, quick responses on service history, condition of car, any modifications, availability all with pictures and notes showing their interest in the model.
From traders I've seen cars with no service history, advertised as "full dealer history", brand new but mismatched budget tyres, cars with engine management lights on and clunks from suspension all of which the dealers have tried to dismiss as "They all do that". There are cars for sale at £15k, so not bargain basement sheds.
So far there has been one dealer who has but some effort in, and he's 3 hours away. But it's really put me off buying from trade.

[Trevor555]

Yup, so few private sellers nowadays.

With Carwow, Motorway, WBAC etc, so easy to sell your car now.

Why bother with advertising, preparing, worry of who might turn up at your door?

Sold a few thousand cars myself, but nowadays would have to think very hard about doing a private sale now.

My last few cars went to WBAC, or local dealers who were desperate for nice stock. All at decent prices.

I find nowadays that a lot of the cars that are for sale privately are cars with stories that can't be sold to an "expert"

[Snubs]

I wonder how much the proliferation of online auctions has affected buying privately? It seems to me that prior to moving online car auctions were a bit more specialist in as much as they were only held occasionally and bidding wasn't as easy as just tapping on your phone screen. Now you can just sit at home, register through the app and watch the continuous sales on thing like The Market cycle through. I'd be interested to know how much of the performance car private sales market has now shifted to online auctions.

[SFTWend]

SWoll said:

You can expect that, but at the moment any big jump in battery tech is looking a long way off and will be very expensive when it does eventually arrive. I'm also hopeful that rather than the endless focus on more range, any new tech delivers lighter and more efficient EV's that charge much faster than the current generation. That would truly benefit all owners.

Any examples of these good deals you can share?

I did not intend, or want, this thread to be about EV developments.

I've referred you to the "best lease deals" thread where you will find as many examples as you like, including latest posts regarding a Tesla.

[SFTWend]

Snubs said:

I wonder how much the proliferation of online auctions has affected buying privately? It seems to me that prior to moving online car auctions were a bit more specialist in as much as they were only held occasionally and bidding wasn't as easy as just tapping on your phone screen. Now you can just sit at home, register through the app and watch the continuous sales on thing like The Market cycle through. I'd be interested to know how much of the performance car private sales market has now shifted to online auctions.

Great point. I suspect many bidders would never have considered buying at a traditional auction and maybe not from a private seller via the classifieds.

[coldel]

The move towards convenience along with so many cars being on finance, as well as the sharpening up of the CRA, has obviously created an environment for dealers to flourish. It also sounds harsh, but people nowadays can be lazier when buying/selling cars, they just want it done, rather than invest time into it and are happy to pay the cost of that.

Personally I have no problem making an extra £ of the sale of a car by advertising it well, writing a good advert, vetting people and being open and honest with the car 100% before people turn up.

[Scootersp]

In the shed area you can still enjoy the process (well buying at least!)

My last two sheds have come from the older generation, they are often pretty well looked after, long term owned cars that the owners almost want to see it go to a good home more than get much money for it. It's just time to upgrade or get rid of an extra car that's no longer needed, rather than being something driven into the dirt.

The older you go the easier it is to spot a good car from a bad one? and within a few minutes of chatting you can get a really good gauge of the seller, their circumstances and general attitude. It doesn't stop you inheriting the odd issue, but most times this is better than dealers who let's face it also inherit the same cars with the issues.

I will always try to buy and sell privately as it's just frankly the cheapest way, otherwise it can be very costly being a serial car buyer/chop and changer!

[fflump]

SFTWend said:

For some forty years I've bought and sold nearly all my cars privately. The exceptions have been for something more expensive, where I've bought from a specialist. I've enjoyed the hunt, meeting the owners, the haggle, and driving away knowing I've got a good deal. I've tended to mostly change cars every year or two and by selling privately often lost very little in depreciation.

I think those days have gone. Very few cars for sale privately now and many of those listed are either in poor condition or asking dealer prices. Last couple of purchases have been from franchised dealers as I took the view that, if I'm paying retail money, only a manufacturer approved warranty is worth having. Hopefully I'll still be able to sell privately.

Last week I went to test drive a four year old car and came away having signed up to a two year lease on a new one, which likely works out cheaper than buying the used one. I've never bought new, or financed, in my life because of the heavy initial depreciation. Our next family car will probably be an EV, which I'll lease because of the depreciation and the rapidly improving developments in battery technology.

I wonder what will happen to the used car market and whether the private sale is dead, especially with the emergence of CarWow, Motorway etc?

Some of this chimes with what I'm seeing. A lot of private sales are on at dealer prices, and railway march operations are charging franchise dealer prices, seemingly forgetting the manufacturer backed warranties that come with main dealer sales. Selling my last car was a bit of a PITA, despite it having 1 yr manufacturer warranty and being the cheapest on AT, but worth it in the end as it was 25% more than trade-in or WBAC level. You just have to suffer a lot of dreamers who you indulge with myriad details on the car only to be ludicrously low-balled.

[Derek182]

The world has changed, I'm 54 and in my youth the only way I could afford a car was to service, fix and maintain it myself but back then that was easy to do, even an engine change was doable with fairly basic tools on an old Mini or Ford. That lead to a (sometimes misplaced) confidence in buying and selling cars privately.
My own children barely know how to open the bonnet on their cars but luckily a 10 year old Corsa is far more reliable than what was around 30 years ago.
For their generation car ownership will become just another monthly payment like a phone contract hence the lack of private buyers and sellers.