Dealer masquerading as private seller?

[MitchT]

Seen a nice BMW 440i for sale on Autotrader. Interestingly, it's shown as "Private seller" but, when I do some digging, I see that the tax was due on 1 February. Only a dealer can have an un-taxed car as far as I know - if the car was privately owned it would need to be taxed or SORNed, but it's not.

[the-norseman]

Maybe the private seller just hasn't bothered to tax is again or sorn it. plenty of cars out there that aren't sorn or taxed.

[Caddyshack]

Probably trying to get away with no warranty or maybe income tax.

[eddietiv1]

There's loads out there doing this, even advertising the company on the number plate and they still get away with it.

[sjc]

Just ring up and ask about “the car for sale”. If he
answers “what one ?” that’s a good marker.

[MitchT]

sjc said:

Just ring up and ask about “the car for sale”. If he
answers “what one ?” that’s a good marker.

Good call

[MitchT]

Did a quick Autotrader search for all cars in the same location. Found another two in the same car park very quickly. All private sellers!

[the-norseman]

MitchT said:

Did a quick Autotrader search for all cars in the same location. Found another two in the same car park very quickly. All private sellers!

From the same account?

[Caddyshack]

If you do want to buy that car make the seller know you are buying it on the basis that they are a trader with the protections that should afford but it probably tells you to buy from someone more honest.

[MitchT]

the-norseman said:

From the same account?

Not sure how I'd tell.

[the-norseman]

post some links

[Daisyjukes81]

We've experienced private sellers masquerading as dealers. And the amount of scammers on a certain market place is unreal. Same car advertised in about 6 different places around the UK. It's insane.
We enquired about car this evening. Said it was a used car dealership. He sent me the address and it was different to the one on the ad and it was a private home address, not a car sales place. This is what puts us off buying as we've been bitten before with this and lost a lot of money. Not good when you're needing a new car!

[fridaypassion]

As a legit trader this makes my urine boil. It's actually illegal to disguise trade sales. Report them to the police and HMRC!

HMRC will get the rubber glove on for this stuff.

[was8v]

If you like the car then what difference does it make?

So long as you are paying private money not dealer money (as that would carry some comeback).

[MitchT]

the-norseman said:

post some links

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202404068366311
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202403308...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202403318...

All private sellers. All untaxed.

ETA: Not sure why the first one doesn't show as a live link.

Edited by MitchT on Monday 15th April 22:15

[ALawson]

Finance available is unusual for a private seller, unless they work in a bank.

[the-norseman]

ALawson said:

Finance available is unusual for a private seller, unless they work in a bank.

I thought that but AT offer it now via their site don't they. I've been looking at buying a new daily and quite a few private cars have finance offers on them via AT.

[MitchT]

ALawson said:

Finance available is unusual for a private seller, unless they work in a bank.

I think that's just a finance partner that works with Autotrader. All private sales I've seen say "Provided by Zuto" under the finance example.

[r3g]

MitchT said:

ALawson said:

Finance available is unusual for a private seller, unless they work in a bank.

I think that's just a finance partner that works with Autotrader. All private sales I've seen say "Provided by Zuto" under the finance example.

I think that is separate and not related to the finance in the ad itself. The finance box at the side of the ad is provided by one of ATs partners/sponsors/advertisers. When the ad blurb itself (from the "private" seller) says finance available, that is them using their own finance provider, which obviously shows that they are a trader. Regardless, nobody is selling 3 separate 'own' cars worth £53k from an industrial estate. That is a trader, 100%.

You see this a lot on Ebay and Gumtree - particularly with vans. I know a good few traders through work and in 99% of cases it's just private individuals who go to the CV auctions, buying up anything that is cosmetically in good condition but most likely been offloaded there because the mechanical side of it is knackered with EML on. They give it a spruce up, clear the codes to turn the EML out then stick it on ebay or gumtree for a strong retail price, based on the cosmetic condition, but list it as a private seller. The reason for this is exactly as the guy above said - to avoid having to deal with it when the buyer gets halfway home and the engine conks out and EML appears, and then of course rings up for his money back.

When you first ring them to enquire about the V5C, you'll find that it's 50/50 whether they have it or you'll need to apply for it. If they have it the yellow section will be missing, which is another telltale. If you ask if the V5 is in their name and registered to their address, you'll be spun some yarn about how they bought it off the council just recently as they needed a van to move house but now that's done they are selling it as they no longer need it (or variant thereof).

In short : "private" ads stating "finance available" and/or V5C needing to be applied for it or yellow section missing = you've a high likelihood of getting rinsed as the vehicle isn't as straight and legit as what it appears.

[JackJarvis]

MitchT said:

the-norseman said:

post some links

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202404068366311
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202403308...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202403318...

All private sellers. All untaxed.

ETA: Not sure why the first one doesn't show as a live link.

Edited by MitchT on Monday 15th April 22:15

A bit of snooping to find the address shows there are a couple of accident repair businesses opposite where the pictures were taken... I'm sure pure coincidence.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5676662,-0.2371685...