VW used approved “no negotiation”

VW used approved “no negotiation”

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Discussion

Keepersball

Original Poster:

107 posts

64 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
Hi All went to look at a vw used approved car today and after test drive I wanted to make an offer but was told, “the price you see is the price you pay - head office set prices - no offers at all”

Now 6-12 months ago I would have understood this given the lack of cars on the market and the sellers market that it was back then.

Having spoken to dealer friends they were saying October was the worst month they can remember in the trade due to economy etc etc

Does anyone know if this is a corporate stance from
Vw or did I catch the “salesman” on a bad day?

If this is the case I have to question what his job actually is as my only interaction with him was for him to give me the keys and tell me to enjoy the rest drive !!

NickCW

296 posts

137 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
I would negotiate with my feet and walk away, most dealers I have spoken to lately are pretty keen to do deals so perhaps he thought you would buy it anyway regardless?

Eitherway I would deal with someone else or go elsewhere, unless of course its the mintest cheapest around - then he has you! hehe

Tam_Mullen

2,363 posts

179 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
I think its a fairly common thing these days. I was told the same when I went to see my M140 which was AU from BMW.

I said it was a wee bit more expensive than the other one I was looking at, and was told that the sticker price was firm. I was happy enough with the price and the car so proceeded to do a deal. I had a 40% deposit and was taking out HP through them, when doing all the number they were more than happy to knock the best part of £2k off the sticker price to get the numbers to work out to where I was happy with. I know they'll have made their money out of me but I left happy.

My Dad bought his Macan from Porsche AU and as a cash buyer he was told the most they would knock off was 5%.

J1990

836 posts

60 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
My suspicion is that a lot of dealerships have removed the negotiation power of the sales staff when it comes to actual pricing of the vehicle, the price is set when it goes out on the floor and that price is reviewed however often that dealer sees fit, whether that's daily, weekly or monthly. It seems the only negotiation power the sales staff now have is with the add-ins.
I could be entirely wrong but that's the way it has felt for a while now.

Presuming Ed

1,493 posts

215 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
I would guess you were there to drive the car as it was the best priced example in the spec you wanted. If it is and you like it get it bought.

I understand everyone wants a deal but if it is the best option then there isn't much you can do unless you can offer comparables that are a less.

His job as you will find out to push expensive finance, gap products and paint protection.

bobthemonkey

4,027 posts

223 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
if it is 'head office' it will be that franchise group or individual site as they own the stock - not VW UK.

Its different when main dealers have moved to an agency model for new vehicles - as they truly don't have negotiating power. Mercedes have gone, Volvo have or are about to, and Lotus as well, off the top of my head.

Sheepshanks

34,990 posts

126 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
Keepersball said:
Hi All went to look at a vw used approved car today and after test drive I wanted to make an offer but was told, “the price you see is the price you pay - head office set prices - no offers at all”

Now 6-12 months ago I would have understood this given the lack of cars on the market and the sellers market that it was back then.

Having spoken to dealer friends they were saying October was the worst month they can remember in the trade due to economy etc etc

Does anyone know if this is a corporate stance from
Vw or did I catch the “salesman” on a bad day?

If this is the case I have to question what his job actually is as my only interaction with him was for him to give me the keys and tell me to enjoy the rest drive !!
Where you looking to pay cash, or using finance?

Keepersball

Original Poster:

107 posts

64 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
We didn’t even get that far - I said there were a couple of others very similar spec and price so wanted to talk price and was told unequivocally that the price I saw was the price I’d have to pay. He didn’t ask how I would finance it.

HTP99

23,288 posts

147 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
Keepersball said:
We didn’t even get that far - I said there were a couple of others very similar spec and price so wanted to talk price and was told unequivocally that the price I saw was the price I’d have to pay. He didn’t ask how I would finance it.
There's your answer, it is the correct price and they would have known that!

I guess if you can't afford it you could look for a cheaper one, maybe older, or higher mileage or lower spec?

Edited by HTP99 on Friday 1st December 15:03

Dan W.

1,196 posts

85 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
Keepersball said:
Hi All went to look at a vw used approved car today and after test drive I wanted to make an offer but was told, “the price you see is the price you pay - head office set prices - no offers at all”

Now 6-12 months ago I would have understood this given the lack of cars on the market and the sellers market that it was back then.

Having spoken to dealer friends they were saying October was the worst month they can remember in the trade due to economy etc etc

Does anyone know if this is a corporate stance from
Vw or did I catch the “salesman” on a bad day?

If this is the case I have to question what his job actually is as my only interaction with him was for him to give me the keys and tell me to enjoy the rest drive !!
Sounds like head office set the prices and he has no say, Its nothing to do with VW the used cars are owned by the dealer group and some larger companies are having their prices set by head office.

If its priced bang on correct and your happy just buy it

Sheepshanks

34,990 posts

126 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
bobthemonkey said:
if it is 'head office' it will be that franchise group or individual site as they own the stock - not VW UK.

Its different when main dealers have moved to an agency model for new vehicles - as they truly don't have negotiating power. Mercedes have gone, Volvo have or are about to, and Lotus as well, off the top of my head.
I was going to say that it's quite odd that people don't realise who they're dealing with but I suppose without a bit of delving you wouldn't even know the dealer group behind most retailers, and as you suggest, the situation with new cars is further being confused by agency arrangements.

Some dealers will haggle though - a local independent Skoda dealers knocked £2K off an 18mth old Karoq bought for my wife a couple of mths ago, and they gave more than expected for her old Tiguan.

RoVoFob

1,354 posts

165 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
Keepersball said:
Hi All went to look at a vw used approved car today and after test drive I wanted to make an offer but was told, “the price you see is the price you pay - head office set prices - no offers at all”
My dad bought an approved used Audi from a main dealer two days ago.

It was the best priced online for its age/mileage by a significant margin. The price was initially £22,999 a few months back, they’d dropped it to £19,999 before we went - probably around £1,000+ less than anything similar (even non-main dealer and private sales) - and the dealer said they had planned to get the wheels refurbished (it didn’t really need this).

This would have been a cash purchase, but the finance option included enough freebies to make it worth signing up for then cancelling: 2 free services, 2 years’ warranty (rather than 1 year), 2 years’ roadside assistance, 2 MOTs and 2 years’ MOT cover.

They also cut about £1,400 from the cost to change figure. The initial part exchange figure was low, but probably typical. The sales person also offered a full tank of fuel (about £70 worth, as it had been on a 1/4 of a tank when we drove it) and ceramic coating inside and out (can’t imagine this is any good, but who knows).

Depending how you weigh up the value of the extras included, that’s around £1,700 of movement on an already well-priced car plus the approved used extras that are easily worth £1,000+. Do you know what approved used elements are included by the dealer/dealer group/manufacturer for cash and finance purchases? If not, it’s worth finding out, so you compare the real value to you of the car and services included, versus alternatives.

HTP99 said:
There's your answer, it is the correct price and they would have known that!
The ‘correct’ sale price is often very different to the ‘correct’ advertised price. Sellers are free to refuse to drop the price they’ll sell at, as other cars are advertised at a similar or higher level, but that doesn’t mean they’ll actually sell anything at these advertised prices…

My dad walked away without getting to a deal on day one, with the dealer saying he was going to get back in touch the next day. Dad worked out his cut off point that evening - £250 less than where the dealer got to the previous day - and presented that on day two, saying he’d put down a deposit there and then if they agreed to it. They did…

macron

10,764 posts

173 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
I find this hilarious with dealers who are using the Autotrader Dynamic Price nonsense, as the price changes daily!

"The price is the price". Until tomorrow, when it will be a different price...

I also think those, like Toyota, who said this to me today, do actually have A price for A specific thing- in my case a vehicle where the number was the cash price (or at least the not-their-finance-price) with a 3 month warranty and that was that.

Naturally if I had a PX, different story. Or if I wanted their finance, or a longer warranty. Or some useless ceramic spray. Or............. And if I signed up today, some of that could come included anyway, or we could "look at things".

But yeah, the price was the price.... So I think, as usual, it depends on the mix of what a purchase is- just a straight buy and they might be right- or have an intent at least. Anything else....

I will buy from elsewhere for a variety of reasons, but there you go.

Sheepshanks

34,990 posts

126 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
Keepersball said:
We didn’t even get that far - I said there were a couple of others very similar spec and price so wanted to talk price and was told unequivocally that the price I saw was the price I’d have to pay. He didn’t ask how I would finance it.
How would you have been paying for it?

It seems to me that all dealer salespeople want to talk about is the "monthly" - deposit, final value, and APR they'll do anything they can to avoid discussing those, as well as, of course the headline price. One salesman got annoyed with me for asking what the GFV would be as "no-one ever keeps their car to the end of the deal".

You've got to be OK with the numbers though, and keep your witts about you, other wise you could end up with a 4yr deal when you wanted 3!

If you want to get them really excited, ask if you can have it with paint and alloy wheel protection, and if they do GAP.

For the last few cars I've bought - mostly new, but one approved used, I've taken the finance and then Withdrawn a few days after delivery. Dealer's attitude (even amongst the same manufacturer) seems to vary - some get annoyed if they get wind you're going to do this, others (like the Skoda Approved Used, which is still VWFS, I just bought) suggested I take it then withdraw just to get the extra servicing & warranty on offer.

Edited by Sheepshanks on Friday 1st December 15:59

Pica-Pica

14,454 posts

91 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
HTP99 said:
Keepersball said:
We didn’t even get that far - I said there were a couple of others very similar spec and price so wanted to talk price and was told unequivocally that the price I saw was the price I’d have to pay. He didn’t ask how I would finance it.
There's your answer, it is the correct price and they would have known that!

I guess if you can't afford it you could look for a cheaper one, maybe older, or higher mileage or lower spec?

Edited by HTP99 on Friday 1st December 15:03
I would not say ‘a couple of others’, I would mention other marques. As everything, set your limit and stick to it.

BOR

4,836 posts

262 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
I suppose, in theory, at least within an Approved Used network, "no Negotiation" does make some sense.

Dynamic Pricing winds me the fk up, same as everyone else, but, if you can see that you are rapidly turning stock over nationally, or stock is slow moving, you could execute a nationwide price change x0,95 or x 1,07 or whatever.

It also avoids a race to the bottom with dealers fighting amongst themselves.

But for this to work, you would have to be extremely strict on not doing side deals with potential buyers.

Otherwise, I can see the logic to a degree.

Sukh13

791 posts

192 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
HTP99 said:
There's your answer, it is the correct price and they would have known that!

I guess if you can't afford it you could look for a cheaper one, maybe older, or higher mileage or lower spec?

Edited by HTP99 on Friday 1st December 15:03
If it doesn't sell for six months at the advertised price, is it still the correct price?

Muzzer79

11,049 posts

194 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
This (no negotiation) model is something that Mercedes adopted a while ago too.

I think it's a bold move as, for a purchase of this size, a lot of people will want some kind of negotiation.

However, negotiation seems to becoming more of a dirty word for the younger generation - who expect both to sell and buy an item at the price it's listed at. Therefore perhaps for that generation, it makes more sense.

I also think it's a strange opening gambit to a negotiation. Yes, it's best to get it out of the way - but it's not exactly a sale-maker is it?

Chamon_Lee

3,899 posts

154 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
walk away

Dan W.

1,196 posts

85 months

Friday 1st December 2023
quotequote all
Muzzer79 said:
This (no negotiation) model is something that Mercedes adopted a while ago too.

I think it's a bold move as, for a purchase of this size, a lot of people will want some kind of negotiation.

However, negotiation seems to becoming more of a dirty word for the younger generation - who expect both to sell and buy an item at the price it's listed at. Therefore perhaps for that generation, it makes more sense.

I also think it's a strange opening gambit to a negotiation. Yes, it's best to get it out of the way - but it's not exactly a sale-maker is it?
Its always an interesting conversation when discount is brought up.

After 17 years of selling cars i always find it fun to discuss with a customer, Sometimes its just a straight no
other times you will justify your price to the customer, My favourite is always well i just want a discount or i dont pay list price for cars.

If people have done their research and know its priced right they will buy or will tell you why they feel you are overpriced or have seen one elsewhere.