R56 MINI Cooper vs. Fiat 500
Discussion
I posted a thread a few weeks ago asking what the closest modern(ish) car was to a 205 GTi and I guess things have come to a head! When we had our first child, my wife reluctantly got rid of her Fiat 500 and got a more family friendly but rather dull Toyota Auris. In solidarity and due to a new job and a longer commute, I sold my fun Impreza WRX and bought an equally dull 1.8 Civic!
The Auris has recently been replaced by an MPV, which has been quite a life changer in a positive way, as we now have two kids and it has all the space and practicality that we could ever need. Surprisingly, I quite like it and don't mind driving it but we would both like something more fun but no more expensive to run for my commute and for us both to use for fun when we're not ferrying around the kids.
Naturally, my wife would love another red Fiat 500. She would be perfectly happy with a 1.2 and to be fair it was a great car. Low tax, 50mpg, perfectly decent on the motorway and never gave us any reliability issues in 3+ years. The 5k budget doesn't quite stretch to an Abarth version and I would want a bit more pep than the 1.2 (so possibly the 1.4 or the TwinAir), as I'm not a big fan of diesel.
However, I have always been more of a fan of the MINI. Don't get me wrong, I really like the Fiat 500 but it is a very feminine car and although the MINI is hardly dripping with testosterone, it is not quite as feminine IMHO. I was down on the waiting list for a Cooper S back in 2004 but pulled out in the end because the dealership didn't have one available to test drive and I didn't want to wait 6 months. I also looked at a Cooper S when I got the Civic but for the payment I was comfortable with, the Civic was newer, had more warranty, less miles and seemed the more "sensible" choice with young kids.
The kids are a bit older now though and can climb in the car themselves. I don't really like the looks of the latest MINI much, so maybe now is the time to "scratch the MINI itch". It's quite a "marmite" car but I test drove a red 2009 MINI Cooper the other day, not unlike the one in the photos (apart from that's an S) and on 16" wheels. It had only done 50,000 miles, was in very good condition and right on budget. I have a buyer lined up on the Civic and can get back what I still owe. It's not that fast by any means but it's fairly compact and light, more power than the 500 120bhp?) and fast enough to be entertaining and get out of its own way. It felt very chuckable like my 205 and in fact similar power (mine was a 1.6) and it's a Peugeot engine, the ride wasn't that bad for a car with that short of a wheelbase and on the motorway, it was surprisingly quiet thanks in part to that 6th gear. I also tried my friend's mk1 Swift Sport recently and it was a cracking little car but I found the ride too firm and it was very noisy on the motorway. The clutch on the MINI was relatively heavy (compared to the Civic) but I noticed this on the Cooper S that I drove a few years back as well. Is this normal?
Of the other cars suggested, I liked the RS Twingo but there aren't any for sale local to me and besides I saw one in the metal the other day and wasn't sure if I liked it and all the other suggestions were a bit too old.
On balance, I think the 500 has the nicer interior and a more practical boot (tiny on the MINI) but the MINI probably drives better (more power, sharper handling and a less bouncy ride). Our 500 was exceptionally reliable but I have heard mixed reviews on MINIs. I didn't hear any timing chain rattle on the one I drove and I would have thought any problems would have manifested themselves by now. The oil looked clean and the level was good. The lack of a spare wheel on the MINI concerns me a little (it was on normal tyres not runflats) but I have had very few punctures in the last 15 years and I do have roadside assistance!
I would probably be looking at keeping it about two years and then upgrading to a newer R56 Cooper S if I love the Cooper or an Abarth 500 if I don't or maybe a GT86/BRZ if they have come down to the right price by then!
So, stick with what I know (the 500), it's a great car and the wife will be happy or scratch the MINI itch?
The Auris has recently been replaced by an MPV, which has been quite a life changer in a positive way, as we now have two kids and it has all the space and practicality that we could ever need. Surprisingly, I quite like it and don't mind driving it but we would both like something more fun but no more expensive to run for my commute and for us both to use for fun when we're not ferrying around the kids.
Naturally, my wife would love another red Fiat 500. She would be perfectly happy with a 1.2 and to be fair it was a great car. Low tax, 50mpg, perfectly decent on the motorway and never gave us any reliability issues in 3+ years. The 5k budget doesn't quite stretch to an Abarth version and I would want a bit more pep than the 1.2 (so possibly the 1.4 or the TwinAir), as I'm not a big fan of diesel.
However, I have always been more of a fan of the MINI. Don't get me wrong, I really like the Fiat 500 but it is a very feminine car and although the MINI is hardly dripping with testosterone, it is not quite as feminine IMHO. I was down on the waiting list for a Cooper S back in 2004 but pulled out in the end because the dealership didn't have one available to test drive and I didn't want to wait 6 months. I also looked at a Cooper S when I got the Civic but for the payment I was comfortable with, the Civic was newer, had more warranty, less miles and seemed the more "sensible" choice with young kids.
The kids are a bit older now though and can climb in the car themselves. I don't really like the looks of the latest MINI much, so maybe now is the time to "scratch the MINI itch". It's quite a "marmite" car but I test drove a red 2009 MINI Cooper the other day, not unlike the one in the photos (apart from that's an S) and on 16" wheels. It had only done 50,000 miles, was in very good condition and right on budget. I have a buyer lined up on the Civic and can get back what I still owe. It's not that fast by any means but it's fairly compact and light, more power than the 500 120bhp?) and fast enough to be entertaining and get out of its own way. It felt very chuckable like my 205 and in fact similar power (mine was a 1.6) and it's a Peugeot engine, the ride wasn't that bad for a car with that short of a wheelbase and on the motorway, it was surprisingly quiet thanks in part to that 6th gear. I also tried my friend's mk1 Swift Sport recently and it was a cracking little car but I found the ride too firm and it was very noisy on the motorway. The clutch on the MINI was relatively heavy (compared to the Civic) but I noticed this on the Cooper S that I drove a few years back as well. Is this normal?
Of the other cars suggested, I liked the RS Twingo but there aren't any for sale local to me and besides I saw one in the metal the other day and wasn't sure if I liked it and all the other suggestions were a bit too old.
On balance, I think the 500 has the nicer interior and a more practical boot (tiny on the MINI) but the MINI probably drives better (more power, sharper handling and a less bouncy ride). Our 500 was exceptionally reliable but I have heard mixed reviews on MINIs. I didn't hear any timing chain rattle on the one I drove and I would have thought any problems would have manifested themselves by now. The oil looked clean and the level was good. The lack of a spare wheel on the MINI concerns me a little (it was on normal tyres not runflats) but I have had very few punctures in the last 15 years and I do have roadside assistance!
I would probably be looking at keeping it about two years and then upgrading to a newer R56 Cooper S if I love the Cooper or an Abarth 500 if I don't or maybe a GT86/BRZ if they have come down to the right price by then!
So, stick with what I know (the 500), it's a great car and the wife will be happy or scratch the MINI itch?
I didn't think oil and timing chained were an issue on the cooper, on,y on the s.
The mini and 500 both have charecter and if you can live with the driving position I would go for the twin air, just don't expect great fuel economy. If toys and build quality are your thing then it's the mini. As a clubman cooper s owner, if I was on a budget I would go 500.
The mini and 500 both have charecter and if you can live with the driving position I would go for the twin air, just don't expect great fuel economy. If toys and build quality are your thing then it's the mini. As a clubman cooper s owner, if I was on a budget I would go 500.
rigga said:
Timing chain, oil consumption, high pressure fuel pump, death rattle et all are all related to the cooper S N14, the cooper N12 engine does not have these issues.
ThisWife has a R56 cooper 2007 had it for 6 years and we both it is a great little car. It is quite roomy inside, boot is tiny though. You need to flatten a seat or two to get much in.
No issues apart from a leaky radiator? Which was cheap enough. No oil usage really, never needs a top up between changes. Mot passes each year. No squeaks or rattles.
Good fun, I often take it if going into town, easy to park, chuckable and the ride on smaller wheels not bad, no run flats, we do have a. Space saver wheel under the boot floor.
I have offered to replace it, wife doesn't want to, good.
So I have owned from new a 2003 Mk1 BMW Mini one (remapped to Cooper levels) and more recently from new a 14 plate Twinair 500s (the 85bhp one not the 105bhp). Both enjoyable cars, I was indifferent to the Mini going but upset to see the 500s go.
The Twinair 500s would be my car of choice, a nice drive and a good engine. Perfect for short commutes and around town, not much fun, but bearable on a motorway. It's never going to set any records or be considered luxurious but genuinely I believe one of the nicest small cars I've ever driven or been in.
The Twinair 500s would be my car of choice, a nice drive and a good engine. Perfect for short commutes and around town, not much fun, but bearable on a motorway. It's never going to set any records or be considered luxurious but genuinely I believe one of the nicest small cars I've ever driven or been in.
Edited by Moonpie21 on Wednesday 5th October 14:22
swerni said:
The R56 drinks oil like Oliver Reed and watch out for the timing tensioners, they will probably need replacing, if not already done.
We have an R56, while,a nice fun car, I certainly wouldn't buy another one.
I've not put any oil in our R57 (same thing minus roof) in coming up 8,000 miles. And it's not driven gently. The level has dropped about 2mm off max.We have an R56, while,a nice fun car, I certainly wouldn't buy another one.
Was this only an issue on certain years?
rongagin said:
This
Wife has a R56 cooper 2007 had it for 6 years and we both it is a great little car. It is quite roomy inside, boot is tiny though. You need to flatten a seat or two to get much in.
No issues apart from a leaky radiator? Which was cheap enough. No oil usage really, never needs a top up between changes. Mot passes each year. No squeaks or rattles.
Good fun, I often take it if going into town, easy to park, chuckable and the ride on smaller wheels not bad, no run flats, we do have a. Space saver wheel under the boot floor.
I have offered to replace it, wife doesn't want to, good.
Thanks. I was wondering about this and it was a concern when I looked at the Cooper S last time, especially with it being an early R56 (2007). All things being equal, I would have the S but to be honest from memory on my short test drive it didn't seem a lot quicker. That's reassuring to hear that the regular Cooper doesn't share the same issues. I would imagine rightly or wrongly that these issues ought to have been sorted by 2012/2013 on the Cooper S. I haven't driven an Abarth and it may well be better than the Cooper S but the chassis would need to be a lot better than our old 2009 1.2. That car with Abarth power would have been quite a handful!Wife has a R56 cooper 2007 had it for 6 years and we both it is a great little car. It is quite roomy inside, boot is tiny though. You need to flatten a seat or two to get much in.
No issues apart from a leaky radiator? Which was cheap enough. No oil usage really, never needs a top up between changes. Mot passes each year. No squeaks or rattles.
Good fun, I often take it if going into town, easy to park, chuckable and the ride on smaller wheels not bad, no run flats, we do have a. Space saver wheel under the boot floor.
I have offered to replace it, wife doesn't want to, good.
Back to the Cooper. Is a heavy(ish) clutch normal?
I recently spent some time looking into small cars. I ended-up with a 2012 Mini Cooper with a decent number of options and 15k on the clock, but considered a 500 and the Up / Citigo.
Realistically, you can get a lightly used (less than 9-month-old) 500 1.2 Lounge for around the same price as a 3-4 year old Mini One or Cooper - at around £8-9k.
It was tempting to go for the newer car, but I thought that the Mini is such a nicer piece of kit.
Realistically, you can get a lightly used (less than 9-month-old) 500 1.2 Lounge for around the same price as a 3-4 year old Mini One or Cooper - at around £8-9k.
It was tempting to go for the newer car, but I thought that the Mini is such a nicer piece of kit.
kapiteinlangzaam said:
Our R56 Cooper didnt need a drop of oil in the 20k miles we did in it.
In fact, apart from servicing (free under TLC), it didnt need anything. Totally and utterly reliable.
We've had our Cooper S for 3 years/30k miles. It was bought at 28k from a MINI dealer.In fact, apart from servicing (free under TLC), it didnt need anything. Totally and utterly reliable.
It's used barely any oil. It is the N18 LCI R56, which is the supposed reliable version.
Moonpie21 said:
This was my 500s and can't find one of the Mini. Only a few comments relating to it being a little feminine, but a great car.
However I don't think you can go wrong with either considering how many of both are on the roads they're both clearly popular choices.
Make sure you can get comfortable in the 500. I found that my left shin / knee ended up resting against the centre console and the relatively hard, cheap plastics made that rather uncomfortable.
I prefer the Mini - primarily because I think it's a more accomplished steer. I had an early R56 Cooper, back in 2008 and I found it to be a great little car for barrelling along in - not quick, but it rode nicely and carried plenty of speed through the bends.
The 500 we owned a couple of years back was cute and revvy, but it bounced around quite a bit and wasn't nearly as fun on a country road.
I'm just in the process of buying another Mini - this time a late R56 Cooper S with the revised engine. After a few years away from Mini, I was really bowled over on the test drive by how much fun they are to chuck around.
I prefer the Mini - primarily because I think it's a more accomplished steer. I had an early R56 Cooper, back in 2008 and I found it to be a great little car for barrelling along in - not quick, but it rode nicely and carried plenty of speed through the bends.
The 500 we owned a couple of years back was cute and revvy, but it bounced around quite a bit and wasn't nearly as fun on a country road.
I'm just in the process of buying another Mini - this time a late R56 Cooper S with the revised engine. After a few years away from Mini, I was really bowled over on the test drive by how much fun they are to chuck around.
Edited by Gruber on Thursday 6th October 10:41
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