Existential Crisis: EV's - Reject or Embrace?
Discussion
I am having an internal crisis, which I think (hope?) has nothing to do with fast approaching middle age. I love the internal combustion engine, the smell, the noise, the feel. The best day of my life was collecting my first proper hot hatch, shortly followed by the birth of my first-born. I love motorsports, I like speed, I like throwing a well-tuned chassis down a British B road.
But the best all-round car I've ever bought, choosing from an eclectic (but modest) list, ranging from a DS3 Racing, to an Evo5 and Scooby, to a Twingo RS and FK2 Type R, is unquestionably the Nissan Leaf.
It accelerates faster than the hot hatches of my youth, it's cheaper to run by a significant margin than any other car I've ever owned, it's better equipped than most other cars I've owned, and was an absolute used-car bargain and one of the cheapest cars I've ever bought. The only criticism I can throw at it is that it's depreciated horribly in the last 12 months, even as a used purchase.
I don't love it, I can't love it, I never will. It defies every motoring-enthusiast fibre of my being, but it does the simple mileage so well. I'm also enjoying not really caring about the paintwork, where I park it, or if the engine needs maintenance. It's basically an appliance with a steering wheel. But yet it's forcing me to consider swapping our other car to an EV, especially as a powerfully-built company director (medium-built with a paunch director of a one-man band IT contracting company) and the potential tax advantages that brings. Worse, I find myself lusting after the new Ford Capri, a car whose very name should infuriate anyone with a passing interest in cars.
As (presumably, if you're on this forum) a petrolhead, how are you dealing with the EV revolution? Are some/all of your cars EV? Can EV's be fun? The Hyundai Ionic 5N / Kia EV6 GT have piqued my interest, but I can't help feeling they'll be one-trick ponies rather than fun cars to own. I'm leaning towards EV dailies for me and the wife, and an old petrol car for the garage for spirited drives, but then I'm struggling to think of scenarios when I'll actually get time to drive the petrol.... I guess as a grumpy middle-aged man, I'm starting to feel a little threatened by change.
But the best all-round car I've ever bought, choosing from an eclectic (but modest) list, ranging from a DS3 Racing, to an Evo5 and Scooby, to a Twingo RS and FK2 Type R, is unquestionably the Nissan Leaf.
It accelerates faster than the hot hatches of my youth, it's cheaper to run by a significant margin than any other car I've ever owned, it's better equipped than most other cars I've owned, and was an absolute used-car bargain and one of the cheapest cars I've ever bought. The only criticism I can throw at it is that it's depreciated horribly in the last 12 months, even as a used purchase.
I don't love it, I can't love it, I never will. It defies every motoring-enthusiast fibre of my being, but it does the simple mileage so well. I'm also enjoying not really caring about the paintwork, where I park it, or if the engine needs maintenance. It's basically an appliance with a steering wheel. But yet it's forcing me to consider swapping our other car to an EV, especially as a powerfully-built company director (medium-built with a paunch director of a one-man band IT contracting company) and the potential tax advantages that brings. Worse, I find myself lusting after the new Ford Capri, a car whose very name should infuriate anyone with a passing interest in cars.
As (presumably, if you're on this forum) a petrolhead, how are you dealing with the EV revolution? Are some/all of your cars EV? Can EV's be fun? The Hyundai Ionic 5N / Kia EV6 GT have piqued my interest, but I can't help feeling they'll be one-trick ponies rather than fun cars to own. I'm leaning towards EV dailies for me and the wife, and an old petrol car for the garage for spirited drives, but then I'm struggling to think of scenarios when I'll actually get time to drive the petrol.... I guess as a grumpy middle-aged man, I'm starting to feel a little threatened by change.
Fiisch said:
I am having an internal crisis, which I think (hope?) has nothing to do with fast approaching middle age. I love the internal combustion engine, the smell, the noise, the feel. The best day of my life was collecting my first proper hot hatch, shortly followed by the birth of my first-born. I love motorsports, I like speed, I like throwing a well-tuned chassis down a British B road.
But the best all-round car I've ever bought, choosing from an eclectic (but modest) list, ranging from a DS3 Racing, to an Evo5 and Scooby, to a Twingo RS and FK2 Type R, is unquestionably the Nissan Leaf.
It accelerates faster than the hot hatches of my youth, it's cheaper to run by a significant margin than any other car I've ever owned, it's better equipped than most other cars I've owned, and was an absolute used-car bargain and one of the cheapest cars I've ever bought. The only criticism I can throw at it is that it's depreciated horribly in the last 12 months, even as a used purchase.
I don't love it, I can't love it, I never will. It defies every motoring-enthusiast fibre of my being, but it does the simple mileage so well. I'm also enjoying not really caring about the paintwork, where I park it, or if the engine needs maintenance. It's basically an appliance with a steering wheel. But yet it's forcing me to consider swapping our other car to an EV, especially as a powerfully-built company director (medium-built with a paunch director of a one-man band IT contracting company) and the potential tax advantages that brings. Worse, I find myself lusting after the new Ford Capri, a car whose very name should infuriate anyone with a passing interest in cars.
As (presumably, if you're on this forum) a petrolhead, how are you dealing with the EV revolution? Are some/all of your cars EV? Can EV's be fun? The Hyundai Ionic 5N / Kia EV6 GT have piqued my interest, but I can't help feeling they'll be one-trick ponies rather than fun cars to own. I'm leaning towards EV dailies for me and the wife, and an old petrol car for the garage for spirited drives, but then I'm struggling to think of scenarios when I'll actually get time to drive the petrol.... I guess as a grumpy middle-aged man, I'm starting to feel a little threatened by change.
Why not buy an original Capri...don't think you'll loose money on it if you look after it.But the best all-round car I've ever bought, choosing from an eclectic (but modest) list, ranging from a DS3 Racing, to an Evo5 and Scooby, to a Twingo RS and FK2 Type R, is unquestionably the Nissan Leaf.
It accelerates faster than the hot hatches of my youth, it's cheaper to run by a significant margin than any other car I've ever owned, it's better equipped than most other cars I've owned, and was an absolute used-car bargain and one of the cheapest cars I've ever bought. The only criticism I can throw at it is that it's depreciated horribly in the last 12 months, even as a used purchase.
I don't love it, I can't love it, I never will. It defies every motoring-enthusiast fibre of my being, but it does the simple mileage so well. I'm also enjoying not really caring about the paintwork, where I park it, or if the engine needs maintenance. It's basically an appliance with a steering wheel. But yet it's forcing me to consider swapping our other car to an EV, especially as a powerfully-built company director (medium-built with a paunch director of a one-man band IT contracting company) and the potential tax advantages that brings. Worse, I find myself lusting after the new Ford Capri, a car whose very name should infuriate anyone with a passing interest in cars.
As (presumably, if you're on this forum) a petrolhead, how are you dealing with the EV revolution? Are some/all of your cars EV? Can EV's be fun? The Hyundai Ionic 5N / Kia EV6 GT have piqued my interest, but I can't help feeling they'll be one-trick ponies rather than fun cars to own. I'm leaning towards EV dailies for me and the wife, and an old petrol car for the garage for spirited drives, but then I'm struggling to think of scenarios when I'll actually get time to drive the petrol.... I guess as a grumpy middle-aged man, I'm starting to feel a little threatened by change.
https://www.carandclassic.com/search?category=3&am...
It's possible to love and enjoy both without it making you any less of an enthusiast. Definitely no need for an existential crisis!
I love my i3s. It's brilliant and I've no plans to get rid. But in the 6 years I've had the i3s, I've also bought a few other petrol cars to run alongside. Not for range or anything like that, but just because I enjoy different types of driving, depending on what mood I'm in.
EVs are polarising, especially on here, but ultimately who gives a s
t. Away from the keyboard warriors literally no one's bothered so just enjoy whatever you drive. Life really is too short for overthinking everything.
I love my i3s. It's brilliant and I've no plans to get rid. But in the 6 years I've had the i3s, I've also bought a few other petrol cars to run alongside. Not for range or anything like that, but just because I enjoy different types of driving, depending on what mood I'm in.
EVs are polarising, especially on here, but ultimately who gives a s
t. Away from the keyboard warriors literally no one's bothered so just enjoy whatever you drive. Life really is too short for overthinking everything.I have two EVs, one a company car, one owned.
My last ICE left my driveway at the weekend. It was sporty. I loved it. I won’t miss is for 98%+ of daily driving.
With the money I’m saving in running costs, I so far have booked one rally day and one track day.
I will always appreciate the visceral nature and engineering accomplishments of good ICE. I will go to shows; I will enjoy the speed and handling in suitable environments. The public road is no longer that: road quality (lack of) and policing/cameras put paid to that for me.
My last ICE left my driveway at the weekend. It was sporty. I loved it. I won’t miss is for 98%+ of daily driving.
With the money I’m saving in running costs, I so far have booked one rally day and one track day.
I will always appreciate the visceral nature and engineering accomplishments of good ICE. I will go to shows; I will enjoy the speed and handling in suitable environments. The public road is no longer that: road quality (lack of) and policing/cameras put paid to that for me.
May depend on the nature of your driving...
City, low-speed commute, generally short trips etc an EV might suit well.
If it needs longer range for bigger trips, then an EV (especially a cheaper one like a Leaf) isn't going to be a good choice.
I have friends with a Leaf alongside a petrol (hybrid), its very cheap running for around town shopping basket kind of use, but they have become resigned to the fact that only one of their vehicles is suitable for longer trips - so for example when he is away working out of town for a week or two, his wife can't really load up the kids and go join him for the weekend because the Leaf doesn't have the range to get there.
For some people that won't be an issue at all, for others it would be a deal-breaker.
City, low-speed commute, generally short trips etc an EV might suit well.
If it needs longer range for bigger trips, then an EV (especially a cheaper one like a Leaf) isn't going to be a good choice.
I have friends with a Leaf alongside a petrol (hybrid), its very cheap running for around town shopping basket kind of use, but they have become resigned to the fact that only one of their vehicles is suitable for longer trips - so for example when he is away working out of town for a week or two, his wife can't really load up the kids and go join him for the weekend because the Leaf doesn't have the range to get there.
For some people that won't be an issue at all, for others it would be a deal-breaker.
We have an EV as the main family car and I’m running a sporty ICE as my occasional daily.
I’m not the first person to say that EVs are appliances, cheap to run and nice to drive. Objectively this is was the majority of people want…. Personally, I’ll always want something at my disposal with an engine burble, mechanical gearbox, analog dials, and character you get from an ICE.
Do you honestly wake up on a Sunday morning exited to take your Nissan Leaf for a drive on some open roads? Even if you upgrade to a 5N I suspect the extra cash will be better spent on a nice weekend ICE. Stick with an entry level EV for daily duties and save your pennies for a fun ICE in my book.
I’m not the first person to say that EVs are appliances, cheap to run and nice to drive. Objectively this is was the majority of people want…. Personally, I’ll always want something at my disposal with an engine burble, mechanical gearbox, analog dials, and character you get from an ICE.
Do you honestly wake up on a Sunday morning exited to take your Nissan Leaf for a drive on some open roads? Even if you upgrade to a 5N I suspect the extra cash will be better spent on a nice weekend ICE. Stick with an entry level EV for daily duties and save your pennies for a fun ICE in my book.
Edited by JAMSXR on Wednesday 14th August 07:17
I believe in the right tool for the job.
Doesn’t matter when it was made.
I’m not a slave to thinking all new technology is brilliant - some of it answers questions I didn’t ask or is now built to throw-away standards vs being made to last. I still use a 1960s hammer my dad gave me.. the design and quality has never been surpassed imo so why change.
But neither am I stuck in the good ol’ days. Lots of modern tech moves the game forwards in terms of quality, speed and effectiveness - like my new laptop.
So I’ll more than happily have an EV for getting around and putting the commuting miles on. Quick and quiet, job done.
I’ll also keep the old Porsche in the garage for fun sunny Sundays, probably going slower but having to work at driving an immersive and satisfying machine from a different era.
And I accept that neither would do the job of the other very well. And that it’ll cost me, like all hobbies that bring joy do.
Doesn’t matter when it was made.
I’m not a slave to thinking all new technology is brilliant - some of it answers questions I didn’t ask or is now built to throw-away standards vs being made to last. I still use a 1960s hammer my dad gave me.. the design and quality has never been surpassed imo so why change.
But neither am I stuck in the good ol’ days. Lots of modern tech moves the game forwards in terms of quality, speed and effectiveness - like my new laptop.
So I’ll more than happily have an EV for getting around and putting the commuting miles on. Quick and quiet, job done.
I’ll also keep the old Porsche in the garage for fun sunny Sundays, probably going slower but having to work at driving an immersive and satisfying machine from a different era.
And I accept that neither would do the job of the other very well. And that it’ll cost me, like all hobbies that bring joy do.
I see them as an alternative form of transport that doesn't interest me, like motorbikes.
I have cars that are fast enough and I couldn't care less about running costs. I have an estate and pickup that are workhorses I can park anywhere. I quite like noisy, tactile cars so some of the measurable advantages of EVs don't appeal. If I want to travel in sybaritic luxury I'll buy an old Rolls or S class. I don't buy the environmental benefit claims and I'm not interested in arguing about them.
So for me, neither reject or embrace, more ignore. I'm pleased for anyone who finds them a better solution to their transport needs.
I have cars that are fast enough and I couldn't care less about running costs. I have an estate and pickup that are workhorses I can park anywhere. I quite like noisy, tactile cars so some of the measurable advantages of EVs don't appeal. If I want to travel in sybaritic luxury I'll buy an old Rolls or S class. I don't buy the environmental benefit claims and I'm not interested in arguing about them.
So for me, neither reject or embrace, more ignore. I'm pleased for anyone who finds them a better solution to their transport needs.
I think we are still in the Betamax era of EV’s, namely the battery tech still needs to improve and the charging points (the media) still have a long way to go.
Everyone one wanted one has one, those that didn’t want one but got one anyway because they are cheap on salary sacrifice has one too - and that’s it, the market has levelled in real terms.
Everyone one wanted one has one, those that didn’t want one but got one anyway because they are cheap on salary sacrifice has one too - and that’s it, the market has levelled in real terms.
I pretty much intend to do both. Embrace EVs for what they do so well - getting people from A to B in a refined and efficient way; but keep an ICE vehicle for fun.
For us replacing our family car Octavia VRS with an EV (which we're in the process of at the moment) was a complete no-brainer; for our use-case it simply does everything better... but my Elise isn't going anywhere.
For us replacing our family car Octavia VRS with an EV (which we're in the process of at the moment) was a complete no-brainer; for our use-case it simply does everything better... but my Elise isn't going anywhere.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 14th August 08:19
eliot said:
I think we are still in the Betamax era of EV’s, namely the battery tech still needs to improve and the charging points (the media) still have a long way to go.
Everyone one wanted one has one, those that didn’t want one but got one anyway because they are cheap on salary sacrifice has one too - and that’s it, the market has levelled in real terms.
This is where we are I think. Everyone one wanted one has one, those that didn’t want one but got one anyway because they are cheap on salary sacrifice has one too - and that’s it, the market has levelled in real terms.
For some people they work very well. We know that because they tell you all the time.
For others they don’t work, or appeal, for a variety of reasons.
I reminds me of the situation with bicycles.
swisstoni said:
I reminds me of the situation with bicycles.
And diesels and petrols, for that matter. Internal combustion never really worked very well for our family car. Ours trips are mostly too long to walk or (conveniently) cycle but too short for an ICE to get properly up to temperature; they also rarely involve passing a petrol station.
While we have the choice of both, with their associated positives and negatives, we should make the most of it.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 14th August 08:30
OP I’m in a similar position to you. I’ve got a cheap ev (eNY1) and to be honest for normal duties it’s fine. When the other half’s is up for change I’ll likely swap to EV for her.
I’ve got a tt roadster for sunny days and it’s good fun, and useful with a periodically returning child from uni, but practically I drive it less than makes sense. I previously had an mg as the 3rd car managed 5k in 10 years in it.
I’ve got a tt roadster for sunny days and it’s good fun, and useful with a periodically returning child from uni, but practically I drive it less than makes sense. I previously had an mg as the 3rd car managed 5k in 10 years in it.
I'd consider a second hand EV if there was one that would cover family needs, including heavy trailer towing, 4WD, good range, and was capable of easy and convenient charging. I'm not aware of such a thing, so will stick with ICE for now.
I'm certainly not against EV's, I think that they suit a lot of people, they're just not capable of meeting what I need right now.
I'm certainly not against EV's, I think that they suit a lot of people, they're just not capable of meeting what I need right now.
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