Why are EVs not the saviour?

[mickythefish]

I saw a news article that VW is now going to spend 60 billion on developing combustion engines. People just don't seem to be buying into the EV dream, is it is the dodgy ethics or just people don't like them?

https://uk.motor1.com/news/722598/volkswagen-inves...

https://www.ft.com/content/cd69126e-2d0c-4766-b033...

[Super Sonic]

Charging facilities.

[Mammasaid]

[mickythefish]

Super Sonic said:

Charging facilities.

Only a year ago VW said they wouldn't be making combustion engines, I just wondered what's changed?

I know electric supercars are struggling.

[Dave200]

IQ levels on this forum are dropping like a stone.

The article you've linked says they are still spending more than 2/3rds of their R&D budget on EVs.

[Blib]

These companies are caught in a trap, between Government legislation and a reluctant customer base which is rightfully unconvinced that the EV ecosystem is the answer to their present needs.

[mickythefish]

Dave200 said:

IQ levels on this forum are dropping like a stone.

The article you've linked says they are still spending more than 2/3rds of their R&D budget on EVs.

Yeh.but last year said they would only develop evs. Was your post ironic?

2023 Volkswagen brand chief Thomas Schäfer said.

"By 2030 we plan that 80 percent of our vehicles sold in Europe are battery electric, so why spend a fortune on old technology that doesn’t really give you any benefit?”

[Olivergt]

mickythefish said:

I saw a news article that VW is now going to spend 60 billion on developing combustion engines. People just don't seem to be buying into the EV dream, is it is the dodgy ethics or just people don't like them?

https://uk.motor1.com/news/722598/volkswagen-inves...

https://www.ft.com/content/cd69126e-2d0c-4766-b033...

And they are spending 120 billion on EV's so twice as much money being invested in EV's

Seems to me that if a Company is willing to invest twice as much in a relatively new area, that they do actually see that as saving the company in the long term.

[Blib]

Olivergt said:

And they are spending 120 billion on EV's so twice as much money being invested in EV's

Seems to me that if a Company is willing to invest twice as much in a relatively new area, that they do actually see that as saving the company in the long term.

If they wish to sell cars in Europe they simply have no choice.

[RazerSauber]

Hard to say but I hear Toyota are doing the same, Mazda still has engines in development, I'm guessing there's a global market for combustion still that EV isn't tapping into? I don't know what the global split is between engines and EV because it only seems to be the major first world countries that are starting to buy them.

[_Hoppers]

mickythefish said:

I saw a news article that VW is now going to spend 60 billion on developing combustion engines. People just don't seem to be buying into the EV dream, is it is the dodgy ethics or just people don't like them?

https://uk.motor1.com/news/722598/volkswagen-inves...

https://www.ft.com/content/cd69126e-2d0c-4766-b033...

But also.........

Volkswagen's $5 bln investment in Rivian boosts EV maker's shares

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportat...

[J4CKO]

You will always find an article to confirm your preference, its amazing how many folk see one and post it to FaceBook or whatever "See, there, I told you it wouldnt work and we are all going back now to lovely Internal Combustion engines, will be like 1983 again, hurrah !".

I have no EV preference, interested in the developments but largely ambivalent to the actual cars in the main.

But, its happening, look out of you window, do you not see any EV's, or are they everywhere now ?

People who then say "Hydrogen is the future, EV's dont work, no infrastructure you see", if you think there is no EV infrastructure, in for a shock when you take a look at the Hydrogen one.

A massive change is never going to be without its challenges and wont happen overnight, but nobody in fifty years will be buying and driving petrol or diesel engine cars, you just cant ignore a three to fourfold increase in efficiency and electric motor brings, if the battery tech had been sorted 100 years ago we wouldnt be having the conversation.

Whether you want it or not doesnt matter, it will happen anyway, there is always the chance of something else coming in from left field but as it stands, future will be, as far as I can tell EV's with improving capabilities and improving infrastructure for personal mobility.

[TheRainMaker]

Dave200 said:

IQ levels on this forum are dropping like a stone.

I guess more people are buying EVs

[DonkeyApple]

mickythefish said:

Yeh.but last year said they would only develop evs. Was your post ironic?

2023 Volkswagen brand chief Thomas Schäfer said.

"By 2030 we plan that 80 percent of our vehicles sold in Europe are battery electric, so why spend a fortune on old technology that doesn’t really give you any benefit?”

What's caught them out is that they assumed the backward little third world people they also sell to and who will be sticking with ICE for many decades wouldn't go and do anything sophisticated like impose clean air legislation on car vendors etc. So VW assumed they'd just be able to keep selling what they've already developed in those markets for decades. Unfortunately, it appears that those simple, third world folks aren't interested in coloured beads and mirrors from the far superior Western people but are weirdly transpiring to be intelligent, educated and wanting better products.

Plus, it's VW. The only time the company tells the truth is by accident. . And they also have change their PR output as the capital markets change so back when every bit of investment capital wanted to ride the EV wave VW just told everyone they were all in on EV. Now capital wants to see a more diverse business, VW have to change from saying they're going all EV to saying they're also not forgetting their ICE business.

Most importantly, what does this mean for us in the U.K.? Arguably very little. We have other reasons to press on with the 20-30 year very slow switch to EV. The eco waffle stuff doesn't really matter, the essential objective is to dislocate the U.K. economy as much as possible from the USD and imported energy so as to stabilise the economy but most critically to remove the oil price cliff edge that hits when super cheap Saudi oil diminishes to the point that it no longer holds the crude price down where it is and the market shifts to its new and permanent much higher price. At which point economies that are non producers but high users are going to face a toxic economic shock that could have been wholly avoided.

[ZesPak]

mickythefish said:

I saw a news article that VW is now going to spend 60 billion on developing combustion engines. People just don't seem to be buying into the EV dream, is it is the dodgy ethics or just people don't like them?

https://uk.motor1.com/news/722598/volkswagen-inves...

https://www.ft.com/content/cd69126e-2d0c-4766-b033...

Oh man, where to start

article said:

It is fair to say that the transition to electric mobility is not going as well as most car manufacturers had imagined.

You mean the car manufacturers that had so much money sunk into ICE development and fought with everything they had to stop the likes of Tesla?

Super Sonic said:

Charging facilities.

Every house with a driveway or a garage is a charging facility, almost every parking lot is a couple of thousand quid away from being one. The electrical infrastructure is there, nearly worldwide. I've traveled the UK and the rest of Europe for the past 5 years and this is no issue whatsoever in central Europe.

Reading the article, they are spending 120 billion to EV development and 60 for ICE. There are definitely vehicles that are yet to be converted. Vans and other LGV's are next. That doesn't mean the EV transformation isn't happening. Anyone with some experience owning both ICE and EV's can see that even now, they can cater to well over 90% of the population in Europe. For many people they will actually be a lot more convenient, for some they will be slightly less so (plug in once a week instead of filling up once a month).

This article is really saying: one of the biggest car companies in the world is spending 2 thirds of his funds into EV's, and some people turn it into: SEE! EV'S ARE DOOMED! Everyone hates them!

[cvega]

This kind of st clickbait is what helped tank EV values, it's a very successful campaign and idiots believe it day in and day out. Mostly those who've never driven an EV too.

[Dave200]

ZesPak said:

This article is really saying: one of the biggest car companies in the world is spending 2 thirds of his funds into EV's, and some people turn it into: SEE! EV'S ARE DOOMED! Everyone hates them!

It's a combination of dense people who struggle with basic literacy and biased people looking for confirmation. Sadly that probably describes about 50% of the population.

[911Spanker]

They catch fire don't they?

In general they are dull cars for dull people.

[mickythefish]

60 billion on dinosaur juice technology does seem odd,hence the
thread. What gets me, is if you say anything negative about EVs you get attacked.

Yes I understand every EV owner don't want their car to become worthless overnight, but there is definitely a massive uncertainty in ev cars future if VW can backtrack so much on a statement.

Edited by mickythefish on Thursday 18th July 12:20

[Dave200]

911Spanker said:

dull cars for dull people.

You've just described 95%+ of car ownership with 5 words.