My first EV Experience
Discussion
I got to Nice airport last week to collect a cheap rental deal I’d found, yeh, that explained it as the woman on the desk said in her French accent “ah the electric”….original deal was £240 odd and this was £140.
So i’d ordered an electric hire car (an MG4), and previously have had no interest in sniffing around them here and was absolutely clueless about what to do. Firstly Europcar needed shooting as we wasted a good hour working out where to go/what to do/power for charging I could go on. Opening the boot to put the case in added to stress, multiple cables also to add taking boot space for cases! The decent thing to do would had been a guide of pamphlet...all they gave me was a poxy Shell account card?!? They also only left 80% charge in it!
The first deadly scilence was even more compounded by the usual worry about getting out of a rental carpark without hearing you scrape along something!
First time charging experience was the next bit of pain....we thought we’d find a Wiiz charger around Juan Les Pins and get some breakfast…that took 20 mins to work out it didn’t work, they had these side of road chargers with no screen on to know what was what….another drive to find another one…yeh not working….drove into antibes….two people in spots charging, I had naivety to think someone might appear in 20 mins….little did I know the chargers were 22KW? Finally got on one in Antibes near Port Vauban….10 hours to full charge….FFS this was absolutely horrendously stressful, no wonder the other blokes waiting had looked to had already smoked 20 galoises hanging out the car waiting.
Carrefour was the eventual answer, they had 22kW, 75kw and 150kw….not sure if I could use the 300KW I went on the bay for the 150kw….Wasn’t working….75kw out of order….22kW it was then while missus went shopping, I get in the bay….big cross by it…NOT Working!
Sat on the 22kw I thought I’d give the 300KW a go briefly….yes that eventually worked getting upto 50kw throughput on this MG4. Better thing about 300KW was they provided the charger.
Drive on the MG4 I thought was really good, quality of build on the car good, the display high quality all worked easily enough, plenty of space enough for us for the week. The car had only done 1000 so time would tell.
My heart sank a bit seeing they’d given us an MG, but it was really better than expected. For something bigger the MG HS looks like a good option and when looking for something on the market next I’m tempted to look at them as an option as they look good for the money and better quality than the Koreanmobiles.
Am I sold on EV? not sure I am just yet, these thing give me doubt
1. The fact the French can't even get charging stations industrialised yet worries me, add to that the issue with a whole nation going electric, this is going to end in disaster and will completely mean a change in travel habits.
2. I did 270 miles in this car, it cost me 50 quid in Charge, a full tank of petrol would be knocking on 70 odd quid I think so it aint that cheap is it?
3. I didn't realise charger types on the cars are all different.....why on earth is there no global standard? bonkers
4. Bits will still go just as wrong as an ICE, e.g. aside the batteries which we all know will likely deteriorate the recharging stuff has got to be on a hiding to nothing, I thought the idea of EV was sustainability.
5. Hire companies will suffer with electric becoming more popular, the MG manual said you should avoid fast charging! I'll be buggered if im using nothing else but fast charging.
Anyway some pictures...my favourite with the Alps in the backgound
So i’d ordered an electric hire car (an MG4), and previously have had no interest in sniffing around them here and was absolutely clueless about what to do. Firstly Europcar needed shooting as we wasted a good hour working out where to go/what to do/power for charging I could go on. Opening the boot to put the case in added to stress, multiple cables also to add taking boot space for cases! The decent thing to do would had been a guide of pamphlet...all they gave me was a poxy Shell account card?!? They also only left 80% charge in it!
The first deadly scilence was even more compounded by the usual worry about getting out of a rental carpark without hearing you scrape along something!
First time charging experience was the next bit of pain....we thought we’d find a Wiiz charger around Juan Les Pins and get some breakfast…that took 20 mins to work out it didn’t work, they had these side of road chargers with no screen on to know what was what….another drive to find another one…yeh not working….drove into antibes….two people in spots charging, I had naivety to think someone might appear in 20 mins….little did I know the chargers were 22KW? Finally got on one in Antibes near Port Vauban….10 hours to full charge….FFS this was absolutely horrendously stressful, no wonder the other blokes waiting had looked to had already smoked 20 galoises hanging out the car waiting.
Carrefour was the eventual answer, they had 22kW, 75kw and 150kw….not sure if I could use the 300KW I went on the bay for the 150kw….Wasn’t working….75kw out of order….22kW it was then while missus went shopping, I get in the bay….big cross by it…NOT Working!
Sat on the 22kw I thought I’d give the 300KW a go briefly….yes that eventually worked getting upto 50kw throughput on this MG4. Better thing about 300KW was they provided the charger.
Drive on the MG4 I thought was really good, quality of build on the car good, the display high quality all worked easily enough, plenty of space enough for us for the week. The car had only done 1000 so time would tell.
My heart sank a bit seeing they’d given us an MG, but it was really better than expected. For something bigger the MG HS looks like a good option and when looking for something on the market next I’m tempted to look at them as an option as they look good for the money and better quality than the Koreanmobiles.
Am I sold on EV? not sure I am just yet, these thing give me doubt
1. The fact the French can't even get charging stations industrialised yet worries me, add to that the issue with a whole nation going electric, this is going to end in disaster and will completely mean a change in travel habits.
2. I did 270 miles in this car, it cost me 50 quid in Charge, a full tank of petrol would be knocking on 70 odd quid I think so it aint that cheap is it?
3. I didn't realise charger types on the cars are all different.....why on earth is there no global standard? bonkers
4. Bits will still go just as wrong as an ICE, e.g. aside the batteries which we all know will likely deteriorate the recharging stuff has got to be on a hiding to nothing, I thought the idea of EV was sustainability.
5. Hire companies will suffer with electric becoming more popular, the MG manual said you should avoid fast charging! I'll be buggered if im using nothing else but fast charging.
Anyway some pictures...my favourite with the Alps in the backgound
I booked a BMW X5 for my tri[p in a couple of weeks. Once confirmed it showed a guaranteed Tesla Model Y. Clearly a bait and switch.
Hertz has sent me several emails on how to charge and where. They also explained that they charge their cars to 80% as that is best for the battery. Not ideal as my first trip will be beyond 80% charge but within 100% charge. The other issue is returning the car with 80% charge. With an ICE, I stop by the petrol station at the airport and 5 minutes later it is full. With the EV I will have to set off an hour earlier. Alternatively, I could pay the £35 charge for them to do it for me.
I am going to ask for the BMW X5 or equivalent when I arrive at the desk. I do not believe an EV is equivalent with any ICE as their purpose , for me, is different.
Hertz has sent me several emails on how to charge and where. They also explained that they charge their cars to 80% as that is best for the battery. Not ideal as my first trip will be beyond 80% charge but within 100% charge. The other issue is returning the car with 80% charge. With an ICE, I stop by the petrol station at the airport and 5 minutes later it is full. With the EV I will have to set off an hour earlier. Alternatively, I could pay the £35 charge for them to do it for me.
I am going to ask for the BMW X5 or equivalent when I arrive at the desk. I do not believe an EV is equivalent with any ICE as their purpose , for me, is different.
h0b0 said:
I booked a BMW X5 for my tri[p in a couple of weeks. Once confirmed it showed a guaranteed Tesla Model Y. Clearly a bait and switch.
Hertz has sent me several emails on how to charge and where. They also explained that they charge their cars to 80% as that is best for the battery. Not ideal as my first trip will be beyond 80% charge but within 100% charge. The other issue is returning the car with 80% charge. With an ICE, I stop by the petrol station at the airport and 5 minutes later it is full. With the EV I will have to set off an hour earlier. Alternatively, I could pay the £35 charge for them to do it for me.
I am going to ask for the BMW X5 or equivalent when I arrive at the desk. I do not believe an EV is equivalent with any ICE as their purpose , for me, is different.
Boom, and that is the issue. Hertz has sent me several emails on how to charge and where. They also explained that they charge their cars to 80% as that is best for the battery. Not ideal as my first trip will be beyond 80% charge but within 100% charge. The other issue is returning the car with 80% charge. With an ICE, I stop by the petrol station at the airport and 5 minutes later it is full. With the EV I will have to set off an hour earlier. Alternatively, I could pay the £35 charge for them to do it for me.
I am going to ask for the BMW X5 or equivalent when I arrive at the desk. I do not believe an EV is equivalent with any ICE as their purpose , for me, is different.
X5 replaced by a Model Y? Well they are luxury right?
[hehe]
But you hit the mark for rental cars. Here in the US, the big fleets are dumping their EV's and they are flooding the market and depressing the price of particular models (mainly Tesla Model 3's). People just werent renting them and it didnt work for them. I have had so many stories of customers requesting something other than a Tesla - not that they are bad cars, but because they just dont fit the use case.
Now, on the other hand, if I had the cash, I would be building charging points at airports and rental centers which charge massive rates. Petrol stations do this here and its price gouging, but why not with charging?
This was reported yesterday…
Hertz Stock Plunges 19% as It Continues to Lose Money on Ill-Fated Tesla EV Plan
Hertz Stock Plunges 19% as It Continues to Lose Money on Ill-Fated Tesla EV Plan
Investopedia said:
Hertz Global Holdings (HTZ) shares cratered after the rental car giant said it will incur an additional $195 million cost from its unsuccessful effort to switch over to electric vehicles (EVs), leading to a huge first quarter loss.
It explains their desperate bait and switch they are trying on me. A Chargepoint or Octoverse card would have made life a lot easier for you.
Tap and go and the app shows where they all are and if it's 7, 11 or 22kW AC or faster DC.
France has loads of open to all Tesla SuC, and there are a fair few around the Cote. Most of these are cheaper than the UK SuCs. There is also an Ionity in Nice.
Tap and go and the app shows where they all are and if it's 7, 11 or 22kW AC or faster DC.
France has loads of open to all Tesla SuC, and there are a fair few around the Cote. Most of these are cheaper than the UK SuCs. There is also an Ionity in Nice.
That experience does sound frustating. Maybe roll out is not equal across France when it comes to chargers?
My only experience is in Northern France last summer with my own EV where finding a rapid charge was dead easy, just pull off the autoroute and head for the petrol station in the services. Seemed to be easier to charge at public stations there than in the UK. I just used the BMW charge card at each charger.
My only experience is in Northern France last summer with my own EV where finding a rapid charge was dead easy, just pull off the autoroute and head for the petrol station in the services. Seemed to be easier to charge at public stations there than in the UK. I just used the BMW charge card at each charger.
raspy said:
That experience does sound frustating. Maybe roll out is not equal across France when it comes to chargers?
My only experience is in Northern France last summer with my own EV where finding a rapid charge was dead easy, just pull off the autoroute and head for the petrol station in the services. Seemed to be easier to charge at public stations there than in the UK. I just used the BMW charge card at each charger.
France seemed to me to be a couple of years ahead for charging. We are certainly catching up.My only experience is in Northern France last summer with my own EV where finding a rapid charge was dead easy, just pull off the autoroute and head for the petrol station in the services. Seemed to be easier to charge at public stations there than in the UK. I just used the BMW charge card at each charger.
Maybe it was just my region (Côte d'Azur).
Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
fourstardan said:
Maybe it was just my region (Côte d'Azur).
Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
Your experience tends to confirm one my thoughts on EV's, namely they're great if you can charge mostly or exclusively at home but not so good if you have to rely on the public charging network. The latter often doesn't seem much cheaper than filling an ICE car and, more significantly, for the moment at least it appears to be nowhere near as convenient.Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
fourstardan said:
That was good from Hertz to allow you to prepare, I probably would had done so myself if knowing I had one, I did however book through an intermediary for the car.
Explains maybe why I had 81% on it, but what's the point of having a battery in the first place.
I don't think car rental places are going to hand you an EV with 100% charged battery. Partly because it's better for long term health of battery to charge it to 80% on a routine basis, and partly because if they are using rapid chargers to charge them between rentals, it saves them time between customers, by charging up to 80%. Explains maybe why I had 81% on it, but what's the point of having a battery in the first place.
I've found on road trips it's quicker to rapid charge back up to 80%, get on with my journey (and charge up to 80% at the next place), rather than spend ages in one location waiting for it to charge really slowly to 100% (it's the 80-100% that takes bloody ages)
I had a Polestar 2 for a weekend from Hertz Gatwick last year when they were doing them for £35/day. The 80% charge thing is standard, and of course you're never going to be able to return it with 100%, however they also said if you return it between 20% and 80% they'll charge you howevermuch per kWH to charge it, which was a lower rate than the fast chargers at motorway services, and seems a much more sensible option than stopping to charge on your way back to the airport.
We had no problems using a fast charger at Tesco a couple of times...except that it took way less time than I expected so I blocked a charging space for longer than I should done, oops. But obviously the fast chargers are way more expensive. Overall I worked it out as the equivalent of about 45mpg, which is probably comparable to a similarly specced ICE car. If Id been able to slow charge it overnight it would have been way cheaper to run, and on a proper home chagring tariff even cheaper.
Nice car to drive and I could quite happily live with one if I had a home charger, but as a rental when you're relying on commercial chargers, definitely more hassle than a petrol.
Hertz seem to have stopped the cheap EV deal though. I've got a petrol Corsa for this weekend, woohoo. Bit of a step down from the 318 Msport I handed back to Sixt last night.
We had no problems using a fast charger at Tesco a couple of times...except that it took way less time than I expected so I blocked a charging space for longer than I should done, oops. But obviously the fast chargers are way more expensive. Overall I worked it out as the equivalent of about 45mpg, which is probably comparable to a similarly specced ICE car. If Id been able to slow charge it overnight it would have been way cheaper to run, and on a proper home chagring tariff even cheaper.
Nice car to drive and I could quite happily live with one if I had a home charger, but as a rental when you're relying on commercial chargers, definitely more hassle than a petrol.
Hertz seem to have stopped the cheap EV deal though. I've got a petrol Corsa for this weekend, woohoo. Bit of a step down from the 318 Msport I handed back to Sixt last night.
JNW1 said:
fourstardan said:
Maybe it was just my region (Côte d'Azur).
Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
Your experience tends to confirm one my thoughts on EV's, namely they're great if you can charge mostly or exclusively at home but not so good if you have to rely on the public charging network. The latter often doesn't seem much cheaper than filling an ICE car and, more significantly, for the moment at least it appears to be nowhere near as convenient.Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
But in reality, if yours, you would get used to the car/nav sorting out the public locations for you.
Home charging far more convenient of course & cheaper if paying for it (my tariff already 8p kwh overnight)
Last weekend I hired a Tesla in the Uk as an experiment (£150 for 3 days, unlimited mileage, incl ‘free’ Tesla charging). First hop, South to the Lake district. It directed me to Rugby to get an hours charge. Said how many chargers were free etc.
Did 900+ miles in 3 days, Lakes/up to Loch Lomond, Derbyshire Peaks on the way back. No problems at all with the free charging.
AyBee said:
A bit like getting a petrol car and not knowing that petrol stations exist. If you have an EV, you know what to look for, where to look for it, and how they work.
Hertz weren't overly helpful in that respect. I was visiting a mate with an EV though and he put me on to ZapMap which worked well, and was giving him a lift the first time I stopped to charge, so explained about the different connector types. It's not complicated but the majority of people who've never driven an EV have got no idea, so some more information about it from Hertz would have been nice. There was some sort of shell keyfob included with the car but no information about it, I don't know if they get some kind of discount with Shell chargers?James6112 said:
JNW1 said:
fourstardan said:
Maybe it was just my region (Côte d'Azur).
Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
Your experience tends to confirm one my thoughts on EV's, namely they're great if you can charge mostly or exclusively at home but not so good if you have to rely on the public charging network. The latter often doesn't seem much cheaper than filling an ICE car and, more significantly, for the moment at least it appears to be nowhere near as convenient.Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
But in reality, if yours, you would get used to the car/nav sorting out the public locations for you.
Home charging far more convenient of course & cheaper if paying for it (my tariff already 8p kwh overnight)
Last weekend I hired a Tesla in the Uk as an experiment (£150 for 3 days, unlimited mileage, incl ‘free’ Tesla charging). First hop, South to the Lake district. It directed me to Rugby to get an hours charge. Said how many chargers were free etc.
Did 900+ miles in 3 days, Lakes/up to Loch Lomond, Derbyshire Peaks on the way back. No problems at all with the free charging.
But different entirely if all or the vast majority of your charging can be done at home and you only seldom need to use the public charging network (if ever); in that scenario I accept an EV is both more convenient and cheaper to run.
JNW1 said:
James6112 said:
JNW1 said:
fourstardan said:
Maybe it was just my region (Côte d'Azur).
Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
Your experience tends to confirm one my thoughts on EV's, namely they're great if you can charge mostly or exclusively at home but not so good if you have to rely on the public charging network. The latter often doesn't seem much cheaper than filling an ICE car and, more significantly, for the moment at least it appears to be nowhere near as convenient.Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
But in reality, if yours, you would get used to the car/nav sorting out the public locations for you.
Home charging far more convenient of course & cheaper if paying for it (my tariff already 8p kwh overnight)
Last weekend I hired a Tesla in the Uk as an experiment (£150 for 3 days, unlimited mileage, incl ‘free’ Tesla charging). First hop, South to the Lake district. It directed me to Rugby to get an hours charge. Said how many chargers were free etc.
Did 900+ miles in 3 days, Lakes/up to Loch Lomond, Derbyshire Peaks on the way back. No problems at all with the free charging.
But different entirely if all or the vast majority of your charging can be done at home and you only seldom need to use the public charging network (if ever); in that scenario I accept an EV is both more convenient and cheaper to run.
Was a good test, in reality i’d rarely use public charging, but was good to check it out as included in the hire
James6112 said:
JNW1 said:
James6112 said:
JNW1 said:
fourstardan said:
Maybe it was just my region (Côte d'Azur).
Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
Your experience tends to confirm one my thoughts on EV's, namely they're great if you can charge mostly or exclusively at home but not so good if you have to rely on the public charging network. The latter often doesn't seem much cheaper than filling an ICE car and, more significantly, for the moment at least it appears to be nowhere near as convenient.Wiiiz chargers didn't seem to connect to the chargers when I setup the account. They were also in some very awkward places to park but thats just French way of life in big towns/cities (which I love btw).
Carrefour had enough to enable charging, the one I used was in Antibes, the closest was Frejus.
Time is valuable on holiday so I'll probably steer away from EV next time if it's cheaper.
But in reality, if yours, you would get used to the car/nav sorting out the public locations for you.
Home charging far more convenient of course & cheaper if paying for it (my tariff already 8p kwh overnight)
Last weekend I hired a Tesla in the Uk as an experiment (£150 for 3 days, unlimited mileage, incl ‘free’ Tesla charging). First hop, South to the Lake district. It directed me to Rugby to get an hours charge. Said how many chargers were free etc.
Did 900+ miles in 3 days, Lakes/up to Loch Lomond, Derbyshire Peaks on the way back. No problems at all with the free charging.
But different entirely if all or the vast majority of your charging can be done at home and you only seldom need to use the public charging network (if ever); in that scenario I accept an EV is both more convenient and cheaper to run.
Was a good test, in reality i’d rarely use public charging, but was good to check it out as included in the hire
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